Hello, I'm a beginner in diy audio, I want to build a relatively small and as powerful as possible two way bluetooth speaker. With speaker specs it's all pretty much clear to me, but I'm having a bit of a trouble with car audio amplifiers. If I wanna have one subwoofer and 2 tweeters (3 speaker units overall), do I need a 4 channel audio amplifier? And also, is it fine if I buy something like a 1000 or even 5000w car audio amplifier? I found these quite easily available to me for a decent price, my concern is, won't an audio amplifier that powerful overpower the speakers or something? I'd put something like a 200w or 300w subwoofer into the speaker enclosure.
Post working links to the amplifiers that you're considering using.
Also post links for the speakers that you want to use (they don't have to be the exact speakers that you will use in the final system.
Are you going to use active crossovers or passive crossovers?
Is this for a mono system or a stereo system?
You called this a 'bluetooth speaker' That generally means an all in one device that you simply supply a signal to. For car audio, you generally have a source, wiring to the amplifiers, then wiring to the speakers. Please be more specific in what you'll use.
You could use a 1 million watt amplifier on a 2 watt speaker. The output of the signal source determines how much power the amp sends to the speakers. At very low volume, low power, at higher volume, more power. If you set the volume too high and exceeded the power handling ability of the speaker, of course it would do damage but that's where common sense comes in. The amplifier and the speakers are typically rated about the same, for most people.
Also post links for the speakers that you want to use (they don't have to be the exact speakers that you will use in the final system.
Are you going to use active crossovers or passive crossovers?
Is this for a mono system or a stereo system?
You called this a 'bluetooth speaker' That generally means an all in one device that you simply supply a signal to. For car audio, you generally have a source, wiring to the amplifiers, then wiring to the speakers. Please be more specific in what you'll use.
You could use a 1 million watt amplifier on a 2 watt speaker. The output of the signal source determines how much power the amp sends to the speakers. At very low volume, low power, at higher volume, more power. If you set the volume too high and exceeded the power handling ability of the speaker, of course it would do damage but that's where common sense comes in. The amplifier and the speakers are typically rated about the same, for most people.
Well yeah you're right, I'm sorry, I'll explain it in a bit more detail this time. So, I wanna build a portable two-way bluetooth speaker which would have 1 subwoofer and 1 (or 2) tweeters, in one relatively small speaker enclosure made out of MDF (which I'll prepare myself).
My speaker enclosure is gonna be:
30cm length (12inches)
20cm width (8inches)
25cm height (10inches)
Which gives me 15.73L or 0.55 ft3 of air volume (excluding the volume electronic components are taking). (I'm looking for a subwoofer of about 150-300W RMS that'd be under 150$)
Sorry but I haven't yet picked out neither the subwoofers nor amplifiers which I'm going to use, it's just that I feel like I lack information to pick anything out. Thanks for the reply though, as to your reply, if there is a volume turn knob or anything similar on my forthcoming bluetooth speaker, I wanna be able to use the entire volume knob, so then I guess I need to look for a car audio amplifier that matches my subwoofer's RMS watts.
I've tried studying up on active and passive crossovers, but they seemed a bit too difficult for me, is a crossover a seperate component I'll have to buy? I thought a car audio amplifier already has some sort of crossover built in.
The way I imagine my speaker enclosure is like: There is a 12"X8"X10" enclosure, literally a box made out of MDF with those dimensions, and in the front, there is 1 8" subwoofer, and 1 (or prefferably 2 tweeters below the subwoofer in the bottom of the front wall of the speaker enclosure. I guess I don't really need a stereo system for such an enclosure, do I? I think I'd be fine with a mono system
The problem is though, so far I haven't found many subwoofers and tweeters which would cover the entire frequency range all the way from 20Hz to 22kHz. I mean like: 20Hz-1kHz for the subwoofer, and 1kHz-22kHz for the tweeter, (I think my subwoofer might be a bit too large to cover that kind of frequency range).
