Anyone use the SEAS kit here and did this build? I wonder how close it gets to Joseph perspective 2.
Seas Delling Excel Kit Pair
Seas Delling Excel Kit Pair
You'll likely find more answers in the multiway section of the forum (perhaps the mod team could move the thread).
Re 'how close', without full measurements of both speakers this is largely a matter of opinion / total speculation. For whatever it's worth though, the Seas drivers are excellent: however, personally I'd cross them differently. According to the published data, the W16NX has a concentrated primary cone mode at about 4.8KHz, with independent measures suggesting a little higher. The Delling crossover appears to be set at 2.8KHz, which is a bit close to that for my taste, and the low pass is a simple series inductor with LCR shunt notch. Although clearly sufficient to shape the response consistently, this is unlikely to entirely suppress any HD amplification in the midbass driver's passband, even though it has a decent motor. YMMV. It's probably a nice speaker of its type, but I'd rather be crossing lower. The Millennium tweeter can easily handle it.
Re 'how close', without full measurements of both speakers this is largely a matter of opinion / total speculation. For whatever it's worth though, the Seas drivers are excellent: however, personally I'd cross them differently. According to the published data, the W16NX has a concentrated primary cone mode at about 4.8KHz, with independent measures suggesting a little higher. The Delling crossover appears to be set at 2.8KHz, which is a bit close to that for my taste, and the low pass is a simple series inductor with LCR shunt notch. Although clearly sufficient to shape the response consistently, this is unlikely to entirely suppress any HD amplification in the midbass driver's passband, even though it has a decent motor. YMMV. It's probably a nice speaker of its type, but I'd rather be crossing lower. The Millennium tweeter can easily handle it.
Hi "wanderer"
As an avid DIY-er (from Norway), I really like SEAS drivers. I find them to be "honest" performing according to the specified data, this makes it easier to perform designs. However, my opinion is that their DIY-kits could benefit of slight redesigns, such as lowering crossover point to the treble driver.
Can you make a Joseph speaker at home? Hmmm ...perhaps not, designing a decent crossover would be the main challenge. Here is what I would consider as an alternative:
1) Use a miniDSP 2x4HD as crossover, it is easy to use and cheaper than esoteric "passive components".
2) Replace the Millenium tweeter with SEAS 27TAC/GB - it is relative linear in the crossover area 1.8 khz, and it is cheaper.
3) Instead of the Metal drivers, use SEAS W15LY001, these are also high-end Excel units, but are quite linear (a peak at 5 khz, fix this in the minidsp) and cheaper.
4) Instead of the vented box, use a sealed enclosure Q approx. 0.7, easier to get right. And it will likely work really well.
The downside is that you will need two stereoamplifiers, the "upside" is that you can tweak and adjust the speaker after it is built, do it from the minidsp based on REW measurements. You can even import a linearphase crossover - like B&O, Grimm audio and Kii three.
As an avid DIY-er (from Norway), I really like SEAS drivers. I find them to be "honest" performing according to the specified data, this makes it easier to perform designs. However, my opinion is that their DIY-kits could benefit of slight redesigns, such as lowering crossover point to the treble driver.
Can you make a Joseph speaker at home? Hmmm ...perhaps not, designing a decent crossover would be the main challenge. Here is what I would consider as an alternative:
1) Use a miniDSP 2x4HD as crossover, it is easy to use and cheaper than esoteric "passive components".
2) Replace the Millenium tweeter with SEAS 27TAC/GB - it is relative linear in the crossover area 1.8 khz, and it is cheaper.
3) Instead of the Metal drivers, use SEAS W15LY001, these are also high-end Excel units, but are quite linear (a peak at 5 khz, fix this in the minidsp) and cheaper.
4) Instead of the vented box, use a sealed enclosure Q approx. 0.7, easier to get right. And it will likely work really well.
The downside is that you will need two stereoamplifiers, the "upside" is that you can tweak and adjust the speaker after it is built, do it from the minidsp based on REW measurements. You can even import a linearphase crossover - like B&O, Grimm audio and Kii three.
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I'd certainly agree that Seas data is (with a couple of exceptions) consistent and quite reliable. Also that their kit design crossovers are not always ideal.
A few notes on the above however:
-Yes, it's possible to create something akin to the Joseph Audio. Designing a filter is the 'challenge' to be sure, but that applies to any loudspeaker, whether passive or active. It's part of the process.
-The MiniDSP is OK providing the rest of the system isn't of a standard to reveal some of its own issues. Often the case, but not always. Passive crossovers do not require 'esoteric components' however, which is largely myth driven by marketing.
-The TAC/GB (providing they've sorted some early consistency issues) is excellent, although I'd notch out the ultrasonic mode which should reduce passband distortion a little. The Millennium remains an excellent unit though, with very consistent distortion characteristics under load. They're far from direct replacements of course.
-The W15LY001 is a Nextel coated unit; in design objective it is somewhat different to the magnesium cone units, is about 23% down in emitting area compared to the W16NX001, and HD is also a little inferior if the W16 is used correctly, especially at the bottom end & under higher loads. It's good for higher filter frequencies; if you're crossing lower, or want more low-distortion output, the W16 is technically the superior unit.
-Sealed relative to vented loads are easier to do right if you don't know what you're doing, but whether it will work 'really well' depends on what is wanted, or appropriate.
A few notes on the above however:
-Yes, it's possible to create something akin to the Joseph Audio. Designing a filter is the 'challenge' to be sure, but that applies to any loudspeaker, whether passive or active. It's part of the process.
-The MiniDSP is OK providing the rest of the system isn't of a standard to reveal some of its own issues. Often the case, but not always. Passive crossovers do not require 'esoteric components' however, which is largely myth driven by marketing.
-The TAC/GB (providing they've sorted some early consistency issues) is excellent, although I'd notch out the ultrasonic mode which should reduce passband distortion a little. The Millennium remains an excellent unit though, with very consistent distortion characteristics under load. They're far from direct replacements of course.
-The W15LY001 is a Nextel coated unit; in design objective it is somewhat different to the magnesium cone units, is about 23% down in emitting area compared to the W16NX001, and HD is also a little inferior if the W16 is used correctly, especially at the bottom end & under higher loads. It's good for higher filter frequencies; if you're crossing lower, or want more low-distortion output, the W16 is technically the superior unit.
-Sealed relative to vented loads are easier to do right if you don't know what you're doing, but whether it will work 'really well' depends on what is wanted, or appropriate.