Hi all. I have a Proceed PDT3 that uses the CDM1.2 transport. It has only recently begun to show an occasional problem. Sometimes when the drawer closes after a disk has been loaded, I will hear a sort of click and the disk will not have initialized (display reads all zeros like there's no disk). The sound is almost like some mechanical part was supposed to "drop into place" but did not, and the resultant disk initialization either doesn't occur or did not complete successfully. Opening and reclosing the drawer (so far) has always fixed this problem. It does not happen often, but is obviously something that should not be happening at all. There is no problem with the playing of the disk once initialized. I'm desperate to get some advice on this, especially if it's something that might be able to be fixed short of trying to track down a NOS CDM1.2. There aren't many left, and a NOS unit was running big money the last time I heard.
If your unit has rubber belts sounds to me as though they're slipping, and you need new ones, a Marantz I had did just that and a new belt kit (usually 4) fixed the problem.
Cheers George
Cheers George
I'll admit I haven't yet taken off the cover 🙂o ) so I don't know if this CDM1.2 uses belts. Where did you track down the belt kit for yours?
Marantz, yours could be based on one of their models or Phillips, that's the homework you'll have to do, if Proceed is still around try them.
Cheers George
Cheers George
Well, I found a source for a NOS CDM1 Mk.II transport, but the guy wants over $500 for it. Can anyone tell me if this price range is fair?
Also, by any chance does anyone have a service manual or installation manual for this transport mechanism?
Also, by any chance does anyone have a service manual or installation manual for this transport mechanism?
Crazy price!!!!
Before you even consider buying a new CDM1mkii - please make sure that your's is broken.
If it is still playing the disc correctly once it has correctly read the TOC - chances are the laser is still ok.
To me, it seems like the CD is not being clamped properly every time. I would suggest that you open the CD player, raise the clamping michanism, remove the clamp disc, clean it, inspect it for wear, lubricate it with a plastic safe grease (silicone), reinstall it and try again. Get hold of any Philips or Marantz service manual with CDM2 or CDM4 and you will see what I am talking about. I can send you one if you like.
While you are at it, you might also check that the tray/drawer is moving in and out smoothly and that the rubber belt is ok. You can also lubricate the guides for the tray.
This should help ensure that the CD is being physically loaded properly each time. If you still have problems - then consider cleaning the lens of the laser. Do a search on that and you will find lots of info. After that - you could start looking at the power supply to the CDM and as a last resort - you could replace the laser with one from a CDM2 or CDM4. Also search on repairing CDM2 and CDM4 - they are very similar to your CDM1mkii.
There is really no need to spend $500 on a replacement - but it would be a good idea to get a used CDM2 or 4 for spare parts. The cheapest way is to buy a used CD player with CDM4/19 keep it for a laser transplant.
NB:- Please make sure you work ESD safe!!!
Before you even consider buying a new CDM1mkii - please make sure that your's is broken.
If it is still playing the disc correctly once it has correctly read the TOC - chances are the laser is still ok.
To me, it seems like the CD is not being clamped properly every time. I would suggest that you open the CD player, raise the clamping michanism, remove the clamp disc, clean it, inspect it for wear, lubricate it with a plastic safe grease (silicone), reinstall it and try again. Get hold of any Philips or Marantz service manual with CDM2 or CDM4 and you will see what I am talking about. I can send you one if you like.
While you are at it, you might also check that the tray/drawer is moving in and out smoothly and that the rubber belt is ok. You can also lubricate the guides for the tray.
This should help ensure that the CD is being physically loaded properly each time. If you still have problems - then consider cleaning the lens of the laser. Do a search on that and you will find lots of info. After that - you could start looking at the power supply to the CDM and as a last resort - you could replace the laser with one from a CDM2 or CDM4. Also search on repairing CDM2 and CDM4 - they are very similar to your CDM1mkii.
There is really no need to spend $500 on a replacement - but it would be a good idea to get a used CDM2 or 4 for spare parts. The cheapest way is to buy a used CD player with CDM4/19 keep it for a laser transplant.
NB:- Please make sure you work ESD safe!!!
Re: Crazy price!!!!
Take the lid off !
Remove the drawer front so the mechanism can move freely.
I think that the drawer is simply not quite closing.
Remove old grease and clean the mechanism [remove it from the machine.]
regrease carefully and sparingly - DO NOT OVERGREASE !
Carefully clean the cdm and laser while it is exposed - no need to remove.
I have had this problem on a CD104 before .
Andy
tonyptony said:
Take the lid off !
Fin said:
Remove the drawer front so the mechanism can move freely.
I think that the drawer is simply not quite closing.
