http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/viewtopic.php?p=210664
Can his critique possibly be based on the current crop of Class-D amplifiers?
Can his critique possibly be based on the current crop of Class-D amplifiers?
AVA who? Oh, does he sell 32 watt glowee's? No wonder I never heard of him.
Seriously though, that's a marketing forum, which I gather he owns, and his comments are obviously based on the "my products aren't class d" basis. If he could produce a good class D i'm sure he'd do so, but why would he go to that effort when there's already a market for him.
BTW, noticed in the first few posts someone's argument for class d started with "my Red Wine..".
Anyone who buys one of those overlypriced ($1 500) 20$ sonic impacts is a complete
That's right I said it, and I was being kind too.
How do they even sell them? I know I know... OH OH I know... OH Can I??? It got a good review.
You'd think, you'd like to think, modding a sonic impact isn't such rocket science that in order to .. aaah, what's the point. I quiit.
BTW, I have some "Ultra" black gates for sale. Before you can have them, you first must prove your worthyness with proof of ownership of a RedWine product, Nuforce, or others yet to be determined.
What I've done is give them my special powercoat process which is the culmination of 20 years experience. First I cut off the PVC jacket (with parental guidance) releaving them of such stress that they can be heard to giggle like the dough boy.
I then pre trimmed and tinned the leads using my very own highly developped techniques, entirely unique with those of anyone else's (no one has my particular Iron or side cutters, battle seasoned in hell fire at the cost of a one way) and cryo hardened them but at their zero temp co.
As you know the stock of BG's is rapidly depleting as all production has ceased, and I've had many calls about these. They've made such a difference in my own life that I decided to share them with the world at virtually no profit to me. For three easy payments starting at the low low price of only 499.95 (for 10V 10uF and up), you too can be the proud owner of them and share in this very unique and special experience which is taking the industry by storm.
Don't wait! BUY NOW.
I Like Whiskey Inc.
Dial:
1-800-
Seriously though, that's a marketing forum, which I gather he owns, and his comments are obviously based on the "my products aren't class d" basis. If he could produce a good class D i'm sure he'd do so, but why would he go to that effort when there's already a market for him.
BTW, noticed in the first few posts someone's argument for class d started with "my Red Wine..".
Anyone who buys one of those overlypriced ($1 500) 20$ sonic impacts is a complete
That's right I said it, and I was being kind too.How do they even sell them? I know I know... OH OH I know... OH Can I??? It got a good review.
You'd think, you'd like to think, modding a sonic impact isn't such rocket science that in order to .. aaah, what's the point. I quiit.
BTW, I have some "Ultra" black gates for sale. Before you can have them, you first must prove your worthyness with proof of ownership of a RedWine product, Nuforce, or others yet to be determined.
What I've done is give them my special powercoat process which is the culmination of 20 years experience. First I cut off the PVC jacket (with parental guidance) releaving them of such stress that they can be heard to giggle like the dough boy.
I then pre trimmed and tinned the leads using my very own highly developped techniques, entirely unique with those of anyone else's (no one has my particular Iron or side cutters, battle seasoned in hell fire at the cost of a one way) and cryo hardened them but at their zero temp co.
As you know the stock of BG's is rapidly depleting as all production has ceased, and I've had many calls about these. They've made such a difference in my own life that I decided to share them with the world at virtually no profit to me. For three easy payments starting at the low low price of only 499.95 (for 10V 10uF and up), you too can be the proud owner of them and share in this very unique and special experience which is taking the industry by storm.
Don't wait! BUY NOW.
I Like Whiskey Inc.
