So my plan is to build a subwoofer to give me that delicious bass which is sorely missed with my bookshelf speakers. The problem is, I have no idea how to identify a good driver or amp. I will be using it for music and I want it to sound tight and clean not muddy or boomy.
The Dayton Audio RSS315HFA-8 12" Reference HF Subwoofer 8 Ohm looks awesome but it costs $350 in Aus.... for some reason drivers are crazy expensive over here. I was hoping to spend no more than $200 on the driver. Does anyone have a recommendation for a budget 12'' sub driver that will sound great with my B&W 686 S2's? Even just a notable brand or series of respected drivers would be appreciated. Thanks you!
Also, how do I 'tune' the enclosure? I have been told to buy a kit because I don't know how to do this. Is it hard? I thought it was just down to getting the internal volume to what the manufacturer suggests.I have some woodworking knowledge so I think I should be able to do that.
The Dayton Audio RSS315HFA-8 12" Reference HF Subwoofer 8 Ohm looks awesome but it costs $350 in Aus.... for some reason drivers are crazy expensive over here. I was hoping to spend no more than $200 on the driver. Does anyone have a recommendation for a budget 12'' sub driver that will sound great with my B&W 686 S2's? Even just a notable brand or series of respected drivers would be appreciated. Thanks you!
Also, how do I 'tune' the enclosure? I have been told to buy a kit because I don't know how to do this. Is it hard? I thought it was just down to getting the internal volume to what the manufacturer suggests.I have some woodworking knowledge so I think I should be able to do that.
First things first since you're on a tight budget; what 12" woofer brands are available to you at this [delivered] price? As far as 'budget' goes, these are usually limited to mobile audio woofers that must be XO'd fairly low, so may not be suitable for mating to a speaker ported down to only ~62 Hz [according to the B&W site].
Hope some 'down under' members chime in.........might want to change your header to include where you are.
GM
Hope some 'down under' members chime in.........might want to change your header to include where you are.
GM
Myleso,
Many of us are looking and holding out for that one good (great) 12" subwoofer driver, so a good question.
Parts Express has several to look at, however this is on my wish list:
Creative Sound - Product Details
http://creativesound.ca/pdf/SDX12.pdf
CSS, SDX12
Many of us are looking and holding out for that one good (great) 12" subwoofer driver, so a good question.
Parts Express has several to look at, however this is on my wish list:
Creative Sound - Product Details
http://creativesound.ca/pdf/SDX12.pdf
CSS, SDX12
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Thanks so much for responding, GM 🙂 Sorry I am very new to this, what do you mean by XO'd?
I talked to my local speaker repair guy and he has a 12 inch driver that he has re-coned himself available for $150 + $50 for the service to find the optimal box volume, etc. Not sure how that is done but would you have any clue if I can do it myself? I'm not hopeful but wouldn't mind saving the extra $50.
Thanks for thee suggestion Dougbo, looks awesome. Way over my budget but its good to have goals 😉 maybe one day
I talked to my local speaker repair guy and he has a 12 inch driver that he has re-coned himself available for $150 + $50 for the service to find the optimal box volume, etc. Not sure how that is done but would you have any clue if I can do it myself? I'm not hopeful but wouldn't mind saving the extra $50.
Thanks for thee suggestion Dougbo, looks awesome. Way over my budget but its good to have goals 😉 maybe one day
You're welcome!
XO = crossover = electronic filter to electrically blend together two separate speaker systems whether multiple drivers in one box or separate speaker systems to create a multiple 'driver' system.
Typically nowadays, the woofer's amp will have either a fixed or an adjustable XO as part of its electronics with the THX cinema's reference 80, 120 Hz [and sometimes other choices] being the norm; and of the two, 80 Hz is the most commonly used since it allows the most distance between the sub, main speakers.
To be able to successfully design a speaker cab alignment requires knowing some basic measured [or at least published] electro-mechanical specs [Fs, Vas, Qts] usually referred to as T/S specs.
The equipment required use to be fairly expensive, but nowadays can be nearly free for DIYers, so search the net to find the procedure and various ways to do it equipment wise to see if you want to try it yourself or have a tech savvy friend/relative to do it, then once you have these specs you have many choices re freeware, on-line speaker design calculators and of course we're here if you have questions along the way.
