Can anyone give any guidance on the question of survival of viruses on surfaces like vacuum tubes? When buying tubes it's possible to be exposed to the risk of virus survival on surfaces like glass, where according to Australian research it can survive for up to 28 days at room temp (20°C), though this drops significantly at 40° or higher.
Unfortunately, cleaning the tube with either soap or alcohol wipes off the label and devalues the tube considerably, so that's a poor option. I've been wiping the base with alcohol and then heating the tube via its heaters, which I assume does the job. But I'm wondering about putting tubes in a microwave, and also doing the same with tube boxes. Or are there other choices?
Can anyone provide any useful guidance on this? Could also be useful to know about metal surfaces etc.
Unfortunately, cleaning the tube with either soap or alcohol wipes off the label and devalues the tube considerably, so that's a poor option. I've been wiping the base with alcohol and then heating the tube via its heaters, which I assume does the job. But I'm wondering about putting tubes in a microwave, and also doing the same with tube boxes. Or are there other choices?
Can anyone provide any useful guidance on this? Could also be useful to know about metal surfaces etc.
A standard, cheap UV germicidal lamp should be fit for this purpose, although I've not tried myself. UV Lights and Lamps: Ultraviolet-C Radiation, Disinfection, and Coronavirus | FDA
Thanks Nigel, but I'm in lockdown because of risk factors and I personally do worry about transmission of Covid on surfaces. This is more than just a bug. From what I read, freezing doesn't kill this particular virus, it's heat that does it. Maybe ultraviolet light, but I don't have a source for that and don't know much about the science behind this.
Putting tubes in the oven is possible. Optimum temperature and time? Any risks with tubes in the oven?
Putting tubes in the oven is possible. Optimum temperature and time? Any risks with tubes in the oven?
If you don't intend to use the valves straight away, long term storage will neutralise the virus.
If put into use immediately, the operating temperature of the valves will neutralise the virus.
Always wash your hands after handling the valves.
I am not a virologist, but I doubt you would acquire any significant viral load from handling a vacuum tube and may be worrying needlessly.
P.S. I would be uncertain of the safety of nuking a valve in the microwave and don't recommend you try this at home kids! 🙂
If put into use immediately, the operating temperature of the valves will neutralise the virus.
Always wash your hands after handling the valves.
I am not a virologist, but I doubt you would acquire any significant viral load from handling a vacuum tube and may be worrying needlessly.
P.S. I would be uncertain of the safety of nuking a valve in the microwave and don't recommend you try this at home kids! 🙂
Hey Andy, I totally get your concerns as I have some people around me who would probably not survive the corona virus.
Alcohol is your best friend but like you said that would ruin the text on the tubes.
After that comes soapy water, it is what I and a couple of friends in similar positions use for our groceries.
Alternatively leaving them in the oven at some temperature like 60 degrees C for a while will also destroy the virus quite effectively.
Leaving them in the sun for some nice UV exposure is also an option but rather weather dependant.
I think I know the study you are talking about but that is under lab conditions, so take it with a grain of salt. A real life environment is more harsh on the virus which is good news for us 🙂
Alcohol is your best friend but like you said that would ruin the text on the tubes.
After that comes soapy water, it is what I and a couple of friends in similar positions use for our groceries.
Alternatively leaving them in the oven at some temperature like 60 degrees C for a while will also destroy the virus quite effectively.
Leaving them in the sun for some nice UV exposure is also an option but rather weather dependant.
I think I know the study you are talking about but that is under lab conditions, so take it with a grain of salt. A real life environment is more harsh on the virus which is good news for us 🙂
Coronavirus can be irradiated with UV-C.
An example study (plenty out there): UV-LED disinfection of Coronavirus: Wavelength effect - ScienceDirect
If you do use a UV-C lamp, take suitable precautions (conventional UV-C light sources are both carcinogenic and cataractogenic).
An example study (plenty out there): UV-LED disinfection of Coronavirus: Wavelength effect - ScienceDirect
If you do use a UV-C lamp, take suitable precautions (conventional UV-C light sources are both carcinogenic and cataractogenic).
Not sure about the so called "Australian research", but straight from WebMD (don´t trust "average people" supplied data such as Wiki or Quora, but the real thing)
Coronavirus and Surfaces: How Long Does COVID-19 Live on Surfaces?
