Hi,
I am a regular on the tube side of this forum. Eventually, i had to end up here.
I made a BIG tube amp, capable of about 75 pure tube watts.
Now i have been captured by the tl for a long time. And built a tl sub. (i had a small aiwa sub lying around. Ripped it apart and made a tl enclosure for it. No measurements done, but it sure sounds about 20 fold better)
Now i am thinking of making a tl for my amp.
First of all: does that make a good match? It is a 0 feedback penthode pushpull amp (might add some feedback later).
Now i have two designs i like: The peerless flatline and the optimo by tony gee.
The peerless is cheap. dirt cheap. but about my maximum budget.
The optimo is expensive. So i would definitely have to change the drivers for that.
Does anybody know of better cheap designs? Woodworking and stuff is no problem.
I would like to minimize components. I just don't like complicated crossovers. Two way seems the only plausible solution.
The music i like to listen is strong and dynamic. Lots of rock.
Help is greatly appreciated!
Bas
I am a regular on the tube side of this forum. Eventually, i had to end up here.
I made a BIG tube amp, capable of about 75 pure tube watts.
Now i have been captured by the tl for a long time. And built a tl sub. (i had a small aiwa sub lying around. Ripped it apart and made a tl enclosure for it. No measurements done, but it sure sounds about 20 fold better)
Now i am thinking of making a tl for my amp.
First of all: does that make a good match? It is a 0 feedback penthode pushpull amp (might add some feedback later).
Now i have two designs i like: The peerless flatline and the optimo by tony gee.
The peerless is cheap. dirt cheap. but about my maximum budget.
The optimo is expensive. So i would definitely have to change the drivers for that.
Does anybody know of better cheap designs? Woodworking and stuff is no problem.
I would like to minimize components. I just don't like complicated crossovers. Two way seems the only plausible solution.
The music i like to listen is strong and dynamic. Lots of rock.
Help is greatly appreciated!
Bas
p13 daline
the tweeter on this one is unknown but it seems the p13 is well suited to 1st order xo so you could probably work that one out easily enough.
the tweeter on this one is unknown but it seems the p13 is well suited to 1st order xo so you could probably work that one out easily enough.
one more
martin king fostex 206
this would probably suit your budget. Really efficient too.
One of these days i want to try this one myself
edit: hmm, just reread your post. Im not sure if this is a good rock speaker. If it interests you maybe you could solicit some more opinions.
martin king fostex 206
this would probably suit your budget. Really efficient too.
One of these days i want to try this one myself
edit: hmm, just reread your post. Im not sure if this is a good rock speaker. If it interests you maybe you could solicit some more opinions.
db717tl:
Cool project. But somehow i don't see how two bass drivers, being at fifferent phases in the tl could produce detailed bass.
I like simple....
Peerless pipes:
good option. However, i would go for a constant crosssection pipe...
A/v3:
same as db717tl...
the daline: cool! But still. i wouldn't know how to pick drivers!
I know the fostex thing. Lots of fostex fans on the web. But i don't think i will enjoy a single driver unit.
I allso have seen the t-line speaker site. I made my calculations on the sub using those equations.
I like the monacor idea....
Some other thing that wondered me: All blh designs have such small horns! I can't find any cool two way designs with BIG bass horns
Yhanks for all those plans!
bas
Cool project. But somehow i don't see how two bass drivers, being at fifferent phases in the tl could produce detailed bass.
I like simple....
Peerless pipes:
good option. However, i would go for a constant crosssection pipe...
A/v3:
same as db717tl...
the daline: cool! But still. i wouldn't know how to pick drivers!
I know the fostex thing. Lots of fostex fans on the web. But i don't think i will enjoy a single driver unit.
I allso have seen the t-line speaker site. I made my calculations on the sub using those equations.
I like the monacor idea....
Some other thing that wondered me: All blh designs have such small horns! I can't find any cool two way designs with BIG bass horns
Yhanks for all those plans!
bas
beamnet said:
http://www.speakerbuilding.com/content/1015/esq_cros.gif
this might work.
you could search this forum for the diyaudio reference project with the same drivers as the link. If i remember correctly it has no crossover. Or a 1st order. Cant remember.
the daline uses the p13 but an unknown tweeter. You said you wouldn't know how to choose the drivers. I think you could use the p13 and the d27 in the daline successfully. I vaguely remember someone commenting that the dalines sounded nice.
Im just throwing ideas out there for you. I cant say for sure that this is going to be a great speaker, but if i was looking to build a speaker like you are thinking of, id be comfortable with the gamble. Besides, the p13 is a legendary driver so its not like you wouldn't be able to find numerous other projects to use it in.
Personally, Id build the gr reasearch av3 kit, partly to save complication, or something with the dayton rs drivers, as i have never heard any complaints about mtm transmission lines. In fact some of the very best diy speakers, such as the seas thor, use this configuration. But of course the shipping in your case would be a killer.