My speaker enclosure is gonna be:
30cm length (12inches)
20cm width (8inches)
25cm height (10inches)
Which gives me 15.73L or 0.55 ft3 of air volume (excluding the volume electronic components are taking). (I'm looking for a subwoofer of about 150-300W RMS that'd be under 150$)
Sorry but I haven't yet picked out neither the subwoofers nor amplifiers which I'm going to use, it's just that I feel like I lack information to pick anything out. Thanks for the reply though, as to your reply, if there is a volume turn knob or anything similar on my forthcoming bluetooth speaker, I wanna be able to use the entire volume knob, so then I guess I need to look for a car audio amplifier that matches my subwoofer's RMS watts.
I've tried studying up on active and passive crossovers, but they seemed a bit too difficult for me, is a crossover a seperate component I'll have to buy? I thought a car audio amplifier already has some sort of crossover built in.
The way I imagine my speaker enclosure is like: There is a 12"X8"X10" enclosure, literally a box made out of MDF with those dimensions, and in the front, there is 1 8" subwoofer, and 1 (or prefferably 2 tweeters below the subwoofer in the bottom of the front wall of the speaker enclosure. I guess I don't really need a stereo system for such an enclosure, do I? I think I'd be fine with a mono system
The problem is though, so far I haven't found many subwoofers and tweeters which would cover the entire frequency range all the way from 20Hz to 22kHz. I mean like: 20Hz-1kHz for the subwoofer, and 1kHz-22kHz for the tweeter, (I think my subwoofer might be a bit too large to cover that kind of frequency range).
A 'sub'woofer is only for very low bass. They make woofers that cover a wider range but that's a different animal.
A 2-way system with just a woofer and a tweeter is going to require careful selection of the components and will likely limit the power handling.
You need to narrow down the components that you will intend to use. If you don't, you may waste time getting many suggestions that are not an option for you.
Are you going to use this in a vehicle? A mono system (for highs) is not often used in cars.
You might look into using a 6.5" or 6x9" 2/3-way speaker with the sub. If they're in the same overall enclosure, the smaller speaker will have to be in its own chamber.
You mentioned an 8" subwoofer. There are many 8" subs that can produce low bass but you stated that you wanted a powerful system. It's unlikely that you'll find an 8" sub that can produce significant low bass at high volume and also reproduce the midrange frequencies.
Electronic crossovers are built into most amplifiers. You have to have one channel for each group of speakers. For a 2-way mono system, two channels. The problem is that most two channel amplifier don't give the option to make one channel low-pass and the other high-pass.
If you mean that you want to use the entire range of the volume control, that's OK for people who listen to golf games or public radio but is rarely an option for people who want to listen to music at high volumes unless they have a virtually unlimited budget.
A 2-way system with just a woofer and a tweeter is going to require careful selection of the components and will likely limit the power handling.
You need to narrow down the components that you will intend to use. If you don't, you may waste time getting many suggestions that are not an option for you.
Are you going to use this in a vehicle? A mono system (for highs) is not often used in cars.
You might look into using a 6.5" or 6x9" 2/3-way speaker with the sub. If they're in the same overall enclosure, the smaller speaker will have to be in its own chamber.
You mentioned an 8" subwoofer. There are many 8" subs that can produce low bass but you stated that you wanted a powerful system. It's unlikely that you'll find an 8" sub that can produce significant low bass at high volume and also reproduce the midrange frequencies.
Electronic crossovers are built into most amplifiers. You have to have one channel for each group of speakers. For a 2-way mono system, two channels. The problem is that most two channel amplifier don't give the option to make one channel low-pass and the other high-pass.
If you mean that you want to use the entire range of the volume control, that's OK for people who listen to golf games or public radio but is rarely an option for people who want to listen to music at high volumes unless they have a virtually unlimited budget.
