Hi there,
A friend of mine is in charge of a purchase for audio equipment of an auditorium (size about 600 seats). He asked me how to request the contractors.
I think, a list full of brands/models/qty's is meaningless. Instead, the sound should be what we're after. But how to 'quantify' the sounds in an objective way?
How about: at some particular seats (near the center region), measured frequency response should be:
40 Hz ~ 12kHz, +/-3dB @ 108dB average SPL
and 32 Hz/16kHz are better than - 6dB;
for outer regions: 50 Hz ~ 10kHz, +/-4.5 dB @ 105dB average SPL
and 40 Hz/12kHz are better than - 10dB
And decay time (T60) should be under 1 sec. (or others) ... etc.
Are those reasonable? Are there any other practical criteria which can be measured and tested under witness when checking for acceptance?
Any comments are welcome, thank you🙂
A friend of mine is in charge of a purchase for audio equipment of an auditorium (size about 600 seats). He asked me how to request the contractors.
I think, a list full of brands/models/qty's is meaningless. Instead, the sound should be what we're after. But how to 'quantify' the sounds in an objective way?
How about: at some particular seats (near the center region), measured frequency response should be:
40 Hz ~ 12kHz, +/-3dB @ 108dB average SPL
and 32 Hz/16kHz are better than - 6dB;
for outer regions: 50 Hz ~ 10kHz, +/-4.5 dB @ 105dB average SPL
and 40 Hz/12kHz are better than - 10dB
And decay time (T60) should be under 1 sec. (or others) ... etc.
Are those reasonable? Are there any other practical criteria which can be measured and tested under witness when checking for acceptance?
Any comments are welcome, thank you🙂
Consider that LF energy can destroy the building over time. Ever wondered why the speaker systems designed for the earthquake movies disappeared? The vibrational effects on building materials is a major issue.
Terry
Terry
There are huge differences in requirements based on what the system will be playing. Is it a musical/theatre venue or a conference venue or what?
If he has the budget, he should contact the local Meyer Sound Office. it won't be cheap, but it will sound very good.
600 seats is not huge. Unless you need insane rock levels.
600 seats is not huge. Unless you need insane rock levels.
Hi CLS, I would suggest going through a few sites on church sound systems which will have similar requirements.
Google search results
Google search results
Look up Krix Speakers and drop them an Email. They supply around 50% of the speaker systems for thearters in Austral/Asia. A lot is riding on your opinion, get it right by asking people who do it for a living and get it right. Their advise is free and if they do manage to sell you something it will do the job.
Terry
Terry
I highly recommend hiring a consultant to draw up a system design for you. You can express your desires to the consultant who will be able to tell you if what you want is within your budget. If the consultant starts pushing brands, you should move on.
Jim Brown of Audio Systems Group has several papers on auditorium and church PA systems:
Audio Systems Group, Inc. Publications
Audio Systems Group, Inc. Publications
Thanks a lot for all your inputs🙂
The venue in question is mainly a lecture hall. And there'll be very many chances of lectures about various tyes of music or movie appreciations. So the system must play music well, especially large scale classical music. (oh well, I know it's not easy... )
That friend (in charge of this) is an administratative personel, not a technical guy. He asked me, "How many drivers, in what sizes, will I need to fullfill this room?" I said to him "Well, that doesn't make good sense. They can sell you anything in those sizes and numbers, but not the sound you want." He listens to quite a lot of classical music (through his LP turntable, Lowthers and ancient RCA amp... ), but knows almost nothing in PA system.
I don't know much, either 😱 But I know such system working in such space is very different from a hifi system in a living room. I said to him, " You must give up those 'hi-end' concepts of a home system, it's already really difficult to get a uniform coverage, relative flat and clean response in a required SPL in a large space, let alone those hi-fi delicacies like 'micro-dynamics', 'extensions', 'details'... etc."
And sadly, I haven't experienced any 'good' PA system here in Taiwan except for an I-Max theater in an national museum. Pro-sound market is too small here to support a healthy industry. Some equipment of big brands can be bought, but I always feel the system integration and setting are not as good (as those brand names). And no, we don't have any dealer of Mayer Sound here, unforturnatey.
I'll be studying the links provided above, thanks a lot, again🙂
The venue in question is mainly a lecture hall. And there'll be very many chances of lectures about various tyes of music or movie appreciations. So the system must play music well, especially large scale classical music. (oh well, I know it's not easy... )
That friend (in charge of this) is an administratative personel, not a technical guy. He asked me, "How many drivers, in what sizes, will I need to fullfill this room?" I said to him "Well, that doesn't make good sense. They can sell you anything in those sizes and numbers, but not the sound you want." He listens to quite a lot of classical music (through his LP turntable, Lowthers and ancient RCA amp... ), but knows almost nothing in PA system.