For any drivers designed for mid-bass on down, it's good to know its linear excursion spec [Xmax] since this will limit the amount of useful output [peak SPL]. A typical cheap woofer only has 4-5 mm whereas a 'sub' driver with 2-3x more and of course tend to cost a lot more. IOW, don't be 'conned' by power ratings as it's not uncommon for the low Fs, Xmax drivers to be limited to <50 W, so a good plan to do sims before choosing an amp unless you already have a high power one you plan to use.
Anyway, $50 seems really high unless times have changed; reconers in my locale normally do it to both check to make sure they did a good job and either provide them automatically or at least upon request.
Ditto $150 for a re-cone unless its a true low Fs, high Xmax 'sub' driver, though of course need some Aussies to chime in with their experience as these could be 'bargain basement' prices in your locale for all I know.
GM
XO = crossover = electronic filter to electrically blend together two separate speaker systems whether multiple drivers in one box or separate speaker systems to create a multiple 'driver' system.
Typically nowadays, the woofer's amp will have either a fixed or an adjustable XO as part of its electronics with the THX cinema's reference 80, 120 Hz [and sometimes other choices] being the norm; and of the two, 80 Hz is the most commonly used since it allows the most distance between the sub
To be able to successfully design a speaker cab alignment requires knowing some basic measured [or at least published] electro-mechanical specs [Fs, Vas, Qts] usually referred to as T/S specs.
The equipment required use to be fairly expensive, but nowadays can be nearly free for DIYers, so search the net to find the procedure and various ways to do it equipment wise to see if you want to try it yourself or have a tech savvy friend/relative to do it, then once you have these specs you have many choices re freeware, on-line speaker design calculators and of course we're here if you have questions along the way.
For any drivers designed for mid-bass on down, it's good to know its linear excursion spec [Xmax] since this will limit the amount of useful output [peak SPL]. A typical cheap woofer only has 4-5 mm whereas a 'sub' driver with 2-3x more and of course tend to cost a lot more. IOW, don't be 'conned' by power ratings as it's not uncommon for the low Fs, Xmax drivers to be limited to <50 W, so a good plan to do sims before choosing an amp unless you already have a high power one you plan to use.
Anyway, $50 seems really high unless times have changed; reconers in my locale normally do it to both check to make sure they did a good job and either provide them automatically or at least upon request.
Ditto $150 for a re-cone unless its a true low Fs, high Xmax 'sub' driver, though of course need some Aussies to chime in with their experience as these could be 'bargain basement' prices in your locale for all I know.
GM
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Greets!
Cool!
Totally forgot about Jaycar. Shame on them or manufacturer for not listing Xmax.
The ebay listing seems too good to be true!
The driver's response looks way different than its specs imply. Is this due to what appears to be a rolled cloth surround?
https://littlebirdelectronics.com.au/products/12-response-paper-cone-woofer
GM
Cool!
Totally forgot about Jaycar. Shame on them or manufacturer for not listing Xmax.
The ebay listing seems too good to be true!
The driver's response looks way different than its specs imply. Is this due to what appears to be a rolled cloth surround?
https://littlebirdelectronics.com.au/products/12-response-paper-cone-woofer
GM
Alright, nice. Thanks so much for your help. So a low Fs and a high Xmax is what I am after? I just called up the speaker guy and he thinks I could save myself $50 and just build a 1.5 cubic ft sealed cabinet and add stuffing if it is too big. Does that sound legitimate? He also said that the fs is roughly 32hz and the Xmax is 10mm. Is this good? The Dayton Audio equivalent is this;
Dayton Audio DCS305-4 12" Classic Subwoofer 4 Ohm - Classic Series - Loudspeaker Drivers By Series - Loudspeaker Components
which has an Fs of 24.2 Hz and a Xmax of 9.3 mm. I could order this from the US for $200 Aud.
Thanks again for your help!
Dayton Audio DCS305-4 12" Classic Subwoofer 4 Ohm - Classic Series - Loudspeaker Drivers By Series - Loudspeaker Components
which has an Fs of 24.2 Hz and a Xmax of 9.3 mm. I could order this from the US for $200 Aud.
Thanks again for your help!
If I had my own house I would jump on that. Such a bargain! unfortunately I live in a share house without room for a large sound system.
I'm in Sydney and have been looking at building a sub as well. I haven't found anything worthwhile in the price range you are after for a 12".
Maybe something smaller, like a Voxel that uses a 5 1/4 Tang Band that gets down to 35 hz. The driver should be obtainable for well under $100 from the US. Should suit a share house more than a 12" driver.