Dial:
1-800-
Pffffsttt... <spills morning coffee on screen and keyboard>, right on the money Chris, that's not a forum 🙂
Best regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Best regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
this ava guy knows how to sell an amp 🙂 :
"This stunning amplifier is for those demanding musical reproduction that is not reproduction at all, but is best described as a ticket to the performance. You are going to want to dress up and be handed the program before touching the power switch (it really raises the curtains) and then watch the concertmaster rise and the conductor stride in. Close your eyes and you are there."
anyway his amps looks good and i would like to hear one ... but when you see the size of the beast ....
a guy who sells amp like this is not gonna like tiny amps with tiny transformers that produces a sound as big as his big beasts.
"This stunning amplifier is for those demanding musical reproduction that is not reproduction at all, but is best described as a ticket to the performance. You are going to want to dress up and be handed the program before touching the power switch (it really raises the curtains) and then watch the concertmaster rise and the conductor stride in. Close your eyes and you are there."
anyway his amps looks good and i would like to hear one ... but when you see the size of the beast ....
a guy who sells amp like this is not gonna like tiny amps with tiny transformers that produces a sound as big as his big beasts.
Hi,
Oh, it's a forum, just not one to my liking. For example I dont' think I could get away with saying the following over there:
This AVA guy, clearly has a niche because people love the tube sound. Why? The ability for tubes to clip softly hence sound OK while seriously overdriven (guitar guys love em "loud" etc), or their adding copious amounts of second order harmonic distortion, and hey, they glow. People are as dazzled by that as a deer in the headlights. Must be magic.
So yeah, he's got his market. I think it's a shame he's not secure enough in his convictions with the technology he's selling that he has to dump on class d in a less than intelligent way, pretending he's got a set of magic ears no one else has, in order to secure his market. I feel in the end this will get him lost as class d, not even continues to progress, but simply continues to have the word spread that it's already arrived (read as sonically superior), and far cheaper. He's seeing that happening right now and seemingly fails to realize it. Just read that post to see what I mean, people were asking for a tube class d.
At least his proposed amp will be on par on a cost and perhaps wattage basis as the RedDrunk Sonic Impact. So he's still competitive with class d in that respect, to be kind.
Personally I like my sound reproduced as true to the source as possible, which is my understanding of audiophile/hi-fi. In that respect tubes don't qualify.
I'm not going to say they sound like a piece of old meat tastes cooked in the microwave, I've never even heard a tube, technically though, they're synanomous with a sonic security blanket, and I can totally "afford" to pass that up.
So as far as tickets to the performance goes, I'd rather be in the band than sitting in the nosebleed section, cursing these overpriced tickets.
Let them have their forum. Mac should not have even posted that here, but it is entertaining, and I've seen him tick off the nuforce guys before (you should have provided them with patent #'s though mac, I sure would have) 🙂
Salut,
Chris
Oh, it's a forum, just not one to my liking. For example I dont' think I could get away with saying the following over there:
This AVA guy, clearly has a niche because people love the tube sound. Why? The ability for tubes to clip softly hence sound OK while seriously overdriven (guitar guys love em "loud" etc), or their adding copious amounts of second order harmonic distortion, and hey, they glow. People are as dazzled by that as a deer in the headlights. Must be magic.
So yeah, he's got his market. I think it's a shame he's not secure enough in his convictions with the technology he's selling that he has to dump on class d in a less than intelligent way, pretending he's got a set of magic ears no one else has, in order to secure his market. I feel in the end this will get him lost as class d, not even continues to progress, but simply continues to have the word spread that it's already arrived (read as sonically superior), and far cheaper. He's seeing that happening right now and seemingly fails to realize it. Just read that post to see what I mean, people were asking for a tube class d.
At least his proposed amp will be on par on a cost and perhaps wattage basis as the RedDrunk Sonic Impact. So he's still competitive with class d in that respect, to be kind.
Personally I like my sound reproduced as true to the source as possible, which is my understanding of audiophile/hi-fi. In that respect tubes don't qualify.
I'm not going to say they sound like a piece of old meat tastes cooked in the microwave, I've never even heard a tube, technically though, they're synanomous with a sonic security blanket, and I can totally "afford" to pass that up.
