Hello! I have 2 old Trace Elliot bass cab, 1way (15") and they're equipped with 200w Celestions that are claimed to go up to 5khz (on axis, of course). They're pretty bright for being single woofer enclosures.
They're not worth much and not easy to sell. They sound nice as they are but there's much room for making them better. I wanted to make them "full-range" adding a mid or a mid-tweeter. These cabs have two reflex tubes on front that can be plugged. If you leave them open the tuning is 45hz, if you plug one it's 35hz and if you plug them both it's sealed.
These are the solutions I'm considering:
1) Adding a Ciare PT383 cut at 2khz. Then the cab would go up to 15khz, better off-axis response over 2khz, no major mods to the cab chassis. I could move one reflex on the back or leave the cab tuned to 35hz.
2) Adding a Fane Sovereign 6-100 (I already have it) cut at 500hz. In this case the cab would go up to 7khz on axis with slightly better dispersion. Same for the reflex tube as soluzion n.1.
3) Adding two Faital 4Fe32 (16ohm or 4ohm each) and cut them at 500hz. They go up to 20khz, I'd only need to make a small mid chamber into the chassis and move the reflex tubes on the back.
The 500hz crossover isn't easy to find here, I'd have to order it from the USA or UK. The 2000hz crossover is available. Any thoughts?
They're not worth much and not easy to sell. They sound nice as they are but there's much room for making them better. I wanted to make them "full-range" adding a mid or a mid-tweeter. These cabs have two reflex tubes on front that can be plugged. If you leave them open the tuning is 45hz, if you plug one it's 35hz and if you plug them both it's sealed.
These are the solutions I'm considering:
1) Adding a Ciare PT383 cut at 2khz. Then the cab would go up to 15khz, better off-axis response over 2khz, no major mods to the cab chassis. I could move one reflex on the back or leave the cab tuned to 35hz.
2) Adding a Fane Sovereign 6-100 (I already have it) cut at 500hz. In this case the cab would go up to 7khz on axis with slightly better dispersion. Same for the reflex tube as soluzion n.1.
3) Adding two Faital 4Fe32 (16ohm or 4ohm each) and cut them at 500hz. They go up to 20khz, I'd only need to make a small mid chamber into the chassis and move the reflex tubes on the back.
The 500hz crossover isn't easy to find here, I'd have to order it from the USA or UK. The 2000hz crossover is available. Any thoughts?
Wrong forum BTW.
Hi,
You say there much room for making them better, I'd be a lot more careful.
What Celestion units are fitted, and what sort of presence peak do they have ?
Eminence make a high efficiency add-on horn for bass cabinets, you only
need to add it to one of the cabinets (with an L-pad), rolled in as the 15's
rolloff. http://www.eminence.com/pdf/BGH25_8.pdf
rgds, sreten.
Hi,
You say there much room for making them better, I'd be a lot more careful.
What Celestion units are fitted, and what sort of presence peak do they have ?
Eminence make a high efficiency add-on horn for bass cabinets, you only
need to add it to one of the cabinets (with an L-pad), rolled in as the 15's
rolloff. http://www.eminence.com/pdf/BGH25_8.pdf
rgds, sreten.
I have a Fane 15-600.
I made up a tweeter box to sit on top with a high power Pyle tweeter.
4" X 5" Bullet Horn Tweeter Pyle Pdbt78 Speaker 68888722087 | eBay
I made up a tweeter box to sit on top with a high power Pyle tweeter.
4" X 5" Bullet Horn Tweeter Pyle Pdbt78 Speaker 68888722087 | eBay
Sreten, I have the woofer dismounted so I can check the specs (if they're still available for this model). I know for sure it goes high for a 15".
This is the cab specs sheet:
Used TRACE ELLIOT 1153T CAB | Speaker Cabinets | Music Go Round
I tried biamping it with my Trace Elliot preamp (with built-in adjustable crossover) and cut at 500hz with the Fane Sovereign 6"-100 it sounded much better.
nigelwright7557, I'd prefer a "woofer" or "soft-dome" tweeter. I had a Ciare unit on an 1x10" I built a few years ago and it sounded amazing. If possible, I'd like to cut the 15" lower to make dispersion off-axis better. But if I have to make things easier, the solution n.1 shouldn't be bad. I'll look for the exact Celestion woofer model tomorrow and will report back.