Not sure how it would suit your speakers. It surprising that Tang Band does not have a distributer in Australia.
I am also looking at a 10" scanspeak in a ported box or with a passive radiator, but it's $300 plus.
Steve
Maybe something smaller, like a Voxel that uses a 5 1/4 Tang Band that gets down to 35 hz. The driver should be obtainable for well under $100 from the US. Should suit a share house more than a 12" driver.
Not sure how it would suit your speakers. It surprising that Tang Band does not have a distributer in Australia.
I am also looking at a 10" scanspeak in a ported box or with a passive radiator, but it's $300 plus.
Steve
...
What about a 15" instead?
https://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-3040-BGS40/BGS+40+-+8+Ohm
Output at 30hz 109db at 100w, well within xmax and whatnot. Looks like about 225AUS$, you need an amp with some adjustment possibilities also.
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May be disputable whether it's a "sub" but it's certainly likely to cover your basic needs.
Edit2:
Just use it as your tv table or something 🙂
What about a 15" instead?
https://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-3040-BGS40/BGS+40+-+8+Ohm
Output at 30hz 109db at 100w, well within xmax and whatnot. Looks like about 225AUS$, you need an amp with some adjustment possibilities also.
Edit:
May be disputable whether it's a "sub" but it's certainly likely to cover your basic needs.
Edit2:
Just use it as your tv table or something 🙂
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A 15" is just way too big for me 3x3m room. I'm even looking at going down to a 10" to save some money and space.
Yeah, I think you are right about going smaller. Do you know much about the Dayton Audio RSS265HF-4 10" Reference HF Subwoofer? Looks great but I don't know much about it. Cost around $250 here in Aus.
I understand perfectly, but it's not very easy to find good subwoofers for a good price in Oz apparently.
The Visaton W 200 S 8ohm should work well though, just use 2 in paralel or one per channel, good values at 30hz fs and 0,33qts and only 85$ each, should be very easy to sim a design for it.
https://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-9030-W200S/W+200+S+-+8+Ohm
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And if need be you could always just get a car amplifier with integrated xo and use it with an old computer psu, if you know how to trigger it properly (load the -5v from the motherboard plug with a fan or resistor to gnd if my memory serves me correct, it's been 7 years since last time I did that, think it's the only blue wire on that plug, can be green some times? At any rate it's the only -5v wire on the psu) it's a really easy and cheap setup.
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Here you go. 2 x Visaton W 200 S 8" in one box. If you want to go deeper then there will be some choices to make, but this should be ok.
Price is 2 * 85$ + materials and an amp. If you are very cost concerned then it should be possible to get materials, psu and amp for free if you spend some calories hunting around.
Price is 2 * 85$ + materials and an amp. If you are very cost concerned then it should be possible to get materials, psu and amp for free if you spend some calories hunting around.
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Sorry none of that makes any sense to me. I don't know anything about electrical circuits apart from what I learnt in high school. Same goes for the graphs. Thanks heaps anyway!
Then I suggest you just find some cheap car subs, put them in a sealed box and just use those.
If you are interested in understanding those graphs and stuff it's not very difficult to learn at all, most of it is just size, area, volume, forces involved and so on and so forth. However, if you have no interest in understanding then it's impossible to learn.
If you just ask about those things you do not understand then I'm very certain you'll get a reply, either from me eventually (not very quick, in most ways) or someone else. But if you go into this diy thing, then there are some things you have to learn the basics of, it can provide many very rewarding experiences. But also much grief and irritation, just like all other things in life.
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I remember when I was in school how things progressed. And when I started working I knew everything and everyone else just did not have a clue, except they did, it's all about perspective.
The one thing I learned from school that had any value at all, was how NOT to learn, and then after working for a while how to learn. If you find the proper perspective you can be motivated to learn about anything.
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Haha very inspirational 😉 I am coming at this DIY thing very keen to learn new things but although I consider myself intelligent, I am also a slow learner. I need baby steps and practical examples to reinforce ideas and although everyone on this forum is awesome, letters and numbers on a screen will never be as good as someone explaining in person. Once I have nailed down the whole single speaker in a sealed box idea through building one, I will move on to more complex things.Thanks a million for your responses 🙂 very much appreciated
Also, after a few more days of researching these things, the graphs make a little more sense. The picture is slowly coming together.
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