So as far as tickets to the performance goes, I'd rather be in the band than sitting in the nosebleed section, cursing these overpriced tickets.
Let them have their forum. Mac should not have even posted that here, but it is entertaining, and I've seen him tick off the nuforce guys before (you should have provided them with patent #'s though mac, I sure would have) 🙂
Salut,
Chris
AVA is Frank Van Alstine. This was the comment I was referring to:
Switching amps, all that I have heard, come to my shop with great expectations, measure with a big band of wide range "fuzz" on the top of the scope trace, and sound like reheated frozen Budget Gormet dinners.
Nasty is all I can say so far.
Switching amps, all that I have heard, come to my shop with great expectations, measure with a big band of wide range "fuzz" on the top of the scope trace, and sound like reheated frozen Budget Gormet dinners.
Nasty is all I can say so far.
Hahaha,
Bold statement to make, I'm just wondering where the benchmark is at? Is he comparing to his own creations? People that utter such statements I place in one of the following categories: 1) ignorant, close-minded people that long since lost the ability to try and experience new things or 2) people with an agenda that aim to steer others towards certain purchases. In this case both might even apply. For me the case is simple; I'll take a nice UcD class-D amplifier over any tube-amplifier or hybrid, as I'd like my amplifier to stick to the original recording and not add or substract from it the one amp that is very capable of doing that is a class-D one.
Best regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Bold statement to make, I'm just wondering where the benchmark is at? Is he comparing to his own creations? People that utter such statements I place in one of the following categories: 1) ignorant, close-minded people that long since lost the ability to try and experience new things or 2) people with an agenda that aim to steer others towards certain purchases. In this case both might even apply. For me the case is simple; I'll take a nice UcD class-D amplifier over any tube-amplifier or hybrid, as I'd like my amplifier to stick to the original recording and not add or substract from it the one amp that is very capable of doing that is a class-D one.
Best regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
mac said:
Frank Van who? Seriously, never heard of the guy, I'm not trying to be funny, but I'm not into tubes, reviewers, or audiocircle. I'm just happy in my little class d bubble.
Those were obviously the comments which were being addressed.
Seriously I'm not going to pick on him. Who cares what kind of class d he supposedly measured (correctly?) or even heard. What gives credence to his opinion in your world, for that matter? Is audio not a purely subjective experience? Is he not fully entitled to a subjective view which differs from any other?
More realistically, as I sort of stated already, he sells tube amps.... what would you have him say? "Class D is the shizzle... let me get on that project for you". I know, you didn't start that thread, not your fault, but you did start this one.
Wouldn't AVA not be the one to ask which class d amps he's supposedly auditioned? Is this just an attempt at a flame war?
Consider it marketing and move on, I'm not losing sleep over it.
Regards,
Chris
SSassen said:
Hi,
Same here, as far as tube/class d hybrids are concerned I chalk that up to pure gimmickery, doesnt' interest me in the least.
Besides, even it could be done right for a full range amp, it would remove the "pleasing" distortions inherent with tubes, they'd only have the warm glow left. What I see over there are people with more $ than sense asking for this. Let them build it themselves I say.
Regards,
Chris
All i have to say, and i'm getting sick of saying it now is:-
ClassD DOES sound very good indeed.
ClassD DOES cover the entire audio band and more >60KHz ( ClassD is for life, not just for subwoofers ).
ClassD DOES NOT sound harsh, samply or have any audible artifacts embedded in the sound.
ClassD IS very quiet in the background.
In my opinion the different techonologies line up as follows:-
Best:- ClassD
Runner up:- ClassA
Third:- ClassA/B
Worst:- Any class that utilises valves in the power stages.
I'll dissapear back into my corner now. 🙂
Regards
Mad.P
ClassD DOES sound very good indeed.
ClassD DOES cover the entire audio band and more >60KHz ( ClassD is for life, not just for subwoofers ).
ClassD DOES NOT sound harsh, samply or have any audible artifacts embedded in the sound.