Id love to find a design with the peerless 850488 in a TL but i dont know of any.
Maybe try asking at HTguide.com. There are great designers there who champion the dayton rs drivers. Maybe they could suggest a TL with a single rs woofer. Those drivers have got to be the best buy going right now. Maybe even worth the shipping cost. The projects to try with a rs180 are endless. Very popular driver.
Whatever you decide good luck.
Im just throwing ideas out there for you. I cant say for sure that this is going to be a great speaker, but if i was looking to build a speaker like you are thinking of, id be comfortable with the gamble. Besides, the p13 is a legendary driver so its not like you wouldn't be able to find numerous other projects to use it in.
Personally, Id build the gr reasearch av3 kit, partly to save complication, or something with the dayton rs drivers, as i have never heard any complaints about mtm transmission lines. In fact some of the very best diy speakers, such as the seas thor, use this configuration. But of course the shipping in your case would be a killer.
Id love to find a design with the peerless 850488 in a TL but i dont know of any.
Maybe try asking at HTguide.com. There are great designers there who champion the dayton rs drivers. Maybe they could suggest a TL with a single rs woofer. Those drivers have got to be the best buy going right now. Maybe even worth the shipping cost. The projects to try with a rs180 are endless. Very popular driver.
Whatever you decide good luck.
If want something "good for the money" get yourself the Gradient W160AL8 driver. I built a TL with it and like it very much.
Doesn´t work as a fullranger though as "advertised" by Klang+Ton.
I mated it with a Tangband but would use a Veravox3 or tweeter if I should modify it in the future.
But see here:
Gradient TL
Hifi-Selbstbau projects
Doesn´t work as a fullranger though as "advertised" by Klang+Ton.
I mated it with a Tangband but would use a Veravox3 or tweeter if I should modify it in the future.
But see here:
Gradient TL
Hifi-Selbstbau projects
Maybe a good point to resumate what we're at
There are some good driver combo's suggested.
The tl-calculations are no problem. I can design my speaker.
I am, hower, a nono on the xo part.
i REALLY like the 1 cap xo (if you made your own am, paistakingly choosing as little components in the signal path, you DONT want 50 components in your xo!)
I am currently bidding on a viva xt25 tweeter, ad that seems a good one 4 sure. And i like the looks!
Can anybody tell me more how to handele the xo part?
Bas
(i don't mind having to build a few prototypes bfore the actual line length is decided)
There are some good driver combo's suggested.
The tl-calculations are no problem. I can design my speaker.
I am, hower, a nono on the xo part.
i REALLY like the 1 cap xo (if you made your own am, paistakingly choosing as little components in the signal path, you DONT want 50 components in your xo!)
I am currently bidding on a viva xt25 tweeter, ad that seems a good one 4 sure. And i like the looks!
Can anybody tell me more how to handele the xo part?
Bas
(i don't mind having to build a few prototypes bfore the actual line length is decided)
Zaph measured it so check his web www.zaphaudio.com
1st order crossover depends on drivers you choose. It is definitely possible to make a 1st order on XT25, question is will that be best xo for that tweeter? Distortion is pretty high below 1kHz. Hmmm. I cannot swear that a 4.7uF cap will be enough to get best of it.
You should ask someone who worked with it. If i have to judge by numbers I would stay away from XT25 if first order is a must.
Seas 27TDFC seems much better for that purpose. It is even cheaper. Also a noferro version (27TDC) seems nice
1st order crossover depends on drivers you choose. It is definitely possible to make a 1st order on XT25, question is will that be best xo for that tweeter? Distortion is pretty high below 1kHz. Hmmm. I cannot swear that a 4.7uF cap will be enough to get best of it.
You should ask someone who worked with it. If i have to judge by numbers I would stay away from XT25 if first order is a must.
Seas 27TDFC seems much better for that purpose. It is even cheaper. Also a noferro version (27TDC) seems nice
if i wouls want to look for a first order filtered tl. what should i look for in tweeter and bass speaker. I can do my own research, but i would have to know what to look for.
For that vifa tweeter: currently, the bid is $1. I think that's quite a bit of mass in the equation. Could it be mated with that peerless driver mentioned before (the HDS - 134 / 850488)
I like the peerless, because it is like the one in the flatline i mentioned at the strat of this topic.
This might meand a bit more components in the crossover, but i the component count stays below, say, 5 or so, that's okay with me, but i sometimes see xo's with 10+ in it.
For that vifa tweeter: currently, the bid is $1. I think that's quite a bit of mass in the equation. Could it be mated with that peerless driver mentioned before (the HDS - 134 / 850488)
I like the peerless, because it is like the one in the flatline i mentioned at the strat of this topic.
This might meand a bit more components in the crossover, but i the component count stays below, say, 5 or so, that's okay with me, but i sometimes see xo's with 10+ in it.
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