Greetings.
I have a question about whether a certain meter would be suitable for basic troubleshooting of audio equipment. I have the chance to get this meter, still new, for a big savings. It is a true r.m.s. meter, with a 6000 count. It has .5% accuracy on D.C. Voltage, and 1.0% accuracy on A.C. Voltage. It has the same for D.C. and A.C. current. It has the usual range for resistance, and measures capacitance up to 4000uf. It measures fq from 45Hz to 3kHz. Has bar graph and hold reading, and some other features as well. It will handle up to 750 V.D.C. and 500 V.A.C.
I would be using this for working on guitars, s.s.amps, and tube amps, in a semi-pro capacity. I am taking the C.E.T. course, and will eventually have to invest in some pro grade test equipment, but for now, I just need something that would beat the hardware store types, or Radio Crap models.
Very much thanks to anybody that has comment, advice, tips, etc., concerning this opportunity. Best Regards, tonequester.
I have a question about whether a certain meter would be suitable for basic troubleshooting of audio equipment. I have the chance to get this meter, still new, for a big savings. It is a true r.m.s. meter, with a 6000 count. It has .5% accuracy on D.C. Voltage, and 1.0% accuracy on A.C. Voltage. It has the same for D.C. and A.C. current. It has the usual range for resistance, and measures capacitance up to 4000uf. It measures fq from 45Hz to 3kHz. Has bar graph and hold reading, and some other features as well. It will handle up to 750 V.D.C. and 500 V.A.C.
I would be using this for working on guitars, s.s.amps, and tube amps, in a semi-pro capacity. I am taking the C.E.T. course, and will eventually have to invest in some pro grade test equipment, but for now, I just need something that would beat the hardware store types, or Radio Crap models.
Very much thanks to anybody that has comment, advice, tips, etc., concerning this opportunity. Best Regards, tonequester.
Can it measure diode forward voltage? That's very useful for checking all sorts of semiconductor devices. Otherwise it sounds like it will serve you just fine.
It sounds fine. You might tell us make and model though. Audio, especially guitar amps, is not really very demanding of a meter.
Accuracy looks great on paper, but when you are measuring 400vDC on a tube power supply, it is sufficient to know it is 400v. A reading of 400.07126v is not any more helpful. Point being: don't pay a lot extra for super accuracy.
These days, they throw in a lot of extra functions. it costs them very little, and it makes for good marketing. But don;t pay extra for features you don;t need. I use the diode test function ALL the time, a meter is not complete without that. On the other hand, I never use frequency meter. In the last 30 years, the only time I use a freq counter is when I put a test tape on a tape deck and th set the speed by frequency. And I see darn few tape decks anymore. Things like temperature, I myself don;t need. SO when shopping, think about what features you need, rather than oooh look at all the features.
There are inexpensive meters that will work fine, and there are very expensive ones that are overkill. My trusty FLuke 77 has been with me for several decades now. It has bounced around my tool box in field service, has survived the belly of airliners, and now is the main tool in my commercial shop. There are fancier meters, but there is little this one lacks. If you invest in a nice meter now, you won;t need to replace it for a long time.
Having said that, I propose an experiment. I do believe in good meters, but HArbor freight sells a cheap meter. They have a $10 tag, but they are on sale a LOT for less, like right now for $5.49. More than that, the meters are often featured in the coupons for $2 - yes $2. And quite often it is the free item. I wait until I get a free coupon for it - look at their newspaper ads - and I go get one. I have a bunch of them.
7 Function Multimeter
I have them scattered around the shop, there is always one near me. If i am in the warehouse and want to check continuity of a speaker, I don;t need to go back to my bench for my Fluke, I just grab the cheapie. Check for a hot power outlet, or a dead battery? There is my cheapie.
SO: once you have a nice meter, go get a free cheapie. Then compare their operation as you go about your work. It might put things into better focus.
If you damage it, you are not out $60. My Fluke will survive a drop to the floor, this one? WHo knows.
Accuracy looks great on paper, but when you are measuring 400vDC on a tube power supply, it is sufficient to know it is 400v. A reading of 400.07126v is not any more helpful. Point being: don't pay a lot extra for super accuracy.