Welll yyeah I guess so, it's just that Deep/punchy bass with lots of volume is exactly the reason I'm building the speaker. Thanks for telling me that.
Nope, not gonna use it in a vehicle, I'm going to carry it in my backpack, so I should go for a stereo system then?
Thanks a bunch for answering the questions that have been bothering me for so long now! Though, why do tweeters have to have their own separate enclosure? I was planning to have both the subwoofer and tweeters in the same chamber, does the "inconsistent" air pressure caused by the subwoofer inside the speaker enclosure cause distortions in the tweeters (smaller speakers) or something?
By the way, do you by chance know, if there would be any noticeable difference if I were to have 1 tweeter instead of 2?
I'm still kind of unsure with the channels, let's say I have 1 subwoofer and 2 tweeters, I could use 1st channel for the two tweeters, and the 2nd channel for the subwoofer?
What if I had 1 subwoofer and 1 tweeter? Does it stay the same as I mentioned previously?
Nope, not gonna use it in a vehicle, I'm going to carry it in my backpack, so I should go for a stereo system then?
Thanks a bunch for answering the questions that have been bothering me for so long now! Though, why do tweeters have to have their own separate enclosure? I was planning to have both the subwoofer and tweeters in the same chamber, does the "inconsistent" air pressure caused by the subwoofer inside the speaker enclosure cause distortions in the tweeters (smaller speakers) or something?
By the way, do you by chance know, if there would be any noticeable difference if I were to have 1 tweeter instead of 2?
I'm still kind of unsure with the channels, let's say I have 1 subwoofer and 2 tweeters, I could use 1st channel for the two tweeters, and the 2nd channel for the subwoofer?
What if I had 1 subwoofer and 1 tweeter? Does it stay the same as I mentioned previously?
You will NEVER get any significant level of low (sub) bass outside of the vehicle.
I was referring to the speakers I mentioned. Tweeters generally have a sealed back and therefore wouldn't require a separate chamber.
If you were using actual tweeters, it's not likely to sound good. There will be a huge gap in frequencies if you need to woofer to produce low frequency bass.
Is there a 2-channel amp that has separate crossovers for the two channels?
How do you define 'backpack'?
I was referring to the speakers I mentioned. Tweeters generally have a sealed back and therefore wouldn't require a separate chamber.
If you were using actual tweeters, it's not likely to sound good. There will be a huge gap in frequencies if you need to woofer to produce low frequency bass.
Is there a 2-channel amp that has separate crossovers for the two channels?
How do you define 'backpack'?
Tbh I'm not exactly trying to get any earth shattering bass. I have a W-KING D8 bluetooth speaker, not sure if you can find any info on it but I wanna have like, at least 5-10 times more powerful bass than it has.
Great that tweeters don't require a separate chamber, I just hope the sound comes out high quality with just a subwoofer and a tweeter.
Oh, so I'd have both the subwoofer and a tweeter or two underthe same channel?
And I meant literally a backpack, my speaker enclosure, as I mentioned before is only 12"X8"X10". That isn't very large, and I'm pretty sure it'd fit into a backpack which I'd carry on my back, although occassionally, I'll be having the speaker play in open air. Are you by chance implying that having speakers play in "kind of" confined space such as a backpack is harmful for the speakers? I have no idea what are the dangers of that except one fact I know is that the power handling increases, I think.
Great that tweeters don't require a separate chamber, I just hope the sound comes out high quality with just a subwoofer and a tweeter.
Oh, so I'd have both the subwoofer and a tweeter or two underthe same channel?
And I meant literally a backpack, my speaker enclosure, as I mentioned before is only 12"X8"X10". That isn't very large, and I'm pretty sure it'd fit into a backpack which I'd carry on my back, although occassionally, I'll be having the speaker play in open air. Are you by chance implying that having speakers play in "kind of" confined space such as a backpack is harmful for the speakers? I have no idea what are the dangers of that except one fact I know is that the power handling increases, I think.
