hey fellow video and tinkerer freaks!
check this out, i also have decided to build my own lcd panel, but i suppose i may have been luckier than most, you see i had purchased this awsome 12.8 inch lcd screen on ebay a while back for another video project and now ive opened it and voila, know what i found? the most beautiful thing ever.... no flimsy ribbon cables, aparently the seller hooked everything up for me, using video cards and controllers, they were all hooked up with solid LONG wire cables, oh wow was that a beautiful sight, the whole panel can come apart and i have about 8 or 9 inches of cable that i can use, thats how big these cables are... SWEET!
now my question is, after taking out the back lights (oh was it ever so easy, everything was apart in 5 minutes! 🙂 ) now i must find a fresnel lens of good size, plus a lexan piece of glass, because i intend to use not one 1000w metal halide bulb but.... TWO 😉 ) two ballasts and voila, how big do you think this big mama projector is gonna be? i want the porpotions down to say, an end table size, because i intend on disguising it as furniture, if not then ill desguize it as a coffee table for the living room or something! ;P
oh and this lcd is ready to be hooked up to the PC 😀, i intend on building a pc from scratch as well, and that would include at least a P4 on it and reasonable memory, and the oh so lovely ati all in wonder video card, with the video in option, and set it up to watch tv on it as well, oh yehhhh
any comments on this?
thanks!
check this out, i also have decided to build my own lcd panel, but i suppose i may have been luckier than most, you see i had purchased this awsome 12.8 inch lcd screen on ebay a while back for another video project and now ive opened it and voila, know what i found? the most beautiful thing ever.... no flimsy ribbon cables, aparently the seller hooked everything up for me, using video cards and controllers, they were all hooked up with solid LONG wire cables, oh wow was that a beautiful sight, the whole panel can come apart and i have about 8 or 9 inches of cable that i can use, thats how big these cables are... SWEET!
now my question is, after taking out the back lights (oh was it ever so easy, everything was apart in 5 minutes! 🙂 ) now i must find a fresnel lens of good size, plus a lexan piece of glass, because i intend to use not one 1000w metal halide bulb but.... TWO 😉 ) two ballasts and voila, how big do you think this big mama projector is gonna be? i want the porpotions down to say, an end table size, because i intend on disguising it as furniture, if not then ill desguize it as a coffee table for the living room or something! ;P
oh and this lcd is ready to be hooked up to the PC 😀, i intend on building a pc from scratch as well, and that would include at least a P4 on it and reasonable memory, and the oh so lovely ati all in wonder video card, with the video in option, and set it up to watch tv on it as well, oh yehhhh
any comments on this?
thanks!
Two 1000 watt metal halide? Your dreaming. First of all, you would never be able to power them. You would require about 30 amps of current for both, and I'm willing to bet that the line running into your rooms is only about 15 amps. You would have to run 3 speperate power line into your room of operation simpyl to run the to bulbs, projector, and your pc. Will two metal halide improve your birghtness? Probably not. Trying to use a metal halide bulb of that size and power is like using a garden hose to put out a fire. Sure, you could have all the water pressure in the world, but the hose simply will not move that much water (sorry about the bad comparison). What I mean it, two 1000 watt metal halide will be much brighter, but that sad fact is you will loose probably more than half (75%?) that light because you cannot capture it all. One of those bulbs alone is close to foot ball size. Capturing all of the light with a reflector is near impossible. What do I think? Your thinking macho I can make this huge beist and and will be able to project an image on the moon if i pack it with all this power! The sad truth is that with proper planning and design to maximize light efficancy, you can use a 250 watt metal halide and better results (and you can acutally power the thing). You have a great panel! 12" is not as hard to light up as 15". So, do a little more planning and research. Read up on the fishtank projector and you will see what I mean.
