I am looking for recommendations for a good phono pre-amp design, for usage with a range of MM cartridges.
The power amp that I am using is rated at 1.2 VRMS input sensitivity, so a pre-amp stage with variable output level would be a benefit.
Any experiences of good solid-state phono stages ?.
I may concede to a tube stage in the future, but not for now.
Thanks, Eric.
The power amp that I am using is rated at 1.2 VRMS input sensitivity, so a pre-amp stage with variable output level would be a benefit.
Any experiences of good solid-state phono stages ?.
I may concede to a tube stage in the future, but not for now.
Thanks, Eric.
mrfeedback said:
would probably settle for Self's 1983 design, with the Baxandal active volume control....really very hard to improve on...
...may prefer to use opa627's instead of 5532/4
More Info Please - (I'm A Lazy Sod)
Thanks, Eric.
Thanks Mike, do youy have a schematic or web page reference for this design ?.
Thanks, Eric.
Re: More Info Please - (I'm A Lazy Sod)
file too large to post....send me mail...cheers.
mrfeedback said:
file too large to post....send me mail...cheers.
Check this thread: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9628&highlight=phono
I'm quite tempted to build it too😉
I'm quite tempted to build it too😉
Re: Re: DIY Phono Pre-Amp Recommendations ?
Koinichiwa,
Hmmm. Forget the bandaxal (cowtail) tonecontrols. They are worse than useless. You need either fully parametric controls aor other suitably "fine" controls.
Self himself improved his design in the 1990's (the tonecontrol on this is extremely overcomplex but offers actually musical sensible operation).
My own sorta still current solid state design (Peter D mentions the thread below) originally started out from Mr Selfs design. Over time and experimentation I found a number of changes to sound better, while not making conventional measurements any different.
http://www.audiodiskussion.de/foren/selbstbau/msg.php?idx=36130
I would say that for any integrated Amp or "passive" line control stage this very stripped down but quite optimised Phonostage gives good sound for the money.
If money is no object you can build a copy of my current LCR equalised Valve Phonostage (parts cost 1,000 UK pound +++). It is a lot better.
Sayonara
Koinichiwa,
mikek said:
Hmmm. Forget the bandaxal (cowtail) tonecontrols. They are worse than useless. You need either fully parametric controls aor other suitably "fine" controls.
Self himself improved his design in the 1990's (the tonecontrol on this is extremely overcomplex but offers actually musical sensible operation).
My own sorta still current solid state design (Peter D mentions the thread below) originally started out from Mr Selfs design. Over time and experimentation I found a number of changes to sound better, while not making conventional measurements any different.
http://www.audiodiskussion.de/foren/selbstbau/msg.php?idx=36130
I would say that for any integrated Amp or "passive" line control stage this very stripped down but quite optimised Phonostage gives good sound for the money.
If money is no object you can build a copy of my current LCR equalised Valve Phonostage (parts cost 1,000 UK pound +++). It is a lot better.
Sayonara
Re: Re: Re: DIY Phono Pre-Amp Recommendations ?
not entirely certain his '96 incarnation was an 'improvement'............the complexity of the tone control section was, at least in my estimation, unnecessary....
and...no...LCR riaa equalisation with valves is bound to be impractical at best, and probably wildly inaccurate, in respect of fidelity to the riaa curve.
Kuei Yang Wang said:
not entirely certain his '96 incarnation was an 'improvement'............the complexity of the tone control section was, at least in my estimation, unnecessary....
and...no...LCR riaa equalisation with valves is bound to be impractical at best, and probably wildly inaccurate, in respect of fidelity to the riaa curve.
Thanks guys for the links and advice.
At this stage I think Thorstens design gets my thumbs up for economy and ease of construction - for now at least.
Eric.
At this stage I think Thorstens design gets my thumbs up for economy and ease of construction - for now at least.
Eric.
Balanced Input Designs ?.
Since starting this thread, I have thought about benefits of rewiring the tone-arm and cartridge for balanced operation - I am prepared to do this.
I figure that this would give the benefit of AP switching at the source, and possibly lower induced noise operation.
Has anybody tried any balanced input phono pre-amp designs ?.
Eric.
Since starting this thread, I have thought about benefits of rewiring the tone-arm and cartridge for balanced operation - I am prepared to do this.
I figure that this would give the benefit of AP switching at the source, and possibly lower induced noise operation.
Has anybody tried any balanced input phono pre-amp designs ?.
Eric.
Re: Balanced Input Designs ?.
Yep, happily using Allen Wright's excellent RTP3C phono stage, and slowly working on an all tube cascode for the Decca.