How are you going to carry the batteries and amplifiers?
Having the speakers covered won't harm them but they will lose a lot of output.
MDF is heavy.
If you want decent sound at moderately high (or higher) levels, a tweeter and subwoofer alone (no mids) will not sound good.
Are you trying to impress others? If not, why not just get a good pair of headphones?
The small bluetooth systems are very highly engineered. The speakers are special. The enclosures are designed and tuned for those speakers.
Having the speakers covered won't harm them but they will lose a lot of output.
MDF is heavy.
If you want decent sound at moderately high (or higher) levels, a tweeter and subwoofer alone (no mids) will not sound good.
Are you trying to impress others? If not, why not just get a good pair of headphones?
The small bluetooth systems are very highly engineered. The speakers are special. The enclosures are designed and tuned for those speakers.
I thought the amplifier would be inside the speaker enclosure, including the batteries as well, I have a ton of 18650 batteries and a friend of mine would do all the wiring stuff. That kinda sucks, if I wanna have mids (a woofer) I'll automatically lose more bass because I'll have to have smaller speaker units (all of them) so that I could fit all of them with all of them having sufficient air volume in that same speaker enclosure.
Nope, not really trying to impress others, I just wanna have a portable speaker as powerful as possible which would safely fit into my speaker enclosure, for my own entertainment. Headphones are different, I wanna feel the bass punching any table I put my speaker on, my room as well, want it all to vibrate as well. Well you get the point, it's fine then, I'll do subwoofer, woofer and a tweeter.
By the way If I'd add passive radiators as well, I've heard they gotta have twice as much surface area on the speaker enclosure as there is the surface area of woofers, so I guess I'd put a single big passive radiator on each side wall of the speaker enclosure, subwoofer in the back, and woofer with the tweeter in the front. I've thought of having passive radiators because I've heard they increase that punchy bass, is it not worth it for me? Maybe I should just go with a sealed enclosure or a ported one?
Nope, not really trying to impress others, I just wanna have a portable speaker as powerful as possible which would safely fit into my speaker enclosure, for my own entertainment. Headphones are different, I wanna feel the bass punching any table I put my speaker on, my room as well, want it all to vibrate as well. Well you get the point, it's fine then, I'll do subwoofer, woofer and a tweeter.
By the way If I'd add passive radiators as well, I've heard they gotta have twice as much surface area on the speaker enclosure as there is the surface area of woofers, so I guess I'd put a single big passive radiator on each side wall of the speaker enclosure, subwoofer in the back, and woofer with the tweeter in the front. I've thought of having passive radiators because I've heard they increase that punchy bass, is it not worth it for me? Maybe I should just go with a sealed enclosure or a ported one?
I just found your current amp/speaker:
W-KING D8 50W Outdoor Portable TWS Bluetooth Speaker 8000mAh Battery Rich Bass | eBay
As mentioned above, highly engineered to give you what it offers now, for an impossibly low price.
Impossible to DIY emulate, even less beat, under your restraints:
* Battery power
* fits in a backpack
* at least 5-10 times more powerful bass than it has
You CAN build a system that blows it to bits **at home** (or in a car) where you have no supply power restraints, nor speaker cabinet size but niot in a backpack.
You mentioned 1000 to 5000 W amps.
Typical car amps lie through the nose, so those are probably 100 to 500W RMS, if that much.
Problem is that chemical (battery) stored energy is very poor, and "Battery power is the most expensive power available"
I bet those designers do wonders with their limited 8000 maH probably 3.7V batteries.
Even if they added up to 7.4V or even 10.1V (doubt they would go any higher) thy won´t have many hours play time (4-6-8 hours?) at current power amp rating (they claim 50W RMS 😕 ).
At "5-10 times" that, you would have less than 1 hour play time, if at all.
In a nutshell, you don´t have a woofer/tweeter/cabinet size problem, but one of: stored energy - efficiency - duration.