These days, they throw in a lot of extra functions. it costs them very little, and it makes for good marketing. But don;t pay extra for features you don;t need. I use the diode test function ALL the time, a meter is not complete without that. On the other hand, I never use frequency meter. In the last 30 years, the only time I use a freq counter is when I put a test tape on a tape deck and th set the speed by frequency. And I see darn few tape decks anymore. Things like temperature, I myself don;t need. SO when shopping, think about what features you need, rather than oooh look at all the features.
There are inexpensive meters that will work fine, and there are very expensive ones that are overkill. My trusty FLuke 77 has been with me for several decades now. It has bounced around my tool box in field service, has survived the belly of airliners, and now is the main tool in my commercial shop. There are fancier meters, but there is little this one lacks. If you invest in a nice meter now, you won;t need to replace it for a long time.
Having said that, I propose an experiment. I do believe in good meters, but HArbor freight sells a cheap meter. They have a $10 tag, but they are on sale a LOT for less, like right now for $5.49. More than that, the meters are often featured in the coupons for $2 - yes $2. And quite often it is the free item. I wait until I get a free coupon for it - look at their newspaper ads - and I go get one. I have a bunch of them.
7 Function Multimeter
I have them scattered around the shop, there is always one near me. If i am in the warehouse and want to check continuity of a speaker, I don;t need to go back to my bench for my Fluke, I just grab the cheapie. Check for a hot power outlet, or a dead battery? There is my cheapie.
SO: once you have a nice meter, go get a free cheapie. Then compare their operation as you go about your work. It might put things into better focus.
If you damage it, you are not out $60. My Fluke will survive a drop to the floor, this one? WHo knows.
A Fluke 17B has robust construction. Both for its PCB, switch, & case. Honors its CAT rating, has HRC fuses. Its a real Fluke at 110$ inc. shipping from HK etc.
Slower with no back-light vs. the 87V, no touch hold, no hi-res, nowhere as precise. But in spec as advertised. Big clear digits and nice probes. Has a real holster too. Continuity mode is weak.
After a 10V ref chip and comparing to the 87V I could enhance basic precision a lot through its trimmers nonetheless. Temperature range OK and comes with a standard Fluke brown wire temp probe.
My UNI-T UT61E is much faster and has more digits, good build, but not as tough as the 17B. No temp range, no screen light. Very good frequency range. Much burden voltage in current mode for low drop matters situations. Better continuity mode over the 17B. Probes are nothing special. Its a PC logger also among other things. Comes with serial cable and software. A glowing bargain at $55-65.
17B is RMS 61E is true RMS. Both 17B and 61E won't light up an LED in diode mode.
Slower with no back-light vs. the 87V, no touch hold, no hi-res, nowhere as precise. But in spec as advertised. Big clear digits and nice probes. Has a real holster too. Continuity mode is weak.
After a 10V ref chip and comparing to the 87V I could enhance basic precision a lot through its trimmers nonetheless. Temperature range OK and comes with a standard Fluke brown wire temp probe.
My UNI-T UT61E is much faster and has more digits, good build, but not as tough as the 17B. No temp range, no screen light. Very good frequency range. Much burden voltage in current mode for low drop matters situations. Better continuity mode over the 17B. Probes are nothing special. Its a PC logger also among other things. Comes with serial cable and software. A glowing bargain at $55-65.
17B is RMS 61E is true RMS. Both 17B and 61E won't light up an LED in diode mode.
Greetings to Mr Evil, Enzo, and Salas.
Thanks for your input. I did forget to name the meter in question. It is a Tenma, but I can't remember the model number presently. I was wondering if 6000 count would be good enough for my audio work. I know that the capacitance mode is not a big deal, but it DOES go as high as 4000uf. Also, the fq range is 45Hz to 3kHz, so that should be helpful. It DOES have the diode check function. It has all kinds of stuff that I don't know much about, including a U.S.B. port with cable, and P.C. software. It's auto-ranging, and has an analog bar graph. The stuff like : Data Hold, Duty Cycle,Relative mode, and max/min value are probably just more "bells and whistles", and I'm even a long way from using a computer/DMM combo. This meter seems to only be sold in this country by MCM Electronics(it is sold in England as well), and they have had it on back order for a long time, and won't be getting any until March,2014 according to their web site. It goes for $59.99 from them, when they have them. I am not foolish enough to think of this as a "cheap" version of the most inexpensive Fluke, and I WILL be getting one of those. However, as Enzo said, it doesn't hurt to have some cheaper meters around. Although this one will cost me more than 2 dollars, it is an excellent deal I'm getting. The True RMS part, I am not certain about. Most I have heard on that subject, suggest that it is rarely needed, and I CAN do the conversions to peak, and peak to peak, so I guess it can't be too much of a DISADVANTAGE ! ? I have written down the models suggested for future reference, and I thank each of you for the timely and good info, and advice. It has given me a lot to think about, before I buy that Fluke. I was told by a printing press maintenance man, 30 years ago that Fluke was worth the extra expense. He used one at work provided by the company, and he had his own personal one. He told me(at least at that time) that the only decent" also ran" was a BK Precision.
