Hello all
So I know there are a zillion of topics about it but all being very specific and different from the one i aim to do, I am posting this thread. This time I dont want to go for a cheap option but more mid prices (budget 300 to 500). I have few issues I would need help with, which are as follow:
1 drivers:
I picked them according to qts, frequency range, fs and overall sizes and if i had the choice, design.
- 2 x DS-115-8 Dayton or DA-115 both 4"
- 2 x HiVi b3s midrange 3"
- 2 x Goldwood GT510 1"
2 cabinet
Horizontally stacked design with separate enclosures for bass of 25mm baltic birch plywood or maple
Size: h: 35cms L: 50 W:35
3 radiators
2 x 3" woox radiators
4 amplifier
1 x tda7492 upgrade to 2.1 later with a 4 output amp from Sure. Will bridge 2 channels with a xo to create a subwoofer channel
5 crossovers
Chinese stuff for peanuts according to answers here.
6 power and electronic
1 x dual VU meter
1 x UPS system with 12v witb 7000 mAh
1 x phone dock (optional)
1 x bluetooth receiver with usb and sd card
1 x battery charge meter
1 x odroid board (optional)
The problems/questions i have are:
If i dont align the speakers putting high and low together on each sides and mids in the center, will it have a big impact on the sound quality ?
Do i need to enclose the mids?
Can i enclose the bass into a sealed box with radiatore pushing out into a flat tunnel towards the side leaving the mids and high in the rest of the box in br?or ported?
Will it need bracing?
Is the volume enough?
Fastening using the factory screw holes or a pointy thingy pressing the driver against the bafflee
Thank you all for your help
I got more but it will come as i buid. I am not a full on noob I actually build speakers for over 10 years but passive and i just dumbly followed schematics and never bother with doing the engineering and all i self engineered i got super lucky it sounded decent (when it did... which wasnt too often)
Also, anyone knows a free program to mske a 3d model? Preferably pn Linux
So I know there are a zillion of topics about it but all being very specific and different from the one i aim to do, I am posting this thread. This time I dont want to go for a cheap option but more mid prices (budget 300 to 500). I have few issues I would need help with, which are as follow:
1 drivers:
I picked them according to qts, frequency range, fs and overall sizes and if i had the choice, design.
- 2 x DS-115-8 Dayton or DA-115 both 4"
- 2 x HiVi b3s midrange 3"
- 2 x Goldwood GT510 1"
2 cabinet
Horizontally stacked design with separate enclosures for bass of 25mm baltic birch plywood or maple
Size: h: 35cms L: 50 W:35
3 radiators
2 x 3" woox radiators
4 amplifier
1 x tda7492 upgrade to 2.1 later with a 4 output amp from Sure. Will bridge 2 channels with a xo to create a subwoofer channel
5 crossovers
Chinese stuff for peanuts according to answers here.
6 power and electronic
1 x dual VU meter
1 x UPS system with 12v witb 7000 mAh
1 x phone dock (optional)
1 x bluetooth receiver with usb and sd card
1 x battery charge meter
1 x odroid board (optional)
The problems/questions i have are:
If i dont align the speakers putting high and low together on each sides and mids in the center, will it have a big impact on the sound quality ?
Do i need to enclose the mids?
Can i enclose the bass into a sealed box with radiatore pushing out into a flat tunnel towards the side leaving the mids and high in the rest of the box in br?or ported?
Will it need bracing?
Is the volume enough?
Fastening using the factory screw holes or a pointy thingy pressing the driver against the bafflee
Thank you all for your help
I got more but it will come as i buid. I am not a full on noob I actually build speakers for over 10 years but passive and i just dumbly followed schematics and never bother with doing the engineering and all i self engineered i got super lucky it sounded decent (when it did... which wasnt too often)
Also, anyone knows a free program to mske a 3d model? Preferably pn Linux
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Designing a loudspeaker has quite a steep learning curve. Maybe you can start with a set of secondhand hi-fi (if you want sound quality) of PA (if it must be loud) speakers, so you do not have to worry about selecting drivers and designing a crossover yet. There will still be enough challenges for this project. Build a prototype, try what happens if you make certain design decisions like not using bracing, not aligning the drivers, using thick wood etc. That will give you insight in what happens and it will be fun! Once you figured that out, you can build a second version using the knowledge you obtained.
right - i like how people love to discourage for some obscure reasons... and also think of themselves so much that they assume they know everything to the point they even know your skillset based on 1 post... that has no been read entirely... (so based on nothing - dont know what happened in your life but the geek/nerd attitude is ish...overall that this is not the first time you are doing this - i havent read one recent post from you that was encouraging or even helping anyone...time to get L....D maybe??? 