W-KING D8 50W Outdoor Portable TWS Bluetooth Speaker 8000mAh Battery Rich Bass | eBay
As mentioned above, highly engineered to give you what it offers now, for an impossibly low price.
Impossible to DIY emulate, even less beat, under your restraints:
* Battery power
* fits in a backpack
* at least 5-10 times more powerful bass than it has
You CAN build a system that blows it to bits **at home** (or in a car) where you have no supply power restraints, nor speaker cabinet size but niot in a backpack.
You mentioned 1000 to 5000 W amps.
Typical car amps lie through the nose, so those are probably 100 to 500W RMS, if that much.
Problem is that chemical (battery) stored energy is very poor, and "Battery power is the most expensive power available"
I bet those designers do wonders with their limited 8000 maH probably 3.7V batteries.
Even if they added up to 7.4V or even 10.1V (doubt they would go any higher) thy won´t have many hours play time (4-6-8 hours?) at current power amp rating (they claim 50W RMS 😕 ).
At "5-10 times" that, you would have less than 1 hour play time, if at all.
In a nutshell, you don´t have a woofer/tweeter/cabinet size problem, but one of: stored energy - efficiency - duration.
that's quite sad honestly, guess I won't be building a bluetooth speaker JUST YET, I'll wait a year or two more when my budget is no longer tight.
But wait, I said I wanted 5-10times more power output than my current amp/speaker, but those are my "ideals" only. In fact I would appreciate if you could tell me how many watt speaker units I could even fit into an enclosure like that. More like, given my enclosure dimensions (12"X8"X10"), what kind of subwoofer, woofer and a tweeter I should look for, how many watts, stuff like that. I know watts don't exactly represent the amount of volume emitted by a speaker, but since I'm a fresh beginner in the field of speakers, I'll stick with watts, as for you, feel free to use any terms, I'll google up on them.
I mentioned I have a ton of 18650 batteries, by that I meant about 200 of them
there is about 100 of 1k mAh, 60 of 2k mAh, and not sure how many 3k and 4k mAh,you know what's insane though? We have one 18650 battery with an impossible amount of mAh, 10800mAh, that battery's mAh were tested with a Liito Kala Lii-500.
Which all means I may be able to get more than 1hour of play time at all on 5-10 times. Besides, I won't be playing it max volume all the time, in fact, only 10-20% of the time I usually spend with friends having fun, which is about 30-50minutes.
Yeah my amp/speaker has 2x 25w woofers and 2x 10w tweeters, according to their official site.
So now that you know that, does the "stored energy - efficiency - duration" problem still persist?
But wait, I said I wanted 5-10times more power output than my current amp/speaker, but those are my "ideals" only. In fact I would appreciate if you could tell me how many watt speaker units I could even fit into an enclosure like that. More like, given my enclosure dimensions (12"X8"X10"), what kind of subwoofer, woofer and a tweeter I should look for, how many watts, stuff like that. I know watts don't exactly represent the amount of volume emitted by a speaker, but since I'm a fresh beginner in the field of speakers, I'll stick with watts, as for you, feel free to use any terms, I'll google up on them.
I mentioned I have a ton of 18650 batteries, by that I meant about 200 of them
there is about 100 of 1k mAh, 60 of 2k mAh, and not sure how many 3k and 4k mAh,you know what's insane though? We have one 18650 battery with an impossible amount of mAh, 10800mAh, that battery's mAh were tested with a Liito Kala Lii-500.
Which all means I may be able to get more than 1hour of play time at all on 5-10 times. Besides, I won't be playing it max volume all the time, in fact, only 10-20% of the time I usually spend with friends having fun, which is about 30-50minutes.
Yeah my amp/speaker has 2x 25w woofers and 2x 10w tweeters, according to their official site.
So now that you know that, does the "stored energy - efficiency - duration" problem still persist?
If you have specific questions, I'll try to answer them but I think this is a waste of time, except as a learning exercise.
