For those using a digital front end I’m curious what DAC you’re using. I have all my music on my MAC mini and am currently using a USB streamer from HRT to handle conversion duties. This is the only dac I’ve ever had and while functional I’d like to change to a stand alone separate. I don’t need portability but really want to improve front end. The dac seems the best place to start. I’m just about finished building an F6 and am also considering building a B1 preamp. My system is barebones as I’m currently using a Marantz receiver and a pair of diy single driver speakers. Mostly I listen via pandora and a Bluetooth dongle with my amp.
Not great but I like Pandora and using it through my iPhone is convenient. I rarely use my Mac but would like to experience better sound as I think my speakers are capable of much more. I’m considering several sacs: Denafrips, Schitt , RME, and maybe Topping on the hifi side and maybe even Convert 2 or a crane song Solaris but those pro audio, studio types that while intriguing probably not appropriate? Initially I thought I’d like to stay under $1000 but that may not be enough. It’s an impossible task to audition hifi equipment. I have to rely on manufacturers that have a free return policy, an in home test so to say. Also considered getting a decent record player but I’ve no library of vinyl so would be starting from scratch on that end. Thanks for reading and please offer your thoughts
Not great but I like Pandora and using it through my iPhone is convenient. I rarely use my Mac but would like to experience better sound as I think my speakers are capable of much more. I’m considering several sacs: Denafrips, Schitt , RME, and maybe Topping on the hifi side and maybe even Convert 2 or a crane song Solaris but those pro audio, studio types that while intriguing probably not appropriate? Initially I thought I’d like to stay under $1000 but that may not be enough. It’s an impossible task to audition hifi equipment. I have to rely on manufacturers that have a free return policy, an in home test so to say. Also considered getting a decent record player but I’ve no library of vinyl so would be starting from scratch on that end. Thanks for reading and please offer your thoughts
IME, the better the dac the better the SQ. Very good ones can get expensive (maybe not unlike some Pass products 🙂 ). Also, different dacs use different topologies, which is one thing that makes them sound different from each other. For people that like switched resistor dacs, Holo May appears to be a favorite. For people that like a different sound, Chord 'Hugo TT 2' is said to be one of the best; some people say its even better with an aftermarket linear power supply.
HoloAudio – May DAC | Kitsune HiFi - HoloAudio USA
Chord Electronics Hugo TT2 DAC and Amp | Bloom Audio
As can be seen, really good dacs are not cheap. They are not easy to design either.
In a lower price class, Topping D90 was quite good for the price (at least is was before they ran out of AKM AK4499 dac chips).
HoloAudio – May DAC | Kitsune HiFi - HoloAudio USA
Chord Electronics Hugo TT2 DAC and Amp | Bloom Audio
As can be seen, really good dacs are not cheap. They are not easy to design either.
In a lower price class, Topping D90 was quite good for the price (at least is was before they ran out of AKM AK4499 dac chips).
intojazz:
I have three stereos in the house, each with a stand-alone DAC, including an older Schiit Bifrost, a late model Schiit Modi Multibit and a Chinese 8x TDA1387-based DAC that I've modified. All sound pretty good, but it's the Modi Multibit that impresses me the most -- great detail, rhythm and pacing, neutral, an excellent performer and a steal at $250. The Multibit design is very impressive. Since your budget would permit it, I'd suggest you look closely at Schiit's Bifrost Multibit. It's what I would get if the need arose.
Regards,
Scott
I have three stereos in the house, each with a stand-alone DAC, including an older Schiit Bifrost, a late model Schiit Modi Multibit and a Chinese 8x TDA1387-based DAC that I've modified. All sound pretty good, but it's the Modi Multibit that impresses me the most -- great detail, rhythm and pacing, neutral, an excellent performer and a steal at $250. The Multibit design is very impressive. Since your budget would permit it, I'd suggest you look closely at Schiit's Bifrost Multibit. It's what I would get if the need arose.
Regards,
Scott
I'm using a Mytek Stereo192-DSD DAC. When looking up the exact model, I was surprised how old it actually is now already ... still sounds very good. I recently switched the feed to it from a Squeezebox Touch to a Raspberry Pi with HifiBerry Digi2 Pro shield, running Moode Audio, fed from a Meanwell PSU with just a PO89ZB filter in between. That gave it a bit more relaxed, self-assured, swinging presentation. Hard to describe, but even easier to listen to.
So I think the feed to the DAC is also an important factor.
regards, Claas
So I think the feed to the DAC is also an important factor.
regards, Claas
Unless the DAC you are using is over 20 years old, it's the back end of the back priority for sound quality. Why? Because DAC technology is a matured technology and audible transparency has been achieved 20 years ago even at entry level price.
The best place to start is the speakers and room acoustics. Anyone who suggests otherwise is either a shill for a company selling DACs or misguided.
Yes the speakers and room are the most important. But to say the DAC is not is something I have to take great exception to. It is a system and every item in the chain must be up to the job.
While it is true that DAC chip technology is fairly uniformly excellent these days, the factors that control the sound quality are on the output and not a DAC function per se. Not all current converters, filters and drive stages are created equal. And that's not counting the USB input stage if used and included. Audible differences can be there as well. Care is still needed.
I've heard some stinkers, even today. FWIW I've had a Grace 920, a Grace SDAC and a Schiit Modi. All sounded great. On the other hand I have a small unit that sounds so dull that I will not use it. It's a Topping but in all fairness is a few years old and not from their higher end. There is a very noticeable difference in DACs. Care in selection is still warranted.
I'd suggest Soekris Dacs as a good option. That said, I'm using a Denafrips at the moment and really, really like it. Both are R-2R dacs.