Remove old grease and clean the mechanism [remove it from the machine.]
regrease carefully and sparingly - DO NOT OVERGREASE !
Carefully clean the cdm and laser while it is exposed - no need to remove.
I have had this problem on a CD104 before .
Andy
Re: Crazy price!!!!
Yeah, honestly I was thinking that - while it might be nice to have a neat, NOS MkII unit, my PDT3 whole is maybe worth $500 now. That's a lot of money for a piece part when you look at it that way.
I've heard that the lasers used in the CDM1 MkII were, unlike the CDM4/19, tested and selected units. Any idea if there's any truth to that?
Thanks you both, Fin and Andy. I will take a crack at checking things out this weekend!
Fin said:
Yeah, honestly I was thinking that - while it might be nice to have a neat, NOS MkII unit, my PDT3 whole is maybe worth $500 now. That's a lot of money for a piece part when you look at it that way.
I've heard that the lasers used in the CDM1 MkII were, unlike the CDM4/19, tested and selected units. Any idea if there's any truth to that?
Thanks you both, Fin and Andy. I will take a crack at checking things out this weekend!
Proceed problems too...
I have a PCD2 Proceed CD Player that has been on the fritz for a long time. It got to the point where I shelved it in 2004, and my large CD collection hasn't been enjoyed properly since.
I recently contacted Proceed about repairs, and was shocked when they informed me that they would only accept it for repair with a pre-authorization of, get ready- $950!!! for a player that listed for $2.2K when I bought it new in 1993. Yeah, right, sure... Harman Ba****ds...
Beginning in 2003, the following symptoms began/ developed over a period of months:
1: Occasionally stops and locks up in the middle of normal operation. Corrected by turning off front and back switches or removing AC power cord for a period of time.
2: Sudden "static" pops and crackles. Over months, this developed into a sporadic attack of "White Noise" crashing at full output. This would happen after using player for an hour or three. Remedied (or so it seemed) by turning front switch off (leaving back switch on) and letting it cool off, usually overnight. It soon got to where it did this rather quickly, at which time I stopped using the player.
This was about two years ago. Recently, after getting tired of the poor performance of Red Book Audio CD's on my Sony SACD player, I pulled it out to give it a look myself. Now, it does the same thing and more:
3: When the tray closes, a loud "rattle" noise develops, and followed by the "error" light flashing after about 10 seconds. Sometimes the player works fine for awhile first, then reverts to this activity.
4: Disc loads, but no TOC read, followed by "error" light blinking after about 10 seconds.
My CD Player was the display model at Audio Concepts, and I bought it when the PCD3's came out. It came with a clear acrylic cover on it in addition to the metal cover; I left the clear cover on it. I recall noticing the reverse spinning disc at load time once or twice before, but it would only do it for a few seconds after loading the disc, then it would stop and spin up in the right direction of rotation.
Last weekend I took the cover off to investigate further. Removed all cables and coard connectors scrubbed the contacts, and give them a treatment of Cramolin. Cleaned and lubed everything on the transport.
Fired it up, and it ran fine -for about three hours. No noise, no flaws in reproduction, until... the next disc was loaded. SOS on the transport again. Argghh... turned off a minute, an hour, a day, until today -still continuously spinning spindle , no TOC display, followed by "error".
I discovered that when it starts misbehaving like this, the spindle is turning at full speed the entire time the front or even the rear power switch is on! The "rattle" was caused by the CD fluttering around on the spinning spindle -it was trying to fly off-center before the clamp had a chance to clamp it in place. Even when I "help" it clamp and it spins up without rattling up, it still gives the same "error" light blinking and the display never reads anything but zeroes.
I can't decide whether or not the transport control Digital output board should be looked at, or if it is a problem with the transport mechanism itself. And I certainly won't give Harman an open line of credit for $950 to have them swap transports and boards out with new ones. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated!🙁 🙁 😡 😡
I have a PCD2 Proceed CD Player that has been on the fritz for a long time. It got to the point where I shelved it in 2004, and my large CD collection hasn't been enjoyed properly since.
I recently contacted Proceed about repairs, and was shocked when they informed me that they would only accept it for repair with a pre-authorization of, get ready- $950!!! for a player that listed for $2.2K when I bought it new in 1993. Yeah, right, sure... Harman Ba****ds...
Beginning in 2003, the following symptoms began/ developed over a period of months:
1: Occasionally stops and locks up in the middle of normal operation. Corrected by turning off front and back switches or removing AC power cord for a period of time.
2: Sudden "static" pops and crackles. Over months, this developed into a sporadic attack of "White Noise" crashing at full output. This would happen after using player for an hour or three. Remedied (or so it seemed) by turning front switch off (leaving back switch on) and letting it cool off, usually overnight. It soon got to where it did this rather quickly, at which time I stopped using the player.