). I am not a noob, I have little experience already (mostly passive speakers for sound system - see 465 crew and les bretons for references) and I am a former engineer (electro/electric) but haven't done anything in years and I also dont have space at the moment for woodwork so i get it done - i must be sure 100% before bringing the blueprints and some confirmations on some other things (real vs theory is always a titan fight). so I will try to be more specific:
bracing needed? using a stacked up design shouldnt need it but as the size is bigger than bookshelf blocks I have a doubt (even though i should be correct about not needing it - the built-in chambers should act as bracing already anyways accoridng to sims)
aligning the speakers? - it works fine in home cinema and soundsystems, but they are separated and can be orientated according to space and so on and are crossover-ed properly - this time everything is on the same box, all front facing and cant be orientated - again, I have some doubts about the rendering and some frequencies eating each others
enclosing the mids? - fairly straight forward, when fitted in such a big box along with all other drivers it might need to be but again I have doubts (im fine if cabinets are separeted but this time is not the case)
enclosing the bass adding radiators? well yes i am basing myself on a old bookshelf design i built a while back and sounded great (one of the rare i bothered actually work on) for crappy recycled parts andtiny drivers
volume? well that got answered - i cant use 6" as i want to have everything facing front though - might swap the 4 for 5" at best
fastening? i always used the spike to press the drivers against the baffle even for giant cones! (12" and above) and never had issues and it was somehow reducing the vibrations (back then i was testing in super weird way so that could be off) but this time i am restrained by the size and how to do the woodwork to have a plate behind the speakers to put one.
Of course the first will be a test and a base for future boxes but if i go according to some of you i should just give up?? (with that ambition.... you never go forward...). If i wanted to hear that i would have just ask my parents! unless those people can provide the whole amount in one go to me? (now i go bits per bits allowing me to not having to eat rice for 6 months - plus I dont want to buy on the market I want to build it!)
All sims and calculations on the paper look fine but we all know the gap between paper and reality - hence me being here - if you got nothing to help dont bother simple! (but thank you for taking time to read and leave a comment - always appreciated in a way) I will be delighted to show the final product and build log as i go and i do hope for you that i fail like this it might brighten up a bit your life (seeing how negative you are i think it will be much needed huh?) but if it comes out the way i want to...
@PeteMcK: after calculations I decided to go for a 500-5000 (or a 800-4700 will also do depending on what i can find) - feel free to correct me
@ewollowe: I have seen plenty of boomboxes and built a mini-boominator already for fun (and recover my building skills) but again this is not fitting what i would like to achieve. When you invent something you dont go copy something different - it doesnt make sense does it? ^^
@TBTL: yes I hear what you say and I was really tempted to so this but I have nothing left for second hands parts and getting them would have cost me the same I already done calculations as said above but again the difference between theory and practice... anyways the first one will be a test and i will tweak accordingly of course
so whoever just arrived, please read entirely, comment, help but if you have nothing to bring to the project DIYA (yes I will name it after the site and will credit all of you helping - and who knows if it get big you all get a share!! haha *dreaming*) then please don't bother - im here for fun and hobby, not to be brought down - that is reserved for work place or my parents!
). I am not a noob, I have little experience already (mostly passive speakers for sound system - see 465 crew and les bretons for references) and I am a former engineer (electro/electric) but haven't done anything in years and I also dont have space at the moment for woodwork so i get it done - i must be sure 100% before bringing the blueprints and some confirmations on some other things (real vs theory is always a titan fight). so I will try to be more specific:bracing needed? using a stacked up design shouldnt need it but as the size is bigger than bookshelf blocks I have a doubt (even though i should be correct about not needing it - the built-in chambers should act as bracing already anyways accoridng to sims)
aligning the speakers? - it works fine in home cinema and soundsystems, but they are separated and can be orientated according to space and so on and are crossover-ed properly - this time everything is on the same box, all front facing and cant be orientated - again, I have some doubts about the rendering and some frequencies eating each others
enclosing the mids? - fairly straight forward, when fitted in such a big box along with all other drivers it might need to be but again I have doubts (im fine if cabinets are separeted but this time is not the case)
enclosing the bass adding radiators? well yes i am basing myself on a old bookshelf design i built a while back and sounded great (one of the rare i bothered actually work on) for crappy recycled parts andtiny drivers
volume? well that got answered - i cant use 6" as i want to have everything facing front though - might swap the 4 for 5" at best
fastening? i always used the spike to press the drivers against the baffle even for giant cones! (12" and above) and never had issues and it was somehow reducing the vibrations (back then i was testing in super weird way so that could be off) but this time i am restrained by the size and how to do the woodwork to have a plate behind the speakers to put one.