Had a low end Denafrips here for a few days that a friend brought over. Wasn't impressed compared to Topping D90. I would say that of the commercial dacs that have been auditioned at my place, D90 was best and was preferred over some dacs costing 3+ times more. However, my custom AK4499 dac has so far been preferred by all listeners over D90 and all the other auditioned dacs. Haven't had a high-end Chord or a Holo May here yet, although it would be great if that could happen sometime.
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I agree that you should look at the entire chain, but within your DAC budget I think you can upgrade the entire chain if you continue to DIY.
The B1 preamp is terrific and pretty inexpensive to complete.
You can build an absolutely exquisite R-2R DAC for about $250 including power supply: DAC AD1862: Almost THT, I2S input, NOS, R-2R .
B1 and miro's DAC can be put into one enclosure to save some $. Assuming the F6 is paid for you should have plenty left over from the $1000 budget.
The B1 preamp is terrific and pretty inexpensive to complete.
You can build an absolutely exquisite R-2R DAC for about $250 including power supply: DAC AD1862: Almost THT, I2S input, NOS, R-2R .
B1 and miro's DAC can be put into one enclosure to save some $. Assuming the F6 is paid for you should have plenty left over from the $1000 budget.
I use a Topping D50s, Rasberry Pi4B 8GB in a Argon V2 case with Volumio, Monolith USB Digital Audio Cable - USB A to USB B - 1 Meter 22AWG Oxygen-Free Copper, Allo Shanti Linear PSU, M2 Output Stage directly driven from DAC and Fostex FE168ESigmas in MLQWTPs. Interconnects and Speaker Cable are DIY. It does sound very good.
Tried some OpAmp rolling in the DAC and found that you can create different sound signatures. I am in the process of trying out a DIY Discrete OpAmp (Samuel Groner's schematic). Some have tried Burson Audio Classic V6 and praised the resulting sound.
A streamer better than a Rasberry Pi would take the sound to another level.
As far as DACs go, there are compromises and sound signatures which are more suited to some genres of music, rather than others, at almost any price level under $1000.
Tried some OpAmp rolling in the DAC and found that you can create different sound signatures. I am in the process of trying out a DIY Discrete OpAmp (Samuel Groner's schematic). Some have tried Burson Audio Classic V6 and praised the resulting sound.
A streamer better than a Rasberry Pi would take the sound to another level.
As far as DACs go, there are compromises and sound signatures which are more suited to some genres of music, rather than others, at almost any price level under $1000.
I like my Gustard X-16 with standard everything. Good performance, good connectivity. Of course this setup not suitable to brag about in internet audio forums 😉
Check out Soekris.dk.
They have R2R DACs ready-made and boards to build your own.
They now have a US distributor.
Soekris Audiophile Line — Mod House Audio
They have R2R DACs ready-made and boards to build your own.
They now have a US distributor.
Soekris Audiophile Line — Mod House Audio
Hi
the source - in this case the DAC is very important at my view. the amps are "just" amplifing" what they get.
the last years i had : (the DACs in bold letters are still at home)
Musical fidelity CD M6 - used as DAC 2012--> i starting with streaming...foobar etc..if the famous compnay LINN wrote that the source like a CD player can not as goo as stremaing i wake up.
Marantz MA11S
RME fireface with Mutec MU3 reclocker...
Mytec Brooklyn 2017
TEAC 301 - xlr nice sound bit hard to listen long time 2016
aune S16 very good AKM4495 really nice 2017
ifi nano IUSB3.0 2019 - not good for me
Topping D50 2020
gustard A20H 2017 - 2020
Sabaj D5 very good for 450 euro 2021
SMLS M9 DAC - 2021 very strong in the mid range but too hard for me, maybe tuning is possible and push up the sq - thread is existing
short test of Project Pre Box S2 Digital - very nice for that money - maybe the bigger one are much better (....and an austrian company 😀) 2021
Topping D90 2021 without BT, and MQA really very good sound
now i bought for my birthday ( 50) PS audio perfect wave 🙂. it is just some days old😎
chris
the source - in this case the DAC is very important at my view. the amps are "just" amplifing" what they get.
the last years i had : (the DACs in bold letters are still at home)
Musical fidelity CD M6 - used as DAC 2012--> i starting with streaming...foobar etc..if the famous compnay LINN wrote that the source like a CD player can not as goo as stremaing i wake up.
Marantz MA11S
RME fireface with Mutec MU3 reclocker...
Mytec Brooklyn 2017
TEAC 301 - xlr nice sound bit hard to listen long time 2016
aune S16 very good AKM4495 really nice 2017
ifi nano IUSB3.0 2019 - not good for me
Topping D50 2020
gustard A20H 2017 - 2020
Sabaj D5 very good for 450 euro 2021
SMLS M9 DAC - 2021 very strong in the mid range but too hard for me, maybe tuning is possible and push up the sq - thread is existing
short test of Project Pre Box S2 Digital - very nice for that money - maybe the bigger one are much better (....and an austrian company 😀) 2021
Topping D90 2021 without BT, and MQA really very good sound
now i bought for my birthday ( 50) PS audio perfect wave 🙂. it is just some days old😎
chris
Indeed! A discrete I/V stage is next in the queue for my long-suffering testbed.
@intojazz, the only down side is that the rabbit hole is both deep and rewarding.
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Audible difference is there when listening to the same DAC at different level, different listening position or different day depending on your mood. Think about that. Unless it's level matched double blind listening comparison with quick switch between DACs, it doesn't provide objective results. In other words, subjective listening is useless for comparison. It may serve well as an entertainment though.