Sorry, but "real" tube markings are etched in glass, usually weak, even if new, but very hard to remove, requiring a buffing wheel and fine abrasive paste.
Big bold visible markings are silkscreened with various paints, old style was based on finely ground glass or ceramic, baked on at high temperature and VERY hard.
Newer styles use epoxy type inks, still quite hard.
IF markings wipe off with mild alcohol 😕 and even milder water and soap 😱, *in my book* they are fake, after markings applied for commercial reasons and using any cheesy/cheap paint available, completely unsuitable for screen printing on glass.
IF you deal with such dubious tubes ...... 😎
read above my opinion on easily removable markings.
Just wipe the full tube in alcohol , and IF markings disappear ... now you know.
In any case, what´s the intended purpose?
Resale? ... just leave them untouched for over 5 days.
Personal use? ... just use them, working temperature will sterilize them in 5 minutes.
You joking?
Any metal object, specially if full of spikes and cavities like any tube will *explode* in a microwave.
In a nutshell, either wipe them in alcohol or water and soap and as a side note learn about fakeness of tube markings 😎 , or pull them from their boxes, plug them into real equipment and turn it on.
Just filaments is not enough, by far.
Wash your hands with alcohol or warm water and soap as officially directed for Covid prevention and you´ll be fine.
Avoid touching mouth, nose, eyes, after handling them without hand disinfection.
Being 68, Diabetic and with chronic bronchitis be certain that I respect Covid as much as you or anybody else but keep safe doing what I suggested above.
Take care, this nightmare will end 🙂
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Here is a scientific paper published last July on using heat to kill the SARS-CoV-2 virus:
Using heat to kill SARS‐CoV‐2
In summary, these are the recommendations:
Using heat to kill SARS‐CoV‐2
In summary, these are the recommendations:
I AM certain that tubes will not survive even momentary nuking! They don't like it, although those containing neon or argon do glow pretty....for a short time.
As stated I doubt that a vacuum tube could contain enough virus to cause an infection. I set things that could have possible contamination outside in direct sunlight for a few hours, that will kill it, but good sunlight is hard to find this time of year.
Attachments
For anyone curious, this is what happens to a tube in a microwave:
Vid here:
Let's Microwave #4 - Vacuum Tubes from an old TV - YouTube
Vid here:
Let's Microwave #4 - Vacuum Tubes from an old TV - YouTube
Attachments
avtech 23 - you gave me a good laugh!!! Just what we need.
As for wiping tubes with alcohol or soap, well I'm sorry but it DOES remove the markings, which are painted on and not etched in. Mind, I was using methylated spirits, but anti-bacterial spray and soap had similar results. The tubes in question are hardly fakes - I'm talking about EL38 tubes for instance which measure exactly like EL38s and come in makers boxes. I don't think there would be any kind of fake that would measure anything like an EL38, and if there is I'd like to know about it!!!
JMFahey: I appreciate your concerns and you have all my wishes to stay safe. Thanks for posting.
As for wiping tubes with alcohol or soap, well I'm sorry but it DOES remove the markings, which are painted on and not etched in. Mind, I was using methylated spirits, but anti-bacterial spray and soap had similar results. The tubes in question are hardly fakes - I'm talking about EL38 tubes for instance which measure exactly like EL38s and come in makers boxes. I don't think there would be any kind of fake that would measure anything like an EL38, and if there is I'd like to know about it!!!
JMFahey: I appreciate your concerns and you have all my wishes to stay safe. Thanks for posting.
From what I understand and have read (not an epidemiologist, but I went to university for Chemistry, spent too much time in labs, love science, but never did find work in the field... so my explanation will be injected with simple terms), a virus is an organism without a nervous system or the ability to replicate by itself, thus requiring a host. To replicate, it attaches itself to a host cell and the virus RNA is copied (among other things) and many new copies of the virus are produced. Usually it is covered in a lipid (think similiar to fat, wax, or grease) layer which serves as a protective outer barrier to the RNA contained inside.
