Hi all,
I'm new to headphones, but very interested as I do most of my listening at night when everyone in the house is asleep and I have to keep the volume quite low. I'm missing the quiet parts of the music...
I've bought a LittleDot MK III as an inexpensive way to play with tube rolling before I make a big $ commitment to a DIY tube headphone amp (no idea yet what it might be, not that far along). I've also build an O2. Those will be my first two headphone amps. I also use them as pre amps for my ACA.
I listen to a wide variety of music, but with an emphasis on jazz. I'm a "Mids guy."
I think I see a pair of ZMF Auteur headphones in my future... fairly neutral with a warm tilt, characteristic open back wider sound stage...
But alas, not just yet, so I'm considering a pair of Meze 99 Classics to buy me time. For a lot less money, I think I could be happy with them as a closed back option for the long term.
My only reservation - they are quite bass-heavy since the new (more comfortable, thicker) pads were added.
And that brings me to the point of the thread - headphone EQ. Given my preferences as stated above, can someone suggest any EQ options that I may want to be familiar with before purchasing?
I may pick up a pair or two of alternate pads as well, but want to be familiar with all the options before I spend.
Thanks for any experience, suggestions, or information!
I'm new to headphones, but very interested as I do most of my listening at night when everyone in the house is asleep and I have to keep the volume quite low. I'm missing the quiet parts of the music...
I've bought a LittleDot MK III as an inexpensive way to play with tube rolling before I make a big $ commitment to a DIY tube headphone amp (no idea yet what it might be, not that far along). I've also build an O2. Those will be my first two headphone amps. I also use them as pre amps for my ACA.
I listen to a wide variety of music, but with an emphasis on jazz. I'm a "Mids guy."
I think I see a pair of ZMF Auteur headphones in my future... fairly neutral with a warm tilt, characteristic open back wider sound stage...
But alas, not just yet, so I'm considering a pair of Meze 99 Classics to buy me time. For a lot less money, I think I could be happy with them as a closed back option for the long term.
My only reservation - they are quite bass-heavy since the new (more comfortable, thicker) pads were added.
And that brings me to the point of the thread - headphone EQ. Given my preferences as stated above, can someone suggest any EQ options that I may want to be familiar with before purchasing?
I may pick up a pair or two of alternate pads as well, but want to be familiar with all the options before I spend.
Thanks for any experience, suggestions, or information!
I have several Superlux headphones. I made my first mods using suggestions found by googling Superlux mods.
The mods work well, but they limit themselves to coils values commercially available. You can improve on that by getting an $15 inductance meter and winding your own coils using copper magnet wire.
eg: A6243L Digital LCD Capacitance Inductance LCR Meter
I use this meter to measure the inductance of my headphones and a multi meter to measure the resistance.
Then I use LTSpice to modify the EQ network. I am still playing around, slowly making improvements. This is getting me better results plus a learning experience.
I also have several $7 component testers. These do not give accurate enough inductance measurements.
Polypropylene capacitors are the best choice, but the cheap Chinese ones sound harsh.
Using ferrite core inductors will add noticeable distortion. For this reason I wind my own air core coils.
The mods work well, but they limit themselves to coils values commercially available. You can improve on that by getting an $15 inductance meter and winding your own coils using copper magnet wire.
eg: A6243L Digital LCD Capacitance Inductance LCR Meter
I use this meter to measure the inductance of my headphones and a multi meter to measure the resistance.
Then I use LTSpice to modify the EQ network. I am still playing around, slowly making improvements. This is getting me better results plus a learning experience.
I also have several $7 component testers. These do not give accurate enough inductance measurements.
Polypropylene capacitors are the best choice, but the cheap Chinese ones sound harsh.
Using ferrite core inductors will add noticeable distortion. For this reason I wind my own air core coils.
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Depends what you want to achieve with EQ. Member BYRTT has made us aware of EQ filters (for JRiver) that transform response curves of certain headphones to so called Harman target response curves, making good sounding headphones sound spectacular. Worthwhile investigating before you spend $1,600.00 on a pair of headphones. It helps of course to have a great headamp (like a SE Class A) too. You can read more at this post.
Yes. I did and reported on it in my HeadPhone amplifier art. published by Linear Audio. Its all there -- How-to -- and before and after EQ plots.
THx-RNMarsh
Thanks for the link, twocents! More good reading for tonight! And yes, absolutely worth investigating.
