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Contemplating First Full Range Build. Suggestions?
Contemplating First Full Range Build. Suggestions?
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Old 27th September 2013, 01:14 PM   #1
Xaborus is offline Xaborus  United States
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Lightbulb Contemplating First Full Range Build. Suggestions?

So far I've built Paul Carmodys Amiga and Overnight Sensations. Building the crossovers frustrated me, so naturally full range speakers sound appealing (no pun intended) xD.

For my design I'd like to achieve: a relatively flat frequency response down to 100hz, where a sub will take over, low harmonic distortion- with dominant 2nd order harmonic distortion for a good overall tone, and utilize small speaker drivers for better off-axis response. After looking at numerous drivers at PE, so far the Tang Band W3-1364SA looks like a shoe-in! Zaph's measurements also look promising.

I'll pretty much just use these drivers to experiment and gain ears-on experience with how different enclosures sound. I've read a lot about how different enclosures sound, but have never experienced it yet. For easy and cheap construction, foam core will be used .

So far the plan is to start out with a constant width transmission line tuned to the fs of the driver as my first enclosure.

My question is: does anyone know if this driver or any full range driver sounds ''good'' without any crossovers/filters, ext? Will filters be absolutely necessary to design, or is the driver alone fine for great sound quality?

Any suggestions/concerns from more experienced forum members will be appreciated!
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Old 27th September 2013, 09:14 PM   #2
awdelft is offline awdelft  Netherlands
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Default you could try mark audio chr70.3

I started 'full-range' with good-old monacor sph60x which drops out at higher frequencies but very good voices and a decent linear excursion.
Now I listen to mark audio CHR70.3. Increadible for it's size. Very wide band, not the least on the lower side.
About ten (!) times the linear excursion of the tangband...
I had a hard time keeping volume down during burn-in as adviced.

Oh right, I use it with the best filter avialable: none whatsoever.
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Old 27th September 2013, 09:33 PM   #3
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
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Not wanting to sound like a shill, I hesitated to be first to recommend the Mark Audio drivers - but you could do far worse, perhaps at even higher price.

Then there's the Fostex FF85WK ....
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Old 27th September 2013, 10:07 PM   #4
tomchr is offline tomchr  Canada
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I'm currently drooling over the Alpair 10P-A myself. I'd probably attempt a MLTL-type enclosure. Those drivers aren't cheap, though.

~Tom
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Old 28th September 2013, 12:05 AM   #5
Robertburchell is offline Robertburchell  Canada
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Id suggest the Alpair 7 if the budget permits. Perhaps the CHR70 if your looking for a lower cost alternative, although Ive yet to audition them.

I run a pair of Alpair 7s crossed to a subwoofer at 150hz in my living room setup and have 0 complaints. IMHO they are many magnitudes better than most cheap/mid priced multiways I've heard and look great to boot! With a subwoofer handling the bottom end, they play quite loud and handle complex music with ease. The top end is quite something, I've never felt I was missing that tweeter "sparkle".

The Fountek fr88ex is another fine driver, although I felt it needed some filter work on the top end to smooth the slightly ragged response. A great driver no less, although the cost seems to have crept up, and there may be better options for less money.

The Aura NS3 is another interesting choice in the lower price range. Although the top end leaves something to be desired. I run a pair in my bedroom setup and they do well for videogames and movies.
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Old 28th September 2013, 03:20 AM   #6
Xaborus is offline Xaborus  United States
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Yeah for varying reasons I've eliminated the Aura NS3 (Lots of harmonic Distortion under 200hz, lacks extension after 10k Hz, High 3rd order harmonic distortion), HiViB3 (Spike in frequency response around 8k Hz, High 3rd order harmonic distortion), and the Fountek fr88ex (scared 20-40k response will blow my ears out without knowing it}

What do you guys think of the Markaudio CHR-70A v.3 vs Tang Band W3-1364SA?

I'm also torn by the Tang Band 1337. The harmonic distortion, linearity, and bass extension is absolutely incredible. If it wasn't for that darn FR megaspike after 7k.

Last edited by Xaborus; 28th September 2013 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 28th September 2013, 05:56 AM   #7
picowallspeaker is offline picowallspeaker  Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaborus View Post
for my design I'd like to achieve: a relatively flat frequency response down to 100hz, where a sub will take over, low harmonic distortion- with dominant 2nd order harmonic distortion for a good overall tone, and utilize small speaker drivers for better off-axis response.
Small speakers...hhhmm...tweeters!
Sub....woofers.
There's a line that starts from 1 speaker + 0 components and continues to 2 speakers and some components...and the relative pros and cons have been already examined in this thread. You have the components-like the OSensation- that may fit for another project, like the TL enclosure mentioned.
Having two pairs of speakers on hand, would really make the joy of the novice experimenter: a handful of components to mix & match the drivers.
What a fun :
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Old 28th September 2013, 11:56 PM   #8
mikejennens is offline mikejennens  United States
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Not much to add, but I'm with the others who recommended a Mark Audio driver. I have a pair of CHP-70 gen.2's in a slim classic GR http://frugal-phile.com/boxlib/P10fr...703-300611.pdf that I'm very happy with. The MA drivers are designed specifically to be FR and if I'm not mistaken, BSC is taken into account in the design, so there's no need to build a "circuit" for it.
Mike
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Old 29th September 2013, 04:57 AM   #9
tuxedocivic is offline tuxedocivic  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaborus View Post
Yeah for varying reasons I've eliminated the Aura NS3 (Lots of harmonic Distortion under 200hz, lacks extension after 10k Hz, High 3rd order harmonic distortion), HiViB3 (Spike in frequency response around 8k Hz, High 3rd order harmonic distortion), and the Fountek fr88ex (scared 20-40k response will blow my ears out without knowing it

I'm also torn by the Tang Band 1337. The harmonic distortion, linearity, and bass extension is absolutely incredible. If it wasn't for that darn FR megaspike after 7k.
Huh? You realize pretty much all Full rangers have these qualities right? That's actually the bad part about them. They all have terrible top octave response, HD, peaks, etc.

The smoothest and flattest full ranger I've ever measured was the fostex FF85wk. I started a thread last week. But it needs woofer help. A sub at 100hz would do nicely.

The Mark Audio stuff is better suited for applications where bass extension is required (no sub or woofers), IMO.
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Old 29th September 2013, 10:38 AM   #10
Xaborus is offline Xaborus  United States
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I'll definitely check out your thread for the FF85. I have a bit of a soft spot for paper.

Finding a flat FR and low harmonic distortion diver from 100hz to 20khz is exactly what I'm trying to find. It's in my belief that trying to find a full range driver that plays from 20hz to 20k+ while being flat and low THD is very, very far off. Admittedly I'm a bit of a bass head too, so dedicated subwoofers are appealing anyway xP.
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