Total newbie question, I have never built a speaker. I am planning to build a super tweeter (ST) to sit on top of the bookshelf speakers, a pair of Pioneer SP-BS22-LR . Bunch of questions:
- I would need a filter to set the frequency, wouldn't I? I am thinking of setting it at 18000hz, make sense?
- Preferably, the ST will take power from the pioneer's blinding posts.
- Do the STs have to match the Pioneer's ohm, in this case 6 ohm, and efficiency, 86db?
- I am planning to have the ST either face the front wall behind the speakers, or at 45deg angle ear and top, make sense?
- How much additional effort to have a level volume control?
- What type of driver would be more preferable? bullet? ribbon etc etc? I am open to all.
1. I would say 18 kHz is too high and that around 10 kHz would be better.
2. That is OK.
3. The ST should be more efficient than 86 dB so you have sufficient headroom and you can attenuate to match the Pioneer (see below). It is OK to use an 8 ohm tweeter for which an 8 ohm attenuator is readily available.
4. That is simply a matter of experiment to find what orientation gives the best results.
5. I would regard that as mandatory (see 3 above). It is easy to add a variable L pad level attenuator.
6. I suggest a horn type super tweeter.
These instructions for the Fostex FT17H Horn Super Tweeter will give you some pointers.
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/bullet-tweeters/fostex-ft17h-horn-super-tweeter/
The volume level control (or attenuator) is a variable L pad control like this: https://willys-hifi.com/collections...attenuator-15w-8-ohm-wirewound-volume-control
2. That is OK.
3. The ST should be more efficient than 86 dB so you have sufficient headroom and you can attenuate to match the Pioneer (see below). It is OK to use an 8 ohm tweeter for which an 8 ohm attenuator is readily available.
4. That is simply a matter of experiment to find what orientation gives the best results.
5. I would regard that as mandatory (see 3 above). It is easy to add a variable L pad level attenuator.
6. I suggest a horn type super tweeter.
These instructions for the Fostex FT17H Horn Super Tweeter will give you some pointers.
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/bullet-tweeters/fostex-ft17h-horn-super-tweeter/
The volume level control (or attenuator) is a variable L pad control like this: https://willys-hifi.com/collections...attenuator-15w-8-ohm-wirewound-volume-control
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@toffee123
First let me make you aware that what you are doing is to turn a 2-Way speaker into a 3-Way speaker. This means: To do this successfully, you need to understand the electronics and acoustics of speaker building and tuning. So, before you start your endeavour: Please tell us:
A) What are you missing with the current reproduction? What do you want to achieve?
B) How do you know that a supertweeter will resolve the issues?
C) Why shall your supertweeter start its work significantly above most adults' highest frequency of hearing?
D) What makes you sure that adding "some" supertweeter to your loudspeaker, which will probably cost more than your speakers, will really make a great difference?
My recommendation: Instead of adding something to your speakers without really knowing what you do and why you do it, better invest into better speakers!
Regards,
Winfried
First let me make you aware that what you are doing is to turn a 2-Way speaker into a 3-Way speaker. This means: To do this successfully, you need to understand the electronics and acoustics of speaker building and tuning. So, before you start your endeavour: Please tell us:
A) What are you missing with the current reproduction? What do you want to achieve?
B) How do you know that a supertweeter will resolve the issues?
C) Why shall your supertweeter start its work significantly above most adults' highest frequency of hearing?
D) What makes you sure that adding "some" supertweeter to your loudspeaker, which will probably cost more than your speakers, will really make a great difference?
My recommendation: Instead of adding something to your speakers without really knowing what you do and why you do it, better invest into better speakers!
Regards,
Winfried
There is nothing wrong with wanting to experiment with a super tweeter. I've done it - probably millions have done it! 😎
Here's some information regarding the L pad attenuator wiring.
The three terminals on the L pad are numbered 1, 2 and 3 as shown in the diagram, so you can't really go wrong:
Here's some information regarding the L pad attenuator wiring.
The three terminals on the L pad are numbered 1, 2 and 3 as shown in the diagram, so you can't really go wrong:
I like to add airiness and spaciousness to the current setup.B) How do you know that a supertweeter will resolve the issues?
I don't, in fact, the effort would probably be just for fun, at my ancient age, I don't hear much above 15k Hz on a 'good' day. lol
Umm, good question, I was hoping that it would interfere less with Pioneer's tweeter?