As you want this for MM, lots of MM's are not balanced. For example I beleive the Shures (M97, V15, other I dunno) are wired with a common earth to the case, so going balanced for MM might not bring a lot of benefit.
Cheers
mrfeedback said:
Yep, happily using Allen Wright's excellent RTP3C phono stage, and slowly working on an all tube cascode for the Decca.
As you want this for MM, lots of MM's are not balanced. For example I beleive the Shures (M97, V15, other I dunno) are wired with a common earth to the case, so going balanced for MM might not bring a lot of benefit.
Cheers
Re: Balanced Input Designs ?.
I did so to an RB300 some six years ago, replacing all with a single tag-to-connector run of hair-thin Deskadel silver, 70cm in total or so.
Connectors were the small Hiroses, also used by Manticore at that time:
For experiments with normal phonostages I had a 30cm Hirose-to-RCA conversion lead.
I used this arm in conjuction with experimental balanced-in phonostages (SSM2016, INA103, ...) and AFAIK it never ever hummed, despite me always 'forgetting' to connect the earth wire.
But since then I've given up on balanced, and that arm is now more of an annoyance than a joy as its wiring is extremely fragile.
mrfeedback said:
I did so to an RB300 some six years ago, replacing all with a single tag-to-connector run of hair-thin Deskadel silver, 70cm in total or so.
Connectors were the small Hiroses, also used by Manticore at that time:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
For experiments with normal phonostages I had a 30cm Hirose-to-RCA conversion lead.
I used this arm in conjuction with experimental balanced-in phonostages (SSM2016, INA103, ...) and AFAIK it never ever hummed, despite me always 'forgetting' to connect the earth wire.
But since then I've given up on balanced, and that arm is now more of an annoyance than a joy as its wiring is extremely fragile.
Re: Balanced Input Designs ?.
Hi Eric,
Yes I did. First with SSM2017 later with this one:
http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.pl?forum=tweaks&n=50205&highlight=elso+cascode&r=&session= and
http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.pl?forum=tweaks&n=50205&highlight=elso+cascode&r=&session=
Moving coil cartidges are a natural for balanced wiring/inputs.
🙂
Much less "hum"!
mrfeedback said:
Hi Eric,
Yes I did. First with SSM2017 later with this one:
http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.pl?forum=tweaks&n=50205&highlight=elso+cascode&r=&session= and
http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.pl?forum=tweaks&n=50205&highlight=elso+cascode&r=&session=
Moving coil cartidges are a natural for balanced wiring/inputs.
🙂
Much less "hum"!
Re: Re: Re: Re: DIY Phono Pre-Amp Recommendations ?
Koinichiwa,
I don't know about impractical. Do you consider
THIS LCR RIAA UNIT impractical?
As for "wildly inaccurate", hardly. Absolutely flat 100Hz-10KHz and < +/-0.5db 20Hz-20KHz is not such a big deal.
Given sound using LCR RIAA (solid state or valve gainblocks) sounds rather better than the usual NFB RC RIAA EQ's, for whatever reasons are involved....
Sayonara
Koinichiwa,
mikek said:
I don't know about impractical. Do you consider
THIS LCR RIAA UNIT impractical?
As for "wildly inaccurate", hardly. Absolutely flat 100Hz-10KHz and < +/-0.5db 20Hz-20KHz is not such a big deal.
Given sound using LCR RIAA (solid state or valve gainblocks) sounds rather better than the usual NFB RC RIAA EQ's, for whatever reasons are involved....
Sayonara
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: DIY Phono Pre-Amp Recommendations ?
i am convinced passive equalisation is a bad idea...you appear to have Self's articles....the reasons are contained therein...🙂
Kuei Yang Wang said:
i am convinced passive equalisation is a bad idea...you appear to have Self's articles....the reasons are contained therein...🙂
Re: Re: Balanced Input Designs ?.
All the pickups that I have to hand (Shure V-15, Stanton 500, Goldring 900) have a little removable tag that grounds the case to one of the signal grounds, so I think that this is not a problem, but thanks for the advice anyway.
Eric.
Brett said:
All the pickups that I have to hand (Shure V-15, Stanton 500, Goldring 900) have a little removable tag that grounds the case to one of the signal grounds, so I think that this is not a problem, but thanks for the advice anyway.
Eric.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: DIY Phono Pre-Amp Recommendations ?
The most obvious advantage of feedbacked RIAA amp is high immunity against high input signals at high frequencies.
I think this is typical matter of taste. There are pros and cons of both topologiesmikek said:
The most obvious advantage of feedbacked RIAA amp is high immunity against high input signals at high frequencies.
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