ClassD IS very quiet in the background.
In my opinion the different techonologies line up as follows:-
Best:- ClassD
Runner up:- ClassA
Third:- ClassA/B
Worst:- Any class that utilises valves in the power stages.
I'll dissapear back into my corner now. 🙂
Regards
Mad.P
Aloha guys,
Well... while everyone is flailing their arms, kicking the pets and furniture and throwing a great fit - let me jump right in!
Fun!
Marketing is what marketing does. We live in world overrun with marketing types. How you gonna compete? Market more! You can't blame the guy for trying to sell his stuff, even if it is thru hyperbole.
Frank Van Alstine has been in the Hi-Fi biz a long time, he at least has experience. Doesn't mean he doesn't have prejudices, tho. Sure would like to know what class-D he has compared to what.
Why do you guys like to bash tubes so much? I see this on other forums, too. Have you ever heard a really good tube amp? They are extremely neutral, transparent, detailed, dynamic and nuanced. The best have no hint of coloration or distortion and isn't that what we like about Class-D? I've listened to a lot of tube gear over the years and found the sound to be all over the map, more so than with SS. The old MacIntosh stuff was king of the "tube" sound. Not neutral, not detailed, very euphonic - but great fun to listen to.
Judging all tube amps by some overly "tubie" ones you may have heard (the current trend) is as bad as judging all Class-D by the bad ones. Don't you think?
As for RedWine audio. What can you say? When I first saw those things I couldn't believe it either. Wildly, vastly, insanely overpriced. Especially the original Clari-T. But it did get me to launch my own line of Tripath amps. Now that I've been building for a few months I understand the prices a little better. It's a LOT of work! So now I just think the RedWine stuff is "way overpriced." 😉
Audio is a science, but it's also a passion. I love Class-D, but I won't stick my head up my backside. Whatever class it is, it has to sound good. My bet is that with top notch amps, you could be easily fooled into believing that one technology or class is the other. I know I have.
OK, back to kicking and flailing!
Well... while everyone is flailing their arms, kicking the pets and furniture and throwing a great fit - let me jump right in!
Fun!Marketing is what marketing does. We live in world overrun with marketing types. How you gonna compete? Market more! You can't blame the guy for trying to sell his stuff, even if it is thru hyperbole.
Frank Van Alstine has been in the Hi-Fi biz a long time, he at least has experience. Doesn't mean he doesn't have prejudices, tho. Sure would like to know what class-D he has compared to what.
Why do you guys like to bash tubes so much? I see this on other forums, too. Have you ever heard a really good tube amp? They are extremely neutral, transparent, detailed, dynamic and nuanced. The best have no hint of coloration or distortion and isn't that what we like about Class-D? I've listened to a lot of tube gear over the years and found the sound to be all over the map, more so than with SS. The old MacIntosh stuff was king of the "tube" sound. Not neutral, not detailed, very euphonic - but great fun to listen to.
Judging all tube amps by some overly "tubie" ones you may have heard (the current trend) is as bad as judging all Class-D by the bad ones. Don't you think?
As for RedWine audio. What can you say? When I first saw those things I couldn't believe it either. Wildly, vastly, insanely overpriced. Especially the original Clari-T. But it did get me to launch my own line of Tripath amps. Now that I've been building for a few months I understand the prices a little better. It's a LOT of work! So now I just think the RedWine stuff is "way overpriced." 😉
Audio is a science, but it's also a passion. I love Class-D, but I won't stick my head up my backside. Whatever class it is, it has to sound good. My bet is that with top notch amps, you could be easily fooled into believing that one technology or class is the other. I know I have.
OK, back to kicking and flailing!
panomaniac said:
Unfortunately I haven't heard one that doesn't color the sound. Maybe I've been unlucky.
How long does that good tube sound last? The tube amp manuals I read say to retube every 6 months to a year.
Does anybody have any real specs on tube wear?