Of course the first will be a test and a base for future boxes but if i go according to some of you i should just give up?? (with that ambition.... you never go forward...). If i wanted to hear that i would have just ask my parents! unless those people can provide the whole amount in one go to me? (now i go bits per bits allowing me to not having to eat rice for 6 months - plus I dont want to buy on the market I want to build it!)
All sims and calculations on the paper look fine but we all know the gap between paper and reality - hence me being here - if you got nothing to help dont bother
simple! (but thank you for taking time to read and leave a comment - always appreciated in a way) I will be delighted to show the final product and build log as i go and i do hope for you that i fail like this it might brighten up a bit your life (seeing how negative you are i think it will be much needed huh?) but if it comes out the way i want to... @PeteMcK: after calculations I decided to go for a 500-5000 (or a 800-4700 will also do depending on what i can find) - feel free to correct me
@ewollowe: I have seen plenty of boomboxes and built a mini-boominator already for fun (and recover my building skills) but again this is not fitting what i would like to achieve. When you invent something you dont go copy something different - it doesnt make sense does it? ^^
@TBTL: yes I hear what you say and I was really tempted to so this but I have nothing left for second hands parts and getting them would have cost me the same
I already done calculations as said above but again the difference between theory and practice... anyways the first one will be a test and i will tweak accordingly of course so whoever just arrived, please read entirely, comment, help but if you have nothing to bring to the project DIYA (yes I will name it after the site and will credit all of you helping - and who knows if it get big you all get a share!! haha *dreaming*) then please don't bother - im here for fun and hobby, not to be brought down - that is reserved for work place or my parents!
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Sigh,
Dear Famax (Fellow Irishman), we're not trying to bring you down, we're trying to help. The questions you asked in your first post raised a few alarm bells (that's probably why Sreten said what he did)
This hobby gets complicated very quickly once you start to really scratch the surface.
Anyway.
Have you made any sketches of how you'd like it to look? Does it HAVE to look a certain way? Pics would be nice.
Do you want maximum sound quality? Or battery life? Or loudness? or bass extension?
Why are you hung up on making it a 3 way and all the extra complication that involves?
As to some of your questions;
Enclosing the mids is a good idea, so is bracing unless it rock solid already. Have you used winISD to calculate driver volume?
Driver alignment is important but is usually calculated taking into account a fixed seated listening position, if this boom box is going to be placed hither and tither and people are going to be standing all over the shop it's not really very relevant.
I'm just firing off the cuff here mate. PM me if you want.
Dear Famax (Fellow Irishman), we're not trying to bring you down, we're trying to help. The questions you asked in your first post raised a few alarm bells (that's probably why Sreten said what he did)
This hobby gets complicated very quickly once you start to really scratch the surface.
Anyway.
Have you made any sketches of how you'd like it to look? Does it HAVE to look a certain way? Pics would be nice.
Do you want maximum sound quality? Or battery life? Or loudness? or bass extension?
Why are you hung up on making it a 3 way and all the extra complication that involves?
As to some of your questions;
Enclosing the mids is a good idea, so is bracing unless it rock solid already. Have you used winISD to calculate driver volume?
Driver alignment is important but is usually calculated taking into account a fixed seated listening position, if this boom box is going to be placed hither and tither and people are going to be standing all over the shop it's not really very relevant.
I'm just firing off the cuff here mate. PM me if you want.
Naaah, why ? He's quite resoluted in the beginning, about making dual boxes for the wf's and to spend considerably much to make something good.
AT the end of the post you'll see quite a dubious mind...but that's oK -maybe we don't share our doubts in public.
I'd use thick PVC ( the one underneath our cities for gas transport, so high atmosphere
) and cut three discs.Maybe you can use little ones ( size of a beer can ) to accomodate the mids
and put them in the space between ( the circles ). Same for the tweeters.
The central enclosure would house the electronics and the battery.
So, it would be all active ?
Maybe you can...but, uh !
Ah, I see
Ah, the numbers are the "tab" ones, sorry.
So it's passive
I'd say a bigger passive radiator ( if needed )
But, why ? If it's for outside just leave it for the future, I mean, you'll need power and membranes.