RNMarsh, can you help me find what you published?
As interesting as the post from BYRTT is, I would like to stay away from computers for this project. That means no JRiver for me... Still, a good read, and I learned (and am still learning) some things from it.
In the spirit of DIY...
In looking into LC vs. RC tone control circuits, I realized that if I'm going to build something, it's not so much an EQ as it is a crossover: It's (likely) after the amp, before the headphone, and I'm not actually too concerned about adjusting once I've dialed it in. At least not for now.
I think what I want is a first or second order Butterworth high pass filter with the cutoff frequency relatively low (for a high pass). I won't know where until I listen to the headphones.
First or second order because I'm not trying to protect tweeters... I think a more gentle slope (6 or 8 dB/octave) will give me a more natural roll off of the low end on a boomy pair of headphones. Going up too many orders may create more of a cutoff than roll off of the low end.
With such a low order filter, I don't think there's any real difference between the Butterworth and Linkwitz-Riley typologies. Am I right?
I think I have something workable here. If I get the Meze headphones and find them to be too bass-heavy as reviews would seem to suggest, I think I've got a fun project here to tame that issue.
Thanks for the input!
In the spirit of DIY...
In looking into LC vs. RC tone control circuits, I realized that if I'm going to build something, it's not so much an EQ as it is a crossover: It's (likely) after the amp, before the headphone, and I'm not actually too concerned about adjusting once I've dialed it in. At least not for now.
I think what I want is a first or second order Butterworth high pass filter with the cutoff frequency relatively low (for a high pass). I won't know where until I listen to the headphones.
First or second order because I'm not trying to protect tweeters... I think a more gentle slope (6 or 8 dB/octave) will give me a more natural roll off of the low end on a boomy pair of headphones. Going up too many orders may create more of a cutoff than roll off of the low end.
With such a low order filter, I don't think there's any real difference between the Butterworth and Linkwitz-Riley typologies. Am I right?
I think I have something workable here. If I get the Meze headphones and find them to be too bass-heavy as reviews would seem to suggest, I think I've got a fun project here to tame that issue.
Thanks for the input!
That means you are making actual POWER (however modest) and then *throwing it away!*
For de-booming, try a series cap. At 32 Ohms, 47uFd in series nominally gives -3dB @ 106Hz, which may be too much or too little, depending; but it is a 50 cent experiment.
Series-capping a speaker does have "a problem". It won't reduce output at Resonance (much). It is semi-futile to try to reduce the boom of a loudspeaker this way because "8 Ohms" may be closer to 50 Ohms at resonance, which is often where the trouble is. Shortening the cap to starve the resonance causes reduced output for an octave or two above resonance, actually making the resonance stand-out clearer. Headphones are designed several ways and the main resonance is sometimes higher than boom-zone. So try, but be aware it may not work as expected.
I looked up the frequency response graphs for Meze headphones. To me it looks like they are treble shy rather then bass heavy.
I am suggesting you might try the Superlux HD681 for the following reaons:
1. They give you the fantastic value for the money.
2. They look like they are more easily EQ'd into superior sounding phones than the Meze.
3. It is considered desirable by people that listen to headphones for extended periods that the sound level be somewhat below actual live performance levels. This is also my experience. I do most of my listening through headphones.
Since the hearing response is slightly less at lower and higher frequencies, a slight rise in the low and high end of the spectrum is desirable to give a natural sound perception.
I have stood underneath the BBC binuaral sound microphones in a research and test program that the BBC conducted in 2017 Proms. The same concert was put on the internet for a limited period of time. This gave me the best chance to evaluate my headphone system. In some ways my HD681 gave a more pleasant experience that the actual live music. This surprised me, but it lent credence to what the experts say about headphones and speakers. It also made me very pleased with how good these inexpensive headphones are.
When I have a bit more time, I will post my EQ circuit diagram. I am waiting for some bobbins to wind coils on to do more experimenting and will invite others to contribute to any changes.
I am suggesting you might try the Superlux HD681 for the following reaons:
1. They give you the fantastic value for the money.
2. They look like they are more easily EQ'd into superior sounding phones than the Meze.
3. It is considered desirable by people that listen to headphones for extended periods that the sound level be somewhat below actual live performance levels. This is also my experience. I do most of my listening through headphones.
Since the hearing response is slightly less at lower and higher frequencies, a slight rise in the low and high end of the spectrum is desirable to give a natural sound perception.