Or for that matter mosfet wear in class-d or any solid state amp?
I don't know how long tubes last, but they sure do "burn in" faster than SS! Har -har! 😀
It must be good to change tubes every 6 months - if you sell tubes.
It must be good to change tubes every 6 months - if you sell tubes.
I change my tubes when they begin to sound worse than solid state. Maybe I'm just lucky, but using this criterion, my tubes last and last and last and last.
So the tube amp changes sound over time ? Is there any published data on tube wear? If it was class-d would it not be affected by the wear as much as ab?
So I have to ask - a tube head will point out that transistors also wear out. I can find no truth to this. I've never heard of someone re-transistoring their amp to get it back to factory sound condition. Is there any data on Transistor wear? Standard amps and Class-D?
Seems like Class-d would have much less wear on devices.
So I have to ask - a tube head will point out that transistors also wear out. I can find no truth to this. I've never heard of someone re-transistoring their amp to get it back to factory sound condition. Is there any data on Transistor wear? Standard amps and Class-D?
Seems like Class-d would have much less wear on devices.
I'm guessing it has to do with how far they're biased into the SOA. With class D is seems as long as properly chosen and with overcurrent protection, basically all things done right, I doubt they'd ever wear (breakdown).
I have heard of people claiming BJT's wearing when I was complaining about crackling my old Pioneer amp was making, told me to replace all output stage transistors, and said it was common. I don't think they diagnosed it right, I later found crackes in the solder around the PSU caps, but it was well cooked by then.
I think either driven/biased properly will last forever, unless they're those knock off rebrands etc.
I'd have to research tubes more before I could intelligently comment on them so I'll leave it someone else.
Serengetiplains, I'm going to show you that post, when you get your UCD running 🙂
Regards,
Chris
I have heard of people claiming BJT's wearing when I was complaining about crackling my old Pioneer amp was making, told me to replace all output stage transistors, and said it was common. I don't think they diagnosed it right, I later found crackes in the solder around the PSU caps, but it was well cooked by then.
I think either driven/biased properly will last forever, unless they're those knock off rebrands etc.
I'd have to research tubes more before I could intelligently comment on them so I'll leave it someone else.
Serengetiplains, I'm going to show you that post, when you get your UCD running 🙂
Regards,
Chris
regarding musicality of ucd 180 modules
I have been planning to post my point of view and in this case of my dear friend that stopped by to see this wonder I so much anticipated to hear.
I never listen to him or anybody, and if I am being sincerely, because I like to suffer, enjoy, hear, smell, touch etc. things by my own, I like the idea of unique own experience and then share and compare it if you like with others. So I do not get biased from outher world too much. Hence the much driven cosumption euphory and marketing forcfullness...
Anyway, I got Ucd180 and Ucd400 modules with power supply and all. No volume pot though. They had a bad, a bit noisy transfomer and were expecting a new one (never figured it out why did not the guy that is also a general provider for Hypex here, order also the original transformers ??). So they were not perfect from the start but still pretty well assembled. I have a semi good marantz cd53 with all internal and external mods, an old MF A1- renewed and very good front horned (spherical plastic moulded 180Hz tractrix) Fostex FE206E heavily modified speakers and a sub with Eminence beta12LT driver. I ran the subs plugged in the UCDs and other time separately with an good old Rotel amp.
The sound: all you say but also what mr. Nick Whetstone from TNT audio said about other lower range switching amp with Tripath chips.
The sound is great if your ears and brains don´t hear the odd decay and ungraceful and sometimes rather unmusical, uninvolving sound. When I heard all the amps my friend makes (he makes them for a joke, like factory-when he is interested in a new amp he makes it in a blink of an eye) being that tubes or A class solid state devices (Pass, Tumos...) they all had magic and realism on palm of their sounding hands. Ucd did not.