ok ok, it was a bit much to think i could actually power 2 1000w bulbs, but, i have seen someone using a 1000w bulb and it looks pretty small, here is the link http://www.hommie.net/, anyways, i have been thinking that there is a flaw in the design of most projectors, see, when i took apart my lcd screen i noticed that the two backlights were feeding the light through this thick plastic piece, wich was covered in white paper, now the white paper is to refect as much ligth as possible, why do we constantly assume that painting teh inside black will help us? it will only absor light, white will reflect it, so i propose doing the lighting case in white, completely enclosed, and paint the section from the lcd to the lenz black, so that no reflections may occurr and therefore modify the picture projected. Another thing, my lcd is actually 13.8 inches, sorry, typo, but wow what a great lcd it is, with 1024x768 resolution, it should be a great show if it works out, i just have to get a bulb powerful enough, now if the 1000w one is too much i might try to devise a way of maximizing the capture of all the light that is being projected... i honestly do not think that will be a problem, if you have a completely enclosed box with a light shining through it, if the interior of teh box is white then hell, the light will be forced to shine through the hole (lcd) and therefore maximizing the light output
another reason that not to do is metal halides run extremely hot, and 2000 watts of metal halides in any sort of projector case would be dangerously hot. even with fans it's still going to cook. maybe some Sony or someone can stick big MH in their pro auditorium projectors, but i would be a little worried about a DIY. i would think the case would have to be comlpetely open with a fan blowing across it to keep it even close to cool.
you might consider doing more research on MH and calculate exactly how much heat the thing is going to generate.
but then again i never have done this, just thought it may be something to consider.
if you are looking for more intensity, buy a real reflector with a mirror finish to put behind the MH. you can nearly double the intensity of the light with a quality reflector.
be safe and dont burn your house down.
you might consider doing more research on MH and calculate exactly how much heat the thing is going to generate.
but then again i never have done this, just thought it may be something to consider.
if you are looking for more intensity, buy a real reflector with a mirror finish to put behind the MH. you can nearly double the intensity of the light with a quality reflector.
be safe and dont burn your house down.
Hey, give us the details on the LCD panel -- is it a monitor or laptop panel and what brand and model/part number is it? Was the controller bundled or an add-on included by your seller? Details on the reseller would be great too.
Believe me, a 250w MH should be just fine with a good reflector, but if you feel the need to crank up the wattage, you do so at the expense of heat (and potential damage to whatever's inside your projector) and electric bill.
Good luck on your project! Mine is finally on its way to becoming more than a pipe dream.
Believe me, a 250w MH should be just fine with a good reflector, but if you feel the need to crank up the wattage, you do so at the expense of heat (and potential damage to whatever's inside your projector) and electric bill.
Good luck on your project! Mine is finally on its way to becoming more than a pipe dream.
my panel i bought on ebay, i dont know if it is a laptop panel or a pc one, my guess would be that its a pc one, unfortunately because i bought it raw there is no name brand to identify it with, i do have the serial number on the back that may be used to figure out what brand it is. the seller included the video controller and the inverter with the package and he hooked them up for me but i have now since unhooked them all up because the inverter was there to provide power to the backlights and therefore is not required anymore, the video controller i have also unhooked from the main panel because its so easy to do so, just unplug the cable. I can take pictures if you guys wanna see what im talking about!
The design at hommie.net is about 4 feet long and 1 foot wide. That think is huge... too huge. Alan staples MKII design is less than half that size and uses 250 watt metal halide hqi bulbs. I would estimate he has the same light output. What your trying to do with the white paint and the metal halide is "brute force" the light throuhg which in the end will not work very well.
Yea... go with 250 watt double ended or 400 watt mh bulbs, 1000 watts is just too much and the UV output would be greatly increased.
I am now currently making a lcd projetor using a NEC 1545V, DIY OHP w/ 400 watt MH. Maybe by this Saturday, I will have pics up of my setup, and also, the enclosure is very very small, 12" depth, 15" wide, and around 24" to 28" tall.
edit:
and the results
I am now currently making a lcd projetor using a NEC 1545V, DIY OHP w/ 400 watt MH. Maybe by this Saturday, I will have pics up of my setup, and also, the enclosure is very very small, 12" depth, 15" wide, and around 24" to 28" tall.