This is the cab specs sheet:
Used TRACE ELLIOT 1153T CAB | Speaker Cabinets | Music Go Round
I tried biamping it with my Trace Elliot preamp (with built-in adjustable crossover) and cut at 500hz with the Fane Sovereign 6"-100 it sounded much better.
nigelwright7557, I'd prefer a "woofer" or "soft-dome" tweeter. I had a Ciare unit on an 1x10" I built a few years ago and it sounded amazing. If possible, I'd like to cut the 15" lower to make dispersion off-axis better. But if I have to make things easier, the solution n.1 shouldn't be bad. I'll look for the exact Celestion woofer model tomorrow and will report back.
https://reverb.com/item/676484-celestion-c15h-200-15-200-watt-bass-speaker
Unfortunately I can't find the specs of the woofer.
Unfortunately I can't find the specs of the woofer.
While crossing at 500Hz may be a good choice for moving to wide dispersion and necessary for fitting a dome tweeter at the top, I suspect this would change the sound of the speaker altogether.
Yeah... as I said I tried it with the built-in crossover of my preamp and it sounded much better IMHO so... I went ahead and built a mid chamber on the baffle, the glue is curing as I type. I'll have to wire it and see what's the crossover frequency I like the most before I decide if I should buy (or build) a passive crossover to use the cab with all of my amps. The problem is, I have two tube amps and a zobel network would smooth the impedance out... good for output transformers.
I still have the other cab (the one in better conditions) that can be upgraded. I'll probably buy the Ciare PT383 soft dome tweeter just to do some comparison and do a better choice.
I still have the other cab (the one in better conditions) that can be upgraded. I'll probably buy the Ciare PT383 soft dome tweeter just to do some comparison and do a better choice.
The Ciare looks interesting. It might not match to the 15 but if you are going to try it anyway you might learn if you want a midrange.
If you cross at 500Hz the 15 should match to any normal direct radiator. You can choose one that then matches to the Ciare.
If you cross higher than 500Hz you might want something that has more narrow directivity at the crossover.
If you cross at 500Hz the 15 should match to any normal direct radiator. You can choose one that then matches to the Ciare.
If you cross higher than 500Hz you might want something that has more narrow directivity at the crossover.
The Ciare soft dome tweeters really sound sweet on bass cabs... if they're loud enough, they're my first choice. Even in pairs. 😉
Anyway since the worn cab is worth 100 bucks or so, I decided to give it a try... it's a free mod after all as I already had the Fane 6" (bought it years ago but never used it). I built a mid chamber (sealed) into the baffle, enlarged the upper front port (now the cab is tuned at 35hz instead of 45 but it's not a real mod as it was already possible with plugs). Must admit it sounds good and the sound is much better if you move around (better dispersion).
I should probably spend some time to find out what's the best cut-off frequency... the built-in crossover has 250, 500, 750 and 1000.
I also have to double-check the polarity of the mid, in the mess I could have wired it out of phase (even if it sounds good). All in all, not bad for 2 hours of work and no money spent. I'd be curious to modify the other one with the Faital 4"s
Anyway since the worn cab is worth 100 bucks or so, I decided to give it a try... it's a free mod after all as I already had the Fane 6" (bought it years ago but never used it). I built a mid chamber (sealed) into the baffle, enlarged the upper front port (now the cab is tuned at 35hz instead of 45 but it's not a real mod as it was already possible with plugs). Must admit it sounds good and the sound is much better if you move around (better dispersion).
I should probably spend some time to find out what's the best cut-off frequency... the built-in crossover has 250, 500, 750 and 1000.
I also have to double-check the polarity of the mid, in the mess I could have wired it out of phase (even if it sounds good). All in all, not bad for 2 hours of work and no money spent. I'd be curious to modify the other one with the Faital 4"s
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Yes, I think with a 15 you'll find it becomes directive somewhere between 600-1200Hz. Crossing below this, say whether 300 or 600Hz would probably make less difference and 15s may be good either way. Crossing above 1200Hz is going to be much more dependent on how the woofer performs and more critical that you find a good match with the upper driver.
I played thru it and also tried to play music thru it to find out the best crossover cut but at low volume. Looks like 750 or 1000hz are the best compromise. The woofer is pretty bright and probably the fact that goes up to 5khz on axis helps with dispersion on 1khz or so. I'm waiting for Celestion to send me the specs sheet. 😉
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