Maybe realism in some sort of way but the bodies and timbre on some instruments is, eh, don´t spit on me, but...digital grey. They are still WOW remarkable on techincality (you will not find a mistake on particular levels) but as a whole, they still sound unnatural, too forceful, brassy and bold but lacking a bit of euphony, roundness. In my system that is. They also portrayed-and I link this with the false rendering of instrument bodies- an soundstage that is wide as it could be but lacking in depth and real 3D. Everything in the sound picture was very still and brutaly stoic. It was like the players in soundstage did not enjoy playing but were all dressed up well and determined to perfecty play all the notes one by one while incidentely missing the point of "play". I remember thinking of them like an amp that is in reality something like a horn for the high Qts speakers.
The clean, vivid but stoic sound has an transparency issue I have discussed about with this friend of mine that was laughing by my side as he was convinced once for all that he will peacefully continue with tubes and A class solid states making as this amps were a dissapointment (and in the same time a point of joyful confirmation) for him. We found out that like with loudspeakers with high eff. that are also rather clean and vivid and play loud without much distortion their little brothers suffer they usually have sound depth disantvantges (in range and protraying of 3D elements-transparency) this amps also portrayed similar picture of sound. You remember when reviewer always say, that when they switch back to normal efficency speakers they aplaude their winning transparency and depth of soundstage compared of dynamic and forward sound of the effiecent ones? It is like the story changed the book. Clean, clear and strong UCDs but also with ungraceful edges and unnatural decay of tone.
Unnatural as they stop with no reverb in space and time. They stop like a fine blade´s cut - like there is nothing beyond this cut- no subharmonic, no hum no air tickling away in space. When you combine, say in orchestral music, several compressed (that is what I call them now) decays and musical bodies lacking some of the air around them and one bad portrayed side of body dimension, you get a weird piece of music. First OK, after a while sceptic. For me the right words are: non homogenic, not organic, low on musicality and tone portrayal. Music for calculating head but not faster truth searching heart.
I thought I would finally get rid of all hot heating monstrums from the past of hi-fi legacy but it seems that this is not the case right now. I could not live with this amps. I am in very bad shape right now, when writing this as I really thought I had an amp I always wanted - fast and cold running, with warmth of tubes and grace of A class etc. - because I read all the hype on forums and some good reviews all around. It is a compromise like all other stuff but more so. These are not music maker amps but technicaly almost perfect sounding devices.
But I remain positive - these are the future, with some time on their shoulder all of this should be gone or diminuish to the point of unhearable.
waiting for...
t11
I have been planning to post my point of view and in this case of my dear friend that stopped by to see this wonder I so much anticipated to hear.
I never listen to him or anybody, and if I am being sincerely, because I like to suffer, enjoy, hear, smell, touch etc. things by my own, I like the idea of unique own experience and then share and compare it if you like with others. So I do not get biased from outher world too much. Hence the much driven cosumption euphory and marketing forcfullness...
Anyway, I got Ucd180 and Ucd400 modules with power supply and all. No volume pot though. They had a bad, a bit noisy transfomer and were expecting a new one (never figured it out why did not the guy that is also a general provider for Hypex here, order also the original transformers ??). So they were not perfect from the start but still pretty well assembled. I have a semi good marantz cd53 with all internal and external mods, an old MF A1- renewed and very good front horned (spherical plastic moulded 180Hz tractrix) Fostex FE206E heavily modified speakers and a sub with Eminence beta12LT driver. I ran the subs plugged in the UCDs and other time separately with an good old Rotel amp.
The sound: all you say but also what mr. Nick Whetstone from TNT audio said about other lower range switching amp with Tripath chips.
The sound is great if your ears and brains don´t hear the odd decay and ungraceful and sometimes rather unmusical, uninvolving sound. When I heard all the amps my friend makes (he makes them for a joke, like factory-when he is interested in a new amp he makes it in a blink of an eye) being that tubes or A class solid state devices (Pass, Tumos...) they all had magic and realism on palm of their sounding hands. Ucd did not.