I don't, and I am willing to suffer what will likely to be wasted effort.
Grab a pair of these super tweeters - response beyond 40kHz!
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...-sb21rdcn-c000-4-ring-dome-tweeter-neodymium/
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...-sb21rdcn-c000-4-ring-dome-tweeter-neodymium/
Just a quick note regarding the above diagram - which is correct >
You can't just simply connect the L-pad directly to the Pioneer box input connections. A filter has to precede the L-pad.
PS.
For a low cost and excellent Super Tweeter, I highly recommend >
https://usa.pioneer/collections/speakers/products/ts-b351pro
Although they are 4ohm tweeters, if connected to an L-pad, around 'midway dial setting', they become more around 6ohms.
They come with a single capacitor as a crossover, but should actually be driven by a capacitor PLUS a coil > being second order/12dB per octave filter.
I found adding a dipole ribbon tweeter (open backed GRS PT,) really helped add some air and fill in the sound stage (my speakers are too far apart.....WAF limitations). Guessing the reflections from the rear output helped me there.
I crossed them in about 10k 2nd order, my ears give up much above 12-14k, but they certainly helped.
I crossed them in about 10k 2nd order, my ears give up much above 12-14k, but they certainly helped.
Yes, in addition to the driver the necessary crossover must be provided. Arent't ribbons and AMTs more 'straight' in the impedance trace? So it would help in calculating the crossover. I had 0.33 uF and 0.3 mH on hand and it worked for the mini-8. For the 4Ω with the pod values change. A choice of values would still be recommended. 0.33 -0.68 -1 -1.5 uF caps
and 0.1-0.3 (200 uH) coils. But who knows...m
and 0.1-0.3 (200 uH) coils. But who knows...m
Hi folks,
many recommendations for additional tweeters with high pass, connected in parallel to the existing full range speaker. This being OK, I'm missing recommendations for the treatment of the full range speakers (e.g. with low pass or whatever) or an explanation why this won't be necessary.
The additional tweeter at the moment just adds more high frequency energy to the existing tweeter which may or may be too much. To me the current approach to the project is like "shots out of the window in hope to hit a bird flying by": Try and error costing money.
In wish @toffee123 good luck and success anyway! With so many helpful posters it may work out for him...
Regards,
Winfried
many recommendations for additional tweeters with high pass, connected in parallel to the existing full range speaker. This being OK, I'm missing recommendations for the treatment of the full range speakers (e.g. with low pass or whatever) or an explanation why this won't be necessary.
The additional tweeter at the moment just adds more high frequency energy to the existing tweeter which may or may be too much. To me the current approach to the project is like "shots out of the window in hope to hit a bird flying by": Try and error costing money.
In wish @toffee123 good luck and success anyway! With so many helpful posters it may work out for him...
Regards,
Winfried
This and your idea to direct the tweeters to the front wall should work fine. The "supertweeter" can add indirect (room) sound in a range where the tweeters of your speaker are probably very directional.
Yes, but it differs from the aim of what Toffee wants. I guess he wants more treble, just that. I looked now at the Pioneer speakers and those are budget products with the supervision of Andrew Jones.
The tweeter exhibits a waveguide.
Andersonix's suggestion is also good - A 4Ω tweeter is still manageable; it should put more ouput than the other drivers .
For me it should be put between the woofer and the tweeter, and 5 cm is too much.
I mean, usual considerations of center-to-center, Fc and sensitivity on the baffle go out of the window if considering the tweeter ( ST) as a standalone unit.
The tweeter exhibits a waveguide.
Andersonix's suggestion is also good - A 4Ω tweeter is still manageable; it should put more ouput than the other drivers .
For me it should be put between the woofer and the tweeter, and 5 cm is too much.
I mean, usual considerations of center-to-center, Fc and sensitivity on the baffle go out of the window if considering the tweeter ( ST) as a standalone unit.
Yes.
An indirect (super) tweeter adds treble energy to the room without interfering much with the direct sound from the existing tweeter.
As shown in the 'Dividing Network' diagrams in post #2.
P.S. I favour the single 2.2 uF capacitor filter shown in the 6dB/octave network for an 8 ohm super tweeter.
For a 4 ohm super tweeter I would use 3.9 uF.