For the woofer, just search for the highest score one: low Z, high Xmax, tight cone ( no paper ), and powerful ( VC diameter counts ).
Those are high X-max, right ?
So you can try at first with 1st order high pass!
Or you can choose a driver that fits better - I'm not saying the Seas 10 F but...
The tweeter I don't know---WHY ?
Wouldn't a little better tweeter provide for better sound ?
I'd say some Waveguide ( horn ) loaded tw's.
Yesterday I tried some old Pioneer tweeters all cast in metal with phase plug and horn and they work just fiiiiiine
hence the developed question afterwards - which give clearer details on what i have doubts about - again, theory and practice are different - first thing i learned in life!!!
I know it gets complicated, like all hobbies unless you are a collector (stamps dont need much skills do they? ) and as i said i have already a little experience.
Now to your questions:
Yes it has to look a certain way, design matters in this case or i wouldnt be having doubts and problems (id have just shove everything into a panel mounted box and off i go! like i did recycling old sony speakers back in the days - sound was ish though)
i have hand made sketches yes but i always thought it wouldnt be enough to post here - can post them anyways if that could help.battery life + bass is the core of this project (well sound quality as much as possible). I dont mind it being super loud but decent enough to be taken outside
3 way is mandatory, why? Because i can not find anywhere something like this decent and i really want the bass well separated from the rest for dispersion purpose (i am planning on having the radiators pushing toward the sides which should fill a room more easily and give some sort of surround effect but once in portable mode it will be covered and everything will go on the front - nothing of this on the market so far)-but at first glance, besides how to fit it all i didnt find any major "no go" arguments to not do it (though latter models might be only 2 way if this doesnt work well after test and tweak)
Enclosing the mids - ok so is confirming my initial thoughts - which is great because I spend a good bit of time trying to find a way to enclose them
- bracing, then might be a challenge, maybe i will just post these drawing i made so you get a better idea. Oh wait, i found the other day some guy who made same woodwork that i want to achieve - see below - design will be extremely similar https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoxxPqpRut8
no metal plates bigger and 3 way (not 2.1) and will be wrapped in leather cover but same way to stack the wood. I believe it should be sturdy enough but again - doubts - I am not sure which program I used i do not own any of them - i use a friend's suite (who got me on here - he said it was the best place to ask questions and have answers - Obrigado Joao ^^ ) because I want to invest little by little rather than have to sell my bike!
Drivers alignment - ok so no it doesnt matter
I will still have a full sound if i am facing it (for example in front of the tv as a home system) and the tunnels (they would kind of act as K-tubes) pushing the bass on the side should fill the room as I intend it to do.Helping is answering questions, not come up with snazzy stuff and bring down people - (if the questions seems weird then say it, get clarifications and then maybe have a judgement but you know... only wicked babylonians judge others - do not judge or you shall be judged!) that's the core value of forums (i am very active on some forums for web dev which is my actual job - and these kind of things just get under my skin - what is the point to be on here if you will not answer anything - not the first time that something like this happens)
Meanwhile, thank you for your answers! see it helped much more than "dont do it you are too dumb"
and sorry for having some ambition, but is not by lacking of it that things will go forward...
Naaah, why ? He's quite resoluted in the beginning, about making dual boxes for the wf's and to spend considerably much to make something good.
AT the end of the post you'll see quite a dubious mind...but that's oK -maybe we don't share our doubts in public.
I'd use thick PVC ( the one underneath our cities for gas transport, so high atmosphere
Maybe you can use little ones ( size of a beer can ) to accomodate the mids
and put them in the space between ( the circles ). Same for the tweeters.
The central enclosure would house the electronics and the battery.
So, it would be all active ?
Maybe you can...but, uh !
Ah, I see
thats the spirit i am in right now!! thank you
i will try that pvc business - i was so far working with recycled ports tubes ^^ I am not sure i understand how you want me to do it though
it would be all active yes (asssuming you mean active as in monitors - with amp in the box) - would that be an issue?
"5 corssovers" i dont mean i will use 5 of them - just 2 sorry for the confusing line there
and thank a lot for the tips!! Ah, the numbers are the "tab" ones, sorry.
So it's passive
I'd say a bigger passive radiator ( if needed )
But, why ? If it's for outside just leave it for the future, I mean, you'll need power and membranes.
For the woofer, just search for the highest score one: low Z, high Xmax, tight cone ( no paper ), and powerful ( VC diameter counts ).
Those are high X-max, right ?
So you can try at first with 1st order high pass!