I don't know if you have any experience with car audio but if you have, you'd know that subwoofers produce little bass out in the open. You can have four 12s and an amp that will produce VERY strong bass in the vehicle but if you take the enclosure out of the vehicle, they will produce almost no low bass.
It's probably not going to be practical to use the LiIon batteries.
18650 LiIon batteries top out at about 3500mAh. Anything higher is typically a fantasy.
I don't know if you have any experience with car audio but if you have, you'd know that subwoofers produce little bass out in the open. You can have four 12s and an amp that will produce VERY strong bass in the vehicle but if you take the enclosure out of the vehicle, they will produce almost no low bass.
It's probably not going to be practical to use the LiIon batteries.
18650 LiIon batteries top out at about 3500mAh. Anything higher is typically a fantasy.
Well alright then, I'll just buy a "special" bluetooth speaker instead of building one myself, I just thought I can get something of more power than I can buy commercially, if at least twice more power, then I'd say its worth building it.
I mean we can combine the batteries to make a powerhouse of 500k mAh, with that many 18650 batteries ya know. And yeah I know those batteries top out at 3500mAh, but that one was actually in fact 10800mAh, well, unless there was something wrong with that battery, it took an entire period of 24hours to test that one single battery's capacity. Well anyway, I guess we can end the discussion here then, thanks for the help!
I mean we can combine the batteries to make a powerhouse of 500k mAh, with that many 18650 batteries ya know. And yeah I know those batteries top out at 3500mAh, but that one was actually in fact 10800mAh, well, unless there was something wrong with that battery, it took an entire period of 24hours to test that one single battery's capacity. Well anyway, I guess we can end the discussion here then, thanks for the help!
If that single 18650 battery was indeed 10k+ mAh, battery manufacturers would pay a fortune for it.
Batteries in a series/parallel pack require a balancer to make sure that each battery is properly charged.
As was stated before, there is a lot of engineering in these bluetooth speakers. They use specialized amplifier ICs, speakers, enclosures, power sources... ALL are chosen/designed to optimize the output.
Batteries in a series/parallel pack require a balancer to make sure that each battery is properly charged.
As was stated before, there is a lot of engineering in these bluetooth speakers. They use specialized amplifier ICs, speakers, enclosures, power sources... ALL are chosen/designed to optimize the output.
Oh whoa thanks for telling me that!
Yeah, that makes sense, and I'm definitely not using such electronics, and without them, it won't sound as "special". So yeah, I'll just buy something portable and powerful
Yeah, that makes sense, and I'm definitely not using such electronics, and without them, it won't sound as "special". So yeah, I'll just buy something portable and powerful
As a coda, let me chime in as a loudspeaker engineer that yeah it will be REALLY REALLY hard to make your own backpack thing better than something you could buy. The plastic enclosures a manufacturer can tool up may not be the perfect enclosures but have huge advantages of weight and thinness over using MDF. And with bracing ribs can be pretty good. The drivers are usually specialized as well, and some incorporate special DSP to filter out the lowest notes yet emphasize their overtones to give an illusion of low bass. That said, look at Parts Express: Speakers, Amplifiers, Audio Parts and Solutions for all manner of speaker drivers and Bluetooth amps.
- Don't use a car stereo amp, the DC-DC converter costs you efficiency
- Forget "subwoofer" that enclosure is too small. A left woofer + tweeter and a right woofer + tweeter and away you go!
- Maybe you can use some kind of premade plastic container, like a small cooler or something from here Military Surplus Containers | Military Storage Containers and Boxes at Coleman's
- Don't use a car stereo amp, the DC-DC converter costs you efficiency
- Forget "subwoofer" that enclosure is too small. A left woofer + tweeter and a right woofer + tweeter and away you go!
- Maybe you can use some kind of premade plastic container, like a small cooler or something from here Military Surplus Containers | Military Storage Containers and Boxes at Coleman's