This was about two years ago. Recently, after getting tired of the poor performance of Red Book Audio CD's on my Sony SACD player, I pulled it out to give it a look myself. Now, it does the same thing and more:
3: When the tray closes, a loud "rattle" noise develops, and followed by the "error" light flashing after about 10 seconds. Sometimes the player works fine for awhile first, then reverts to this activity.
4: Disc loads, but no TOC read, followed by "error" light blinking after about 10 seconds.
My CD Player was the display model at Audio Concepts, and I bought it when the PCD3's came out. It came with a clear acrylic cover on it in addition to the metal cover; I left the clear cover on it. I recall noticing the reverse spinning disc at load time once or twice before, but it would only do it for a few seconds after loading the disc, then it would stop and spin up in the right direction of rotation.
Last weekend I took the cover off to investigate further. Removed all cables and coard connectors scrubbed the contacts, and give them a treatment of Cramolin. Cleaned and lubed everything on the transport.
Fired it up, and it ran fine -for about three hours. No noise, no flaws in reproduction, until... the next disc was loaded. SOS on the transport again. Argghh... turned off a minute, an hour, a day, until today -still continuously spinning spindle , no TOC display, followed by "error".
I discovered that when it starts misbehaving like this, the spindle is turning at full speed the entire time the front or even the rear power switch is on! The "rattle" was caused by the CD fluttering around on the spinning spindle -it was trying to fly off-center before the clamp had a chance to clamp it in place. Even when I "help" it clamp and it spins up without rattling up, it still gives the same "error" light blinking and the display never reads anything but zeroes.
I can't decide whether or not the transport control Digital output board should be looked at, or if it is a problem with the transport mechanism itself. And I certainly won't give Harman an open line of credit for $950 to have them swap transports and boards out with new ones. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated!🙁 🙁 😡 😡
I have a meitner cd-d transport and a micromega duo transport. The two use the cdm1 mkII.
I really like my cd-d to a point that I'm not able to find another transport to replace it.
The problem you are having is the begining of the end of the laser. I had this problem for over 6 month and I have been able to extend is life by reajusting the laser.
The click you hear is the head not able to have a good reading of the toc from time to time. I know this sound 🙁
I would not suggest investing 500$ on a used mecanics since it's too much of a guess to take. The seller probably got it out of a arcam 170 or other players using this mecanics while not knowing how many hours left on it and asking megabucks from you.
Maybe an adjustment could give you another year out of the laser unit.
I'm actualy looking for a replacement and are tempted by the cdpro2m kits.
I really like my cd-d to a point that I'm not able to find another transport to replace it.
The problem you are having is the begining of the end of the laser. I had this problem for over 6 month and I have been able to extend is life by reajusting the laser.
The click you hear is the head not able to have a good reading of the toc from time to time. I know this sound 🙁
I would not suggest investing 500$ on a used mecanics since it's too much of a guess to take. The seller probably got it out of a arcam 170 or other players using this mecanics while not knowing how many hours left on it and asking megabucks from you.
Maybe an adjustment could give you another year out of the laser unit.
I'm actualy looking for a replacement and are tempted by the cdpro2m kits.
Hi tonyptony, garwoodv6,
$500.00 for a new one is fair. They cost over that when the units were new. If you find one at a lower price, you won the lottery. I replaced a number of them in the 80's and none of the owners were happy with the price. But that's what they were.
-Chris
Edit: That "clack" could be the swing arm hitting the stop as well.
$500.00 for a new one is fair. They cost over that when the units were new. If you find one at a lower price, you won the lottery. I replaced a number of them in the 80's and none of the owners were happy with the price. But that's what they were.
-Chris
Edit: That "clack" could be the swing arm hitting the stop as well.
Hi, read your post. Apparently you are replying to the thread starter?
Another call to Proceed yesterday pretty much confirmed that the transport is bad. According to them, no more CDM1.2 transports are available from Philips, but they have a few left on hand. They will not sell it as a service part, and said it would probably run the total cost to $950 after "all adjustments are made".
Either I'm going to find another trasport or figure out hot to turn this thing into an outboard DAC.
I am interested in more info re: the cdpro2M kits. Where to buy?
Another call to Proceed yesterday pretty much confirmed that the transport is bad. According to them, no more CDM1.2 transports are available from Philips, but they have a few left on hand. They will not sell it as a service part, and said it would probably run the total cost to $950 after "all adjustments are made".
Either I'm going to find another trasport or figure out hot to turn this thing into an outboard DAC.