Want to destroy or deactivate the virus? Easiest so far is to break down the lipid barrier. Soap is very effective, so wash your hands often when in contact with objects others have touched. Ethyl alcohol (ethanol) at 60% to 70% like those found in hand sanitizers and Lysol, will also seep through the lipid barrier effectively "drying out" the guts of the virus deactivating it. A warning though***, higher than 70% ethanol do little to the virus -- the lipid layer "puckers up" shutting the openings to itself for protection and the insides will remain intact and your virus is weakened, but the RNA information it contains remains intact and possibly unaffected. Lower than 60% and the virus just shrugs it off and keeps on going. The 60% - 70% is a sweet spot. Also another good reason why not to use something like 40% vodka, gin, whiskey, bourbon, or brandy -- those are better served on ice, in a mixed drink, or neat.
Other ways? Exposure to UV-C with enough time, will also destroy/scramble/snap the RNA combination inside the virus deactivating it effectively. High heat and time will "fry", dessicate, and break the outer layer of the virus exposing the RNA and rendering it to a deactivated state. So, as a guess, if it fries bacon, then it is probably hot enough.
Vacuum tubes and SS Class A are special that way, I wouldn't make contact and hold my hand to the surface of either while it is plugged in and running.
Best way to go about this is to see and read for yourself and to research the topic with various questions on trusted websites of medical centers, government operated centers for disease control, university information websites on research, and trusted major media outlets. Taking a stranger's word is okay if you are looking for opinions, but the legwork is all yours because that is what you will using to decide. It also is kind of fun this learning process.
Good luck! Stay safe nd stay healthy!
Want to destroy or deactivate the virus? Easiest so far is to break down the lipid barrier. Soap is very effective, so wash your hands often when in contact with objects others have touched. Ethyl alcohol (ethanol) at 60% to 70% like those found in hand sanitizers and Lysol, will also seep through the lipid barrier effectively "drying out" the guts of the virus deactivating it. A warning though***, higher than 70% ethanol do little to the virus -- the lipid layer "puckers up" shutting the openings to itself for protection and the insides will remain intact and your virus is weakened, but the RNA information it contains remains intact and possibly unaffected. Lower than 60% and the virus just shrugs it off and keeps on going. The 60% - 70% is a sweet spot. Also another good reason why not to use something like 40% vodka, gin, whiskey, bourbon, or brandy -- those are better served on ice, in a mixed drink, or neat.
Other ways? Exposure to UV-C with enough time, will also destroy/scramble/snap the RNA combination inside the virus deactivating it effectively. High heat and time will "fry", dessicate, and break the outer layer of the virus exposing the RNA and rendering it to a deactivated state. So, as a guess, if it fries bacon, then it is probably hot enough.
Vacuum tubes and SS Class A are special that way, I wouldn't make contact and hold my hand to the surface of either while it is plugged in and running.
Best way to go about this is to see and read for yourself and to research the topic with various questions on trusted websites of medical centers, government operated centers for disease control, university information websites on research, and trusted major media outlets. Taking a stranger's word is okay if you are looking for opinions, but the legwork is all yours because that is what you will using to decide. It also is kind of fun this learning process.
Good luck! Stay safe nd stay healthy!
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The premise of the question is flawed.
Viruses can only live 28 days on glass in optimum conditions. That means the virus survived 28 days in a lab controlled environment with constant temperature and humidity. And after 28 days, a trace amount of the virus was left.
In the real world, the virus can only last about 5 days in ideal conditions. If the tubes have been exposed to large temperature swings, or any amount of sunlight, the virus might only last a couple hours.
In fact the simplest way of dealing with your tubes is to turn them on. But if for what ever reason that isn't a realistic thing to do, you can simply put them in a clear container and leave them in the sun for a couple hours. If you are really concerned, get a UV light and irradiate the crap out of the tubes. Problem solved.
Viruses can only live 28 days on glass in optimum conditions. That means the virus survived 28 days in a lab controlled environment with constant temperature and humidity. And after 28 days, a trace amount of the virus was left.
In the real world, the virus can only last about 5 days in ideal conditions. If the tubes have been exposed to large temperature swings, or any amount of sunlight, the virus might only last a couple hours.
In fact the simplest way of dealing with your tubes is to turn them on. But if for what ever reason that isn't a realistic thing to do, you can simply put them in a clear container and leave them in the sun for a couple hours. If you are really concerned, get a UV light and irradiate the crap out of the tubes. Problem solved.
Useful to know - I've been using pure methylated spirit, not mixing it with water. I'll have to pour some into a container and add 30% water.
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