I have stood underneath the BBC binuaral sound microphones in a research and test program that the BBC conducted in 2017 Proms. The same concert was put on the internet for a limited period of time. This gave me the best chance to evaluate my headphone system. In some ways my HD681 gave a more pleasant experience that the actual live music. This surprised me, but it lent credence to what the experts say about headphones and speakers. It also made me very pleased with how good these inexpensive headphones are.
When I have a bit more time, I will post my EQ circuit diagram. I am waiting for some bobbins to wind coils on to do more experimenting and will invite others to contribute to any changes.
I looked up the frequency response graphs for Meze headphones. To me it looks like they are treble shy rather then bass heavy.
I am suggesting you might try the Superlux HD681 for the following reaons:
1. They give you the fantastic value for the money.
2. They look like they are more easily EQ'd into superior sounding phones than the Meze.
3. It is considered desirable by people that listen to headphones for extended periods that the sound level be somewhat below actual live performance levels. This is also my experience. I do most of my listening through headphones.
Since the hearing response is slightly less at lower and higher frequencies, a slight rise in the low and high end of the spectrum is desirable to give a natural sound perception.
I have stood underneath the BBC binuaral sound microphones in a research and test program that the BBC conducted in 2017 Proms. The same concert was put on the internet for a limited period of time. This gave me the best chance to evaluate my headphone system. In some ways my HD681 gave a more pleasant experience that the actual live music. This surprised me, but it lent credence to what the experts say about headphones and speakers. It also made me very pleased with how good these inexpensive headphones are.
When I have a bit more time, I will post my EQ circuit diagram. I am waiting for some bobbins to wind coils on to do more experimenting and will invite others to contribute to any changes.
I am suggesting you might try the Superlux HD681 for the following reaons:
1. They give you the fantastic value for the money.
2. They look like they are more easily EQ'd into superior sounding phones than the Meze.
3. It is considered desirable by people that listen to headphones for extended periods that the sound level be somewhat below actual live performance levels. This is also my experience. I do most of my listening through headphones.
Since the hearing response is slightly less at lower and higher frequencies, a slight rise in the low and high end of the spectrum is desirable to give a natural sound perception.
I have stood underneath the BBC binuaral sound microphones in a research and test program that the BBC conducted in 2017 Proms. The same concert was put on the internet for a limited period of time. This gave me the best chance to evaluate my headphone system. In some ways my HD681 gave a more pleasant experience that the actual live music. This surprised me, but it lent credence to what the experts say about headphones and speakers. It also made me very pleased with how good these inexpensive headphones are.
When I have a bit more time, I will post my EQ circuit diagram. I am waiting for some bobbins to wind coils on to do more experimenting and will invite others to contribute to any changes.
Sorry for accidently posting twice.
Here is something you might consider. Get some used HD681's on Ebay.
People buy them and use them without EQ. They are highly recommended, even without EQ.
Without EQ they are a good, but the high frequencies will be intolerable to some and they will sell them. You have a bargain if you find one like that.
With some EQ they become completely different. I know this, so I have bought a second pair just to give away to a friend. He uses them in preference to some expensive headphones.
Here is something you might consider. Get some used HD681's on Ebay.
People buy them and use them without EQ. They are highly recommended, even without EQ.
Without EQ they are a good, but the high frequencies will be intolerable to some and they will sell them. You have a bargain if you find one like that.
With some EQ they become completely different. I know this, so I have bought a second pair just to give away to a friend. He uses them in preference to some expensive headphones.
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Iv owned several pairs of Auteur headphones and have loved them all.
-Matthew
Rittenhouse Soundworks
-Matthew
Rittenhouse Soundworks
RSWRecording - Yeah, I'm really looking forward to a pair of Auteurs. Just not quite yet. New mountain bike, anniversary trip... I'm running low on discretionary funds right now.
Cornelis - A lot of good info, thanks. The HD681's certainly do seem like good value for money. The reviews are a bit more lackluster compared to the Meze reviews, though. The Meze headphones seem to generate two things: Wow! And Woah, the bass! I think if I can roll the bass off with a cap, I'm in there.
Cornelis - A lot of good info, thanks. The HD681's certainly do seem like good value for money. The reviews are a bit more lackluster compared to the Meze reviews, though. The Meze headphones seem to generate two things: Wow! And Woah, the bass! I think if I can roll the bass off with a cap, I'm in there.
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