edit:
and the results
I just now read this thread. Whoa - 1000 watts huh? One of the poeple who emails me has tried a 1000 watt metal halide. He had a heck of a time getting all of the light to condense onto the back of an 80mm projection lens and also found that his LCD panel couldn't really take the heat even with really good cooling installed. Another thing about using the larger bulbs is that you really need the light source to be a point-source -- 1000 watt metal halides are a little to large to qualify in my opinion. You should try a skinny bulb like my 250 watt HQI lamps or something else - just keep it as small as possible. With a really good reflector and a really good condenser, you could crank about 1200 projected lumens out of the 250 watt setup with your LCD panel. My projector is currently much closer to around 500 lumens at best, but then again I'm not using a very good reflector and no condenser lens!
guys i keep hearing about this 250w HQI bulb and i have to say i havent found anything like it, what exactly is it? i went to sears the other day and didnt find anything similar, i bought a 500w halide bulb but that thing heats the hell out of everything within 3 feet, its ruled out, i think ill go with an option i havent seen many people here doing, they have these thing neon bulbs that put out about 900 lumens each, their 9" long, and their about 4 dollars each, im thinking of buying abut ten, making a setup for them behind the lcd screen, getting a fresnel lens to condense all the light and boom, voila, you have nearly 9000 lumens being pumped, well, theoretically, i have to double check those numbers. Sure they are expensive and they only last 2000 hours but if i only use it for about 5 hours a day itll go for over a year without having to change it again, 40 bucks a year.... i can do that
what do you guys think?
what do you guys think?
read, read, read....
I'm sorry to say this but you sound a little too excited! Before you rush into this project I suggest reading through the forum until your eyes start to bleed...There is a ton of information here but keep in mind that a lot of progress has been made since the forum started. The most recent and best projectors to date are using lcd monitor screens, 150W or 250W double ended metal halide bulbs, a spherical reflector, condesor lens, fresnel lens and a good triplet lens. Most of the components can been view and purchased from www.diylabs.org but you can also search elsewhere for alternative pricing if you want. My best advice to you would be to take a step back, take a deep breathe and slow down before making some expensive and time comsuming mistake which could have easily been avoided with a little planning and thought. Also see the "Things Newbies Should Know Thread" for more information.
I'm sorry to say this but you sound a little too excited! Before you rush into this project I suggest reading through the forum until your eyes start to bleed...There is a ton of information here but keep in mind that a lot of progress has been made since the forum started. The most recent and best projectors to date are using lcd monitor screens, 150W or 250W double ended metal halide bulbs, a spherical reflector, condesor lens, fresnel lens and a good triplet lens. Most of the components can been view and purchased from www.diylabs.org but you can also search elsewhere for alternative pricing if you want. My best advice to you would be to take a step back, take a deep breathe and slow down before making some expensive and time comsuming mistake which could have easily been avoided with a little planning and thought. Also see the "Things Newbies Should Know Thread" for more information.
I agree with the above suggestions. 500 watt halogens that you can get at Sears won't work because the light comes from a very long section of the bulb instead of a small condensed area like the HQI bulbs. Go to http://www.diylabs.org/projector/ and then click on the "design" link at the top of the page. From there, go to "MkII-->Lighting" and then you'll see some pictures of what the HQI bulbs look like. I've tried the halogens and the florux bulbs you spoke of - neither are anything you'd want to use.
One thing to keep in mind is that LCD panels are very inefficient - they only pass about 10% of the light that enters them. So a 900 lumen bulb would only be capable of a theoretical maximum of 90 lumens - not good. You need at least 200 lumens to get a watchable picture, but you really want about 500 lumens. Another thing to consider is that you'll be wasting most of the light from a larger bulb since light sources need to be a point-source in order to work correctly in a DIY projector. The only exception is if you were to use a large array of white LEDs, but currently that is far from being a cost effective solution. I personally feel that a 250 watt double-ended bulb is the key to success, and that would still be my opinion even if I didn't sell them - they have a lot of untapped potential.