I don't know much, either 😱 But I know such system working in such space is very different from a hifi system in a living room. I said to him, " You must give up those 'hi-end' concepts of a home system, it's already really difficult to get a uniform coverage, relative flat and clean response in a required SPL in a large space, let alone those hi-fi delicacies like 'micro-dynamics', 'extensions', 'details'... etc."
And sadly, I haven't experienced any 'good' PA system here in Taiwan except for an I-Max theater in an national museum. Pro-sound market is too small here to support a healthy industry. Some equipment of big brands can be bought, but I always feel the system integration and setting are not as good (as those brand names). And no, we don't have any dealer of Mayer Sound here, unforturnatey.
I'll be studying the links provided above, thanks a lot, again🙂
Thanks for reminder🙂
Actually, I've heard of this. Maybe it's the biggest in this business in Taiwan. They've been in countless major events. (I didn't know they got Meyer Sound.)
Actually, I've heard of this. Maybe it's the biggest in this business in Taiwan. They've been in countless major events. (I didn't know they got Meyer Sound.)
The requirements you have probably can be met, but I suspect the bucks will be considerable.
Something more like a final mix down theater, used in the film industry to mix and audition soundtracks, with a Genelec main monitor set up, would be ideal.
The question is does the budget run to it.
rcw
Something more like a final mix down theater, used in the film industry to mix and audition soundtracks, with a Genelec main monitor set up, would be ideal.
The question is does the budget run to it.
rcw
Hi rcw,
Thanks for comments. I didn't know Genelec makes speakers for auditorium (or theater, concert hall... etc). Does (large) studio monitors handle such application well?
I think it's perfectly feasible to see it as a theater. Though it's mainly a lecture hall with 600 seats, all kinds of music and movies will be played here, too. Highest achievable sound quality is the main goal.
And, do you mean the conditions I listed:
"near the center region, measured frequency response should be:
40 Hz ~ 12kHz, +/-3dB @ 108dB average SPL
and 32 Hz/16kHz are better than - 6dB;
for outer regions: 50 Hz ~ 10kHz, +/-4.5 dB @ 105dB average SPL
and 40 Hz/12kHz are better than - 10dB
And decay time (T60) should be under 1 sec. "
are doable but expensive?
What part(s) cost more? Bandwidth, flatness, or uniform coverage?
Are these conditions proper, or desirable? Should we ask for more, or compromise somewhere?
Let's assume the budget is, say, US$ 150k (or equivalent). And what will be a proper goal, and it's technically achievable ?
Thanks again,
CLS🙂
Thanks for comments. I didn't know Genelec makes speakers for auditorium (or theater, concert hall... etc). Does (large) studio monitors handle such application well?
I think it's perfectly feasible to see it as a theater. Though it's mainly a lecture hall with 600 seats, all kinds of music and movies will be played here, too. Highest achievable sound quality is the main goal.
And, do you mean the conditions I listed:
"near the center region, measured frequency response should be:
40 Hz ~ 12kHz, +/-3dB @ 108dB average SPL
and 32 Hz/16kHz are better than - 6dB;
for outer regions: 50 Hz ~ 10kHz, +/-4.5 dB @ 105dB average SPL
and 40 Hz/12kHz are better than - 10dB
And decay time (T60) should be under 1 sec. "
are doable but expensive?
What part(s) cost more? Bandwidth, flatness, or uniform coverage?
Are these conditions proper, or desirable? Should we ask for more, or compromise somewhere?
Let's assume the budget is, say, US$ 150k (or equivalent). And what will be a proper goal, and it's technically achievable ?
Thanks again,
CLS🙂
What you are looking at is a picture theater type set up that is intended only for playback of prerecorded stuff, and not for live performance, (apart from a single mic. for lecturer).
No need for recording extensive mixing or fold-back etc.
I imagine that you can do this for the sort money you mention since these are standard types of set ups much installed in multiplex cinemas.
This can become complicated if the venue is an older building or has an unusual shape.
The only caveat is that a lot of them produce a lot of sound but fewer produce a lot of good sound.
The krix company has installations all over South East Asia and Japan, as I imagine Meyer sound does, and it wouldn't hurt to contact them and ask.
rcw.
No need for recording extensive mixing or fold-back etc.
I imagine that you can do this for the sort money you mention since these are standard types of set ups much installed in multiplex cinemas.
This can become complicated if the venue is an older building or has an unusual shape.
The only caveat is that a lot of them produce a lot of sound but fewer produce a lot of good sound.
The krix company has installations all over South East Asia and Japan, as I imagine Meyer sound does, and it wouldn't hurt to contact them and ask.
rcw.
Thanks🙂
After a little invetigation, I realized that Krix has deployed their products in some major cinemas here. I've been to some of them, but TBH I don't remember how they sound. The opinions on web varied a lot on different sites. So I'd guess the final setting of the system would dominate the results.
After a little invetigation, I realized that Krix has deployed their products in some major cinemas here. I've been to some of them, but TBH I don't remember how they sound. The opinions on web varied a lot on different sites. So I'd guess the final setting of the system would dominate the results.
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