Sincere thanks for your help gentlemen ! tonequester.
Thanks for your input. I did forget to name the meter in question. It is a Tenma, but I can't remember the model number presently. I was wondering if 6000 count would be good enough for my audio work. I know that the capacitance mode is not a big deal, but it DOES go as high as 4000uf. Also, the fq range is 45Hz to 3kHz, so that should be helpful. It DOES have the diode check function. It has all kinds of stuff that I don't know much about, including a U.S.B. port with cable, and P.C. software. It's auto-ranging, and has an analog bar graph. The stuff like : Data Hold, Duty Cycle,Relative mode, and max/min value are probably just more "bells and whistles", and I'm even a long way from using a computer/DMM combo. This meter seems to only be sold in this country by MCM Electronics(it is sold in England as well), and they have had it on back order for a long time, and won't be getting any until March,2014 according to their web site. It goes for $59.99 from them, when they have them. I am not foolish enough to think of this as a "cheap" version of the most inexpensive Fluke, and I WILL be getting one of those. However, as Enzo said, it doesn't hurt to have some cheaper meters around. Although this one will cost me more than 2 dollars, it is an excellent deal I'm getting. The True RMS part, I am not certain about. Most I have heard on that subject, suggest that it is rarely needed, and I CAN do the conversions to peak, and peak to peak, so I guess it can't be too much of a DISADVANTAGE ! ? I have written down the models suggested for future reference, and I thank each of you for the timely and good info, and advice. It has given me a lot to think about, before I buy that Fluke. I was told by a printing press maintenance man, 30 years ago that Fluke was worth the extra expense. He used one at work provided by the company, and he had his own personal one. He told me(at least at that time) that the only decent" also ran" was a BK Precision.
Sincere thanks for your help gentlemen ! tonequester.
Don't waste your money on the Cen-tec meters you get at Habor Freight.
The Cheap $3 ones are okay for general purpose stuff and for just in case you are doing something that you think might burn it up.
Been there done that.
I went through three of them one day all because of some HV RF that I didn't know was present!!
Luckily I am not out a +$50 meter.
I bought their more expensive model Cen-Tec P37772 and it is as much as 5% to 10% off between the ranges.
Specs say .3% to .5%!
Sometimes when I set it for a voltage range it will display half of what the voltage should be and I have to flip the selector switch around until I can get it to work right.
I have never got an identical resistance reading switching to another range.
The capacitance function works okay much to my surprise.
It does have a flip display which I like but sometimes it blanks out and I have to tap on it to get it to turn back on.
I tried taking it apart several times to see if I could fix it, But there is nothing that I can seem to do to make it any better.
Using my good ole' scope I was able to determine which of the 1 or 2 ranges are actually accurate.
The second meter I have (just got), is a Sperry DM-6450 and it is an Autoranging meter.
I don't much care for autoranging as it was a gift.
But at least that it is within its stated specs as far as I can tell so far.
I have spent a lot of time checking it for accuracy yet.
It was because of that Cen-Tec that I decided to start building my own precision measuring bench equipment.
But, I did need something to use as a standard and for initial calibration purposes and that Cen-Tec just doesn't cut it!
The Sperry I think will do okay.
It is pretty spot on using the Voltage reference chips that I have tried so far.
I would rather have taken the money invested in both of the devices and got a good Fluke!!!
FWIW, YMMV !!
Cheers!!
jer 🙂
The Cheap $3 ones are okay for general purpose stuff and for just in case you are doing something that you think might burn it up.
Been there done that.
I went through three of them one day all because of some HV RF that I didn't know was present!!
Luckily I am not out a +$50 meter.