One thing to keep in mind is that LCD panels are very inefficient - they only pass about 10% of the light that enters them. So a 900 lumen bulb would only be capable of a theoretical maximum of 90 lumens - not good. You need at least 200 lumens to get a watchable picture, but you really want about 500 lumens. Another thing to consider is that you'll be wasting most of the light from a larger bulb since light sources need to be a point-source in order to work correctly in a DIY projector. The only exception is if you were to use a large array of white LEDs, but currently that is far from being a cost effective solution. I personally feel that a 250 watt double-ended bulb is the key to success, and that would still be my opinion even if I didn't sell them - they have a lot of untapped potential.
hey this goes out to diylabs,
ive been to your online store, personally i believe i have a very good lcd monitor, i cannot say the contrast ratio or the response time because i bought it raw without a manual, so i intend on using it
now my question is, the full package for assembling the MKII that you offer on your site for $59, it doesnt specify what it comes with, like, the fresnel lens, is that teh new one that you talk about in your site?is it glass or plastic? what about the light? ballast? i know all the parts come pre cut ready for assembly, i like that idea because currently i dont have the tools to customize my own box
i would like that information because im very interested in purchasing a kit from you, i know i know i shouldve emailed you teh request but i figured maybe some other people have the same questions and it would be a good idea to have them answered.
thanks
ive been to your online store, personally i believe i have a very good lcd monitor, i cannot say the contrast ratio or the response time because i bought it raw without a manual, so i intend on using it
now my question is, the full package for assembling the MKII that you offer on your site for $59, it doesnt specify what it comes with, like, the fresnel lens, is that teh new one that you talk about in your site?is it glass or plastic? what about the light? ballast? i know all the parts come pre cut ready for assembly, i like that idea because currently i dont have the tools to customize my own box
i would like that information because im very interested in purchasing a kit from you, i know i know i shouldve emailed you teh request but i figured maybe some other people have the same questions and it would be a good idea to have them answered.
thanks
10 percent only passes through a panel? Wow. So Lets say my 150watt hqi double ended with condenser , reflector gets to 10k lumens before it reaches the panel I will get 1000 lumens on the other side of the panel? What about light loss through the frensnel lens and projection lens? How much more light loss there?
I think I can forget about using a grey screen with the 150 watt version.
I think I can forget about using a grey screen with the 150 watt version.
macaronaroni said:
Maybe I should retype it to be more clear. The MkII-3 kit comes with the enclosure and metal fasteners from MkII-1 kit, the cooling system from the MkII-2 kit, and also a 13x13 piece of glass and a 12x12 mirror. The lenses, lighting kit, and LCD panel are the three other components that you will need to purchase separately.
To answer your question about the fresnel, it is made of acryllic so it can handle higher temperatures without metling or becoming deformed, although you will need to use the 13x13 piece of glass with any fresnel to keep it from warping slightly.
Also, I agree with Verbose that the actual percentage of light passed through a projection panel is closer to 5%. If you have a 10k lumens lamp with a perfectly shaped reflector and a very efficient condenser lens, then you might be able to get about 500 lumens with your projection panel. This is why I usually recommend that people go with a 20k lumens or higher lamp. The condenser lens that I'm about to start offering tonight at www.diylabs.org is made specifically for these DIY projectors, so I think that it will probably be as efficient as possible, although I don't know the calculations yet to let you know how much brighter your projector would be with this new lens.
That is very low. There is no option for grey screen at that lumen level is there. Also I rememer seeing a demo of a 800 lumen lcd comercial projector and it looked good at 8 feet wide image. So you cant go larger than that.
I would like 1000 lumens. Is this doable and practical? How?
I would like 1000 lumens. Is this doable and practical? How?
Oops again. Sorry. I read it wrong. 500 lumens with my 150 watt and 1000 lumens with the recomended 250 watt bulb. Yes that sounds good.
If you are using a 150 watt HQI that puts out 10k lumens, then I seriously doubt that you would be able to get any more than 400 lumens at best. With a 250 watt HQI that puts out around 25k lumens, then I think that you could get 1000 lumens, but only if you use a good reflector and especially a condenser lens that works when placed extremely close to the bulb/reflector setup. I couldn't find such a condenser out there pre-made, so I'm having about 100 of them made for us - I'll sell them through the website for about $10 for the next couple of weeks, then the price will go to $15 per lens.
Anyways, yes you could get 1000 lumens from a DIY projector, but definitely not without using both a reflector and condenser.
Anyways, yes you could get 1000 lumens from a DIY projector, but definitely not without using both a reflector and condenser.
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