Maybe realism in some sort of way but the bodies and timbre on some instruments is, eh, don´t spit on me, but...digital grey. They are still WOW remarkable on techincality (you will not find a mistake on particular levels) but as a whole, they still sound unnatural, too forceful, brassy and bold but lacking a bit of euphony, roundness. In my system that is. They also portrayed-and I link this with the false rendering of instrument bodies- an soundstage that is wide as it could be but lacking in depth and real 3D. Everything in the sound picture was very still and brutaly stoic. It was like the players in soundstage did not enjoy playing but were all dressed up well and determined to perfecty play all the notes one by one while incidentely missing the point of "play". I remember thinking of them like an amp that is in reality something like a horn for the high Qts speakers.
The clean, vivid but stoic sound has an transparency issue I have discussed about with this friend of mine that was laughing by my side as he was convinced once for all that he will peacefully continue with tubes and A class solid states making as this amps were a dissapointment (and in the same time a point of joyful confirmation) for him. We found out that like with loudspeakers with high eff. that are also rather clean and vivid and play loud without much distortion their little brothers suffer they usually have sound depth disantvantges (in range and protraying of 3D elements-transparency) this amps also portrayed similar picture of sound. You remember when reviewer always say, that when they switch back to normal efficency speakers they aplaude their winning transparency and depth of soundstage compared of dynamic and forward sound of the effiecent ones? It is like the story changed the book. Clean, clear and strong UCDs but also with ungraceful edges and unnatural decay of tone.
Unnatural as they stop with no reverb in space and time. They stop like a fine blade´s cut - like there is nothing beyond this cut- no subharmonic, no hum no air tickling away in space. When you combine, say in orchestral music, several compressed (that is what I call them now) decays and musical bodies lacking some of the air around them and one bad portrayed side of body dimension, you get a weird piece of music. First OK, after a while sceptic. For me the right words are: non homogenic, not organic, low on musicality and tone portrayal. Music for calculating head but not faster truth searching heart.
I thought I would finally get rid of all hot heating monstrums from the past of hi-fi legacy but it seems that this is not the case right now. I could not live with this amps. I am in very bad shape right now, when writing this as I really thought I had an amp I always wanted - fast and cold running, with warmth of tubes and grace of A class etc. - because I read all the hype on forums and some good reviews all around. It is a compromise like all other stuff but more so. These are not music maker amps but technicaly almost perfect sounding devices.
But I remain positive - these are the future, with some time on their shoulder all of this should be gone or diminuish to the point of unhearable.
waiting for...
t11
"These are not music maker amps but technicaly almost perfect sounding devices"
sure, musicians are music makers, not amps.
"Music for calculating head but not faster truth searching heart.
"
as a professional musician i know where my hearth is, i don't need an amp that makes music instead of the musicians, wich i find is the weird thing about all this "audiophile" thing.
is this a frustration about music ? i spend most of my time making music or listening to music live and when i listen to music at my home i know that i am listening to a recording. I don't ask the recording neither the amps neither the loudspeakers to bring the emotion.
I have the emotion, and the music do too.
I could listen to music on shitty loudspeakers and enjoy it (right now i'm listening to music on my laptop's speakers and believe me it's difficult to find worse speakers). But on the other side i know that my pleasure would be bigger if i have a good sound, and its why i spend time in the conception of my system. With this conception , an amp SHOULD be a perfect sounding device.
Calling this calculating head is what shows the stupidity of it all, someone who wants to enjoy music with as little "musical" modification of the signal IS a music lover
someone who trust that the music and the pleasure is in his amps and speaker IS an audiophile , you can put all the words you want on musicality of an amp, i would always prefer enjoying the music.
sure, musicians are music makers, not amps.
"Music for calculating head but not faster truth searching heart.