I bought their more expensive model Cen-Tec P37772 and it is as much as 5% to 10% off between the ranges.
Specs say .3% to .5%!
Sometimes when I set it for a voltage range it will display half of what the voltage should be and I have to flip the selector switch around until I can get it to work right.
I have never got an identical resistance reading switching to another range.
The capacitance function works okay much to my surprise.
It does have a flip display which I like but sometimes it blanks out and I have to tap on it to get it to turn back on.
I tried taking it apart several times to see if I could fix it, But there is nothing that I can seem to do to make it any better.
Using my good ole' scope I was able to determine which of the 1 or 2 ranges are actually accurate.
The second meter I have (just got), is a Sperry DM-6450 and it is an Autoranging meter.
I don't much care for autoranging as it was a gift.
But at least that it is within its stated specs as far as I can tell so far.
I have spent a lot of time checking it for accuracy yet.
It was because of that Cen-Tec that I decided to start building my own precision measuring bench equipment.
But, I did need something to use as a standard and for initial calibration purposes and that Cen-Tec just doesn't cut it!
The Sperry I think will do okay.
It is pretty spot on using the Voltage reference chips that I have tried so far.
I would rather have taken the money invested in both of the devices and got a good Fluke!!!
FWIW, YMMV !!
Cheers!!
jer 🙂
6000 counts, even 4000 will be no problem in audio applications. The 17B is 4000 counts.
The 61E is 22000 counts and has an excellent cap range up to 220000uF I forgot to mention. Rarely cheap ones can be as reliable as the 61E in nano Farad range.
If you are talking this one Tenma 72-10405 then its only a rebadged UNI-T from the 61 family. The 61E is the best from that family. The others are slower fewer counts versions using an older chip, just swapping for back-light or temp range features etc.
P.S. True RMS will give you correct answer on any AC waveform, RMS only for sinewave. If you will measure a digital clock with simple RMS meter you will get the wrong answer for instance. Non zero crossing square (monopole pulse) takes AC+DC true RMS meter or any scope though its a small detail.
It would be unusual to need to know the actual capacitance of a large capacitor. I've only ever needed to measure capacitance for smaller values used in filters.
You'll probably find that whenever that function would be useful, it would be better to use an oscilloscope.
Really, I would say that only voltage, current, resistance, continuity and diode test are must-have. Everything else is either not very useful, or best done with a dedicated instrument.
I have found one practical use though. When large caps show suspiciously less capacitance than their nominal spec including what their tolerance would allow, they are invariably high loss (Dissipation or tanδ) also when I check them on the LCR. So it could be a quick indication about expired PSU caps and other largish electrolytics. Either overused or over-stored.
Here is the 61E in Tenma badge by the way. Nice in orange and 50$ dearer than UNI-T found abroad online. But includes the UT-D04 USB lead along the serial one. Normally extra. There can be import tax possibilities and Tenma does serious warranty service? Those can be incentives beyond orange. Don't know.
Tenma Professional TRMS Digital Multimeter with 22000 Count Display | 72-10415 (7210415) | Tenma
Tenma Professional TRMS Digital Multimeter with 22000 Count Display | 72-10415 (7210415) | Tenma
Greetings geraldfryjr, Mr Evil, and Salas.
Thanks very much for all of the information. You guy's are way ahead of me, but I hope to catch up with this C.E.T. course, over the next 6 months. Nothing can beat experience, and that's why I joined this forum(to reap it). I'm on a couple of other forums as well, and I recognize names here from the other forums. It's great to have such people, for a beginner like me to be able to "bounce my questions off". That's the biggest problem with an online course, nobody to ask. Once again, thanks to all who posted here, I've gotten to where I just print this info off. It's worth a lot to me, and I couldn't even buy this stuff ! Thanks Sincerely, tonequester.
Thanks very much for all of the information. You guy's are way ahead of me, but I hope to catch up with this C.E.T. course, over the next 6 months. Nothing can beat experience, and that's why I joined this forum(to reap it). I'm on a couple of other forums as well, and I recognize names here from the other forums. It's great to have such people, for a beginner like me to be able to "bounce my questions off". That's the biggest problem with an online course, nobody to ask. Once again, thanks to all who posted here, I've gotten to where I just print this info off. It's worth a lot to me, and I couldn't even buy this stuff ! Thanks Sincerely, tonequester.
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