Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Digital Source Digital Players and Recorders: CD , SACD , Tape, Memory Card, etc.

Audiophile Ethernet Switch
Audiophile Ethernet Switch
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 21st February 2020, 08:10 PM   #361
cbdb is offline cbdb  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Vancouver
Quote:
Originally Posted by billshurv View Post
I dunno why I am feeding this dilution of the thread to nothing of any use (yet again) but enjoyment !=Sound quality. If you are only interesting in enjoyment then there is no common language and nothing to discuss with you.
So all I need to do for better SQ is listen to something I like?
  Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2020, 08:11 PM   #362
scottjoplin is offline scottjoplin  Wales
diyAudio Member
 
scottjoplin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Penrhyndeudraeth
Works for me
  Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2020, 08:57 PM   #363
TNT is online now TNT  Sweden
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Sweden
+1
__________________
More distortion to the people!
  Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2020, 10:25 PM   #364
jan.didden is offline jan.didden  Europe
diyAudio Member
 
jan.didden's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Westende Resort, BE coast
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbdb View Post
So all I need to do for better SQ is listen to something I like?
You missed the point. All you need to do for better enjoyment is to listen to something you like, with good friends, a beer, that sort of thing. Best enjoyment ever.

Jan
  Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2020, 10:40 AM   #365
Jakob2 is offline Jakob2  Germany
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbdb View Post
When people imagine they hear things with no explanation, no logic, no evidence, and no basis in science, we should just go along with it and try it. Sorry lifes too short, and its a waste of money.
No, you don't have any obligation to try it or to spend money (if it is a waste, one can't know for sure).

But if you talk about the missing science/explanation/whatever, you should be aware of the fact that ruling out the existence of a real audible difference based on ethernet/OSI layer arguments is "no science" too.
Further it is a diyaudioforum, so I'd guess that you can't demand the same evidence from everyone.

Wintermute already mentioned it, measurements carry a subjective element too; it's about what to measure, which way to measure, about the uncertainty one is willing to accept as being sufficiently low, and not the least about the conclusions to draw from measured numbers wrt human perception.
  Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2020, 11:36 AM   #366
jaddie is offline jaddie
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
A subjective choice. Since my ear/brain perception of the output of my hifi is the interface thru which my hifi brings me enjoyment, i will pay attention to the measures, but i have to trust my ears, even as flawed as they may be.

dave
Even flawed hearing can be trustworthy once bias is controlled. All hearing, even all senses, are subject to bias that has been proven to completely skew the results of a comparative test. Two choices, identical in every way, can be presented with one choice being surrounded with some form of bias that suggests the choice is in some way different, usually better, and that choice will be favored. Welcome to wine tasting, where the participants are always told, in great detail and with conviction, what a wine will taste like before it is tasted.

This does not mean senses are flawed, it means they are easily influenced by expectation bias. That includes all forms of illogical expectation.

Remove the bias, what you have left is the senses true ability to discern a difference in stimulus.
  Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2020, 01:58 PM   #367
wiseoldtech is offline wiseoldtech  United States
diyAudio Member
 
wiseoldtech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Philadelphia Pa USA
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaddie View Post
Even flawed hearing can be trustworthy once bias is controlled. All hearing, even all senses, are subject to bias that has been proven to completely skew the results of a comparative test. Two choices, identical in every way, can be presented with one choice being surrounded with some form of bias that suggests the choice is in some way different, usually better, and that choice will be favored. Welcome to wine tasting, where the participants are always told, in great detail and with conviction, what a wine will taste like before it is tasted.

This does not mean senses are flawed, it means they are easily influenced by expectation bias. That includes all forms of illogical expectation.

Remove the bias, what you have left is the senses true ability to discern a difference in stimulus.
A sort of "subliminal message"of sorts...... eh?

To quote:
A subliminal message is a technique used in marketing and other media to influence people without their being aware of what the messenger is doing. This may involve the use of split second flashes of text, hidden images, or subtle cues that affect the audience at a level below conscious awareness.

So tomention my previous post, when I threw the switches to select the tube amp or the solid state one, the audible "snap" of the switches heard by my neighbor assumed I had switched the amps, even though the "dummy switch" didn't change anything......YET, he insisted that the amp was changed.

As I've always said.... it's all in your mind.
__________________
Bohemian Guru Professional
  Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2020, 02:01 PM   #368
scottjoplin is offline scottjoplin  Wales
diyAudio Member
 
scottjoplin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Penrhyndeudraeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiseoldtech View Post
A sort of "subliminal message"of sorts...... eh?
I don't think there is anything subliminal about what he's saying, as an audio example, ask planet10 about the sound of a particular speaker he's heard and see what happens.
  Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2020, 03:06 PM   #369
Jakob2 is offline Jakob2  Germany
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaddie View Post
<snip>
Remove the bias, what you have left is the senses true ability to discern a difference in stimulus.
Removing the bias is far easier to demand than to realize in practice. "Blinding" is just one of many countermeasure but unfortuately the one most often mentioned .
  Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2020, 05:32 PM   #370
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
frugal-phile(tm)
diyAudio Moderator
 
planet10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Victoria, BC, NA, Sol III
Audiophile Ethernet Switch
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaddie View Post
Remove the bias, what you have left is the senses true ability to discern a difference in stimulus.
Why i am eagerly awaiting the day that in a blind test we can bypass the hearing to verbalisation conversion step (full of potential holes) and directly measure what the brain is doing. We are getting close.

dave
__________________
community sites t-linespeakers.org, frugal-horn.com, frugal-phile.com ........ commercial site planet10-HiFi
p10-hifi forum here at diyA
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Audiophile Ethernet SwitchHide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Audio over ethernet and PC Ethernet controller werfi Digital Source 11 7th August 2012 09:31 AM
DIY Audiophile Series: How to Make Your Own Audiophile Quality 300B Valve Amp (4DVD) scav Swap Meet 1 12th October 2009 03:14 PM
A SD/USB/Ethernet transport jkeny Digital Line Level 8 25th September 2009 12:20 PM
Ethernet with cat5E to USB-Dac ? lykkedk Digital Source 0 1st May 2007 06:15 PM
ethernet audio device - need a switch daverave Parts 0 28th March 2007 12:46 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:39 PM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 14.29%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2020 diyAudio
Wiki