"
as a professional musician i know where my hearth is, i don't need an amp that makes music instead of the musicians, wich i find is the weird thing about all this "audiophile" thing.
is this a frustration about music ? i spend most of my time making music or listening to music live and when i listen to music at my home i know that i am listening to a recording. I don't ask the recording neither the amps neither the loudspeakers to bring the emotion.
I have the emotion, and the music do too.
I could listen to music on shitty loudspeakers and enjoy it (right now i'm listening to music on my laptop's speakers and believe me it's difficult to find worse speakers). But on the other side i know that my pleasure would be bigger if i have a good sound, and its why i spend time in the conception of my system. With this conception , an amp SHOULD be a perfect sounding device.
Calling this calculating head is what shows the stupidity of it all, someone who wants to enjoy music with as little "musical" modification of the signal IS a music lover
someone who trust that the music and the pleasure is in his amps and speaker IS an audiophile , you can put all the words you want on musicality of an amp, i would always prefer enjoying the music.
T11,
Nail on the head, the Hypex amplifiers are very neutral, the other amplifiers you compared them to aren't, they add or substract something from the sound that to your ears makes them add 'emotion'. This has nothing to do with a faithful reproduction of the actual recording, if the original recording doesn't have 'emotion' so shouldn't the reproduction.
Furthermore the Hypex amplifiers need a bit of modification to unlock their full potential, remember they're sold at a bargain price to begin with. Right now you're listening to two 25-cent capacitors that are in the signal path and you might even have the ST version of the UcD180 and UcD400 which uses a run-of-the-mill $1 opamp rather than the much more capable AD8620.
Best regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Nail on the head, the Hypex amplifiers are very neutral, the other amplifiers you compared them to aren't, they add or substract something from the sound that to your ears makes them add 'emotion'. This has nothing to do with a faithful reproduction of the actual recording, if the original recording doesn't have 'emotion' so shouldn't the reproduction.
Furthermore the Hypex amplifiers need a bit of modification to unlock their full potential, remember they're sold at a bargain price to begin with. Right now you're listening to two 25-cent capacitors that are in the signal path and you might even have the ST version of the UcD180 and UcD400 which uses a run-of-the-mill $1 opamp rather than the much more capable AD8620.
Best regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
"Unnatural as they stop with no reverb in space and time. They stop like a fine blade´s cut - like there is nothing beyond this cut- no subharmonic, no hum no air tickling away in space."
So I take it that some "audiophile" prefers to hear sounds that are not supposed to be in the recording.
Scientifically such a reproduction is flawed, just like my older systems did. They put sounds that are not in the recordings and that invariably have been giving me ear-aches and headaches after about 15 minutes of audition. Tripath amps - their reference design modules - also gave me headaches.
I listen many hours a day to rather loud music reproduced by NuForce ref8's. Not only I get no headaches but also oftentime I keep listening to the same CD many times (out of laziness) and still get mesmerized by some soprano singers' voices. Incidentally I asked a "Golden Ear" to put another CD on his expensive system - Usher's top-of-the-line speakers, Marantz CDP, Ref9s, huge cables etc... - The sound is fine but I don't care for the material on most of his CD collection.
So give me true reproduction and well-recorded heavenly music.
So I take it that some "audiophile" prefers to hear sounds that are not supposed to be in the recording.
Scientifically such a reproduction is flawed, just like my older systems did. They put sounds that are not in the recordings and that invariably have been giving me ear-aches and headaches after about 15 minutes of audition. Tripath amps - their reference design modules - also gave me headaches.
I listen many hours a day to rather loud music reproduced by NuForce ref8's. Not only I get no headaches but also oftentime I keep listening to the same CD many times (out of laziness) and still get mesmerized by some soprano singers' voices. Incidentally I asked a "Golden Ear" to put another CD on his expensive system - Usher's top-of-the-line speakers, Marantz CDP, Ref9s, huge cables etc... - The sound is fine but I don't care for the material on most of his CD collection.
So give me true reproduction and well-recorded heavenly music.
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