I am interested in more info re: the cdpro2M kits. Where to buy?
After dismantling my unit and removing all the cable connectors, giving them a little dose of Cramolin, and plugging them in and out a few times, I reassembled the unit and gave it a whirl. The static noises in the audio output ceased, and the unit worked fine -For 3-4 hours. Then the transport started misbehaving again.
As I wrote before, it was that Spindle turning as long as the master power switch was on. When I would load a disc, the disc would start wobbling on the spinning spindle before the clamping mechanism could clamp it. The motor isn't supposed to start spinning until the tray is in and the clamp is down on the disc. It would make a loud chattering noise like a panny bouncing on a countertop, not stopping unless I pressed down harder on the clamping mechanism until it forced the disc to lay down completely centered up on the spindle. Even if I got this to happen immediately upon closing the tray, it still won't read the TOC and continues spinning at what looks like full RPM until I turn off the master power switch on the back of the unit.
As I wrote before, it was that Spindle turning as long as the master power switch was on. When I would load a disc, the disc would start wobbling on the spinning spindle before the clamping mechanism could clamp it. The motor isn't supposed to start spinning until the tray is in and the clamp is down on the disc. It would make a loud chattering noise like a panny bouncing on a countertop, not stopping unless I pressed down harder on the clamping mechanism until it forced the disc to lay down completely centered up on the spindle. Even if I got this to happen immediately upon closing the tray, it still won't read the TOC and continues spinning at what looks like full RPM until I turn off the master power switch on the back of the unit.
If you can find the service manual, I would recommand you to follow their adjusment procedures.
Like I told you in an early post, this would squizee some time out of the laser. I'm over 6 months right now.
Like I told you in an early post, this would squizee some time out of the laser. I'm over 6 months right now.
Hi garwoodv6,
I have repaired a few where the only fault was some electrolytics on the servo board. A few Revox too. The CDM was fine in both cases.
Give that a shot before messing around with the adjustments.
-Chris
I have repaired a few where the only fault was some electrolytics on the servo board. A few Revox too. The CDM was fine in both cases.
Give that a shot before messing around with the adjustments.
-Chris
Sevice manual- are you kidding? We're talking about Harmon here...
I'm going to dig a little further into things this weekend if I get a chance. Thanks for the encouraging words about your success.
I'm inclined to think that it is a transport control or a status monitor/feedback problem since the motor stars spinning full speed immediately upon power-up and never stops. Remember too, I saw the platter spinning in reverse once or twice. If I reach in and stop the motor, it remains still even though there is power apparently srtill being applied: if I help the motor start to turn, the motor takes off again. Perhaps there is a sensor in the motor that is incorrectly reporting motor motion? Or the control system/ logic IC is on the fritz?
The laser goes through its focus motions when I 'fool' the machine into thinking I loaded a disc into it.
When you say servo board, are you referring to the board mounted to the bottom of the transport, or the largecircuit board that the cables from the transport connect to?
I'm going to dig a little further into things this weekend if I get a chance. Thanks for the encouraging words about your success.
I'm inclined to think that it is a transport control or a status monitor/feedback problem since the motor stars spinning full speed immediately upon power-up and never stops. Remember too, I saw the platter spinning in reverse once or twice. If I reach in and stop the motor, it remains still even though there is power apparently srtill being applied: if I help the motor start to turn, the motor takes off again. Perhaps there is a sensor in the motor that is incorrectly reporting motor motion? Or the control system/ logic IC is on the fritz?
The laser goes through its focus motions when I 'fool' the machine into thinking I loaded a disc into it.
When you say servo board, are you referring to the board mounted to the bottom of the transport, or the largecircuit board that the cables from the transport connect to?
Hi garwoodv6,
It sounds like you have a leaky motor driver transistor or op amp with high offset in the disc motor circuit. Misadjustment of the controls can cause this as well. We really do need to see a schematic, but it might be close to a CD104.
Can you please list the chip set? SAA numbers most likely.
-Chris
The board where the cables from the transport go to.
It sounds like you have a leaky motor driver transistor or op amp with high offset in the disc motor circuit. Misadjustment of the controls can cause this as well. We really do need to see a schematic, but it might be close to a CD104.
Can you please list the chip set? SAA numbers most likely.
-Chris
Philips service manual for CDM1 MkII will apply.
Madrigal did not not change a thing to the servo board below the laser.
Madrigal did not not change a thing to the servo board below the laser.
Well, after almost three years my PDT3 is still working mostly okay. I've been afraid to find out where the small problems are that I've been having. I wish I could find someone who is familiar with the mechanism and knows how to check it for alignment, cap replacement, transistor replacement, etc.
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