Or you can choose a driver that fits better - I'm not saying the Seas 10 F but...
The tweeter I don't know---WHY ?
Wouldn't a little better tweeter provide for better sound ?
I'd say some Waveguide ( horn ) loaded tw's.
Yesterday I tried some old Pioneer tweeters all cast in metal with phase plug and horn and they work just fiiiiiine
damn i refreshed and is all gone - lets do that again:
radiators have to be at least 3" for a 4" driver and can be bigger yes - i have like about 5" of surface i can use for it i can then redo the tunnel is no biggy
woofers - so you would recommend the DA aluminium over the DS coated paper
HiVi - yes their xmax is quiet high - took these because i need to have 3" max and at time of purcahse that was the best to find. If seas or dayton have 3" jewels id be up for it (oh and also can deliver in the backyard of the planet butthole... even crows fly upside down here to dont see the misery...)
these are some info about the ones i wanted to purchase:
Model A-400
Crossover Frequency: 800Hz, 4800H
power : 180W
impedance: 4-8Ω
Circuit filter characteristics: bass 12db/oct mediant 6db/oct treble 12db/oct
but is not definite as i might be wrong on the calculations
tweeters: best flat top 1" icould find at the time - as i fasten everything from inside anything but a flat top would create air holes
waveguide is a no go - too big (but would be so much better i know
)thank you for all that - i will f**k up at first anyways and will upgrade accordingly i think
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Here's a sketch; quite 
I'd make the cut angulated; the mid and the tw stay outside, the mid being above the tw, or it can change. I'd keep the mid quite free, I guess some 15/22 uF alone would suit for high-pass . The tweeter it could have a smaller faceplate to keep "transparency" in front of the woofer.
Or make it definitively active from the beginning and run the woofers stereo but with electronic filter at around 2-300 Hz .
( oh sorry! I didn't mean to say that ...! I was thinking about the lowpass... )
The tweeter would benefit from a 3rd order HP
( the Hi-vi as a mid could be crossed rather high )
etc
etc
I'd make the cut angulated; the mid and the tw stay outside, the mid being above the tw, or it can change. I'd keep the mid quite free, I guess some 15/22 uF alone would suit for high-pass . The tweeter it could have a smaller faceplate to keep "transparency" in front of the woofer
.Or make it definitively active from the beginning and run the woofers stereo but with electronic filter at around 2-300 Hz .
( oh sorry! I didn't mean to say that ...! I was thinking about the lowpass... )
The tweeter would benefit from a 3rd order HP
( the Hi-vi as a mid could be crossed rather high )
etc
etc
Attachments
I see what you did there for the design i work toward this:
https://youtu.be/CoxxPqpRut8
But without the sub and metal plates on the side but the stacked woodwork is exactly how i will proceed and is the same rectangular design.
for the design i work toward this:https://youtu.be/CoxxPqpRut8
But without the sub and metal plates on the side but the stacked woodwork is exactly how i will proceed and is the same rectangular design.
I remember my first Diy efforts, ended in some TDA 2005 and 5 band EQ in a box with a speaker, plus a 2 fet amp for pick up...
Or a 2 way with 1 cm MDF and philips speakers, powered by a car radio/cassette.
Well, I never dealt deeply into crossovers in the first 10 years of my "hobby", and the 10 years to follow X-O's were still rather obscure - Still when I met the Forum my knowledge was so and so ...now I understand a little but I have to see the loudspeaker associated with to comprehend better
Now, for the boombox ...
You wish to make a boombox, in reality sort of a mini/midi compact.
A portable hi-fi mini system.
The problem is...
1-....2-.....etc.
Or a 2 way with 1 cm MDF and philips speakers, powered by a car radio/cassette.
Well, I never dealt deeply into crossovers in the first 10 years of my "hobby", and the 10 years to follow X-O's were still rather obscure - Still when I met the Forum my knowledge was so and so ...now I understand a little but I have to see the loudspeaker associated with to comprehend better
Now, for the boombox ...
You wish to make a boombox, in reality sort of a mini/midi compact.
A portable hi-fi mini system.
The problem is...
1-....2-.....etc.
So few years on and I built fee poc. Doing a final finished product this summer and will measure everything with a mic and post it. I kept the same drivers more or less except that i switched the tweets for AMT as they sound clearer than domes and done a ported box for the bass. I tried different drivers but sourcing anything is so nightmarish that is better I just work hard on making what i can get sound best possible. I did lose a lot of my maths etc so i had to redo a lot of things but c'est la vie.. anyone living in the Netherlands?
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