Need to select an attenuator for my Aikido octal build. These look like they are built very nice but there is little info on them. Anybody using them yet? Do you know if they are series or ladder design?
Also I'm not sure of the value to use.
Thanks for any and all help.
BillWojo
Also I'm not sure of the value to use.
Thanks for any and all help.
BillWojo
Are you asking about EISS or EIZZ? If the latter, go to EIZZ Premium 24-Step Stereo Attenuator HIFI Volume Potentiometer LOG 100K 250K | eBay
The pictures there show that it is the series type. Besides the fancy-looking housing, it does not seem that different from some much cheaper series-type attenuators on eBay.
Kurt
The pictures there show that it is the series type. Besides the fancy-looking housing, it does not seem that different from some much cheaper series-type attenuators on eBay.
Kurt
Thanks Kurt, and your correct EIZZ! I like the idea of a ladder style because only two resistor's are in the circuit. The Kozmo unit is beautiful but very pricey. Even the Goldpoint is out of my budget. I see the Valab on Ebay, a true ladder type for only 28.00 bucks. Has anyone ever used it? Seems awfully cheap.
BillWojo
BillWojo
Products-Bairiko Technology Co., Ltd.
It looks like they are not only have 24 steps version but also 32 steps version.
EIZZ does looks beautiful and cheaper them Kozmo, Goldpoint or DACT.
However, I can rarely find comments from internet about them even in Chinese.
It looks like they are not only have 24 steps version but also 32 steps version.
EIZZ does looks beautiful and cheaper them Kozmo, Goldpoint or DACT.
However, I can rarely find comments from internet about them even in Chinese.
I have been playing with some home-made and eBay-bought cheap step attenuators, both series and ladder types, and I cannot say that I have found any sonic advantage to the ladder type. The "only two resistors in the path" idea sounds quite appealing, but it a bit too simplistic.
Consider the example of a ladder type attenuator set at a give position (out of N positions), and a series type attenuator (also of N positions) that is set at a position that gives the same voltage-divider result, and has M resistors in the top part of the voltage divider and N-M-1 resistors in the bottom part. Conceptually, one can think of the top resistor in the ladder type resistor as having M segments, and each segment is in effect a resistor. Alternatively, one can think of the M resistors in the series type attenuator as one big resistor, and the N-M-1 resistors as another big resistor. So, in effect, there are only two "big resistors" in the series type attenuator at any given position. How is that conceptually different from the ladder type?
One may argue that all the connection paths and soldered contacts between the individual resistors in the series type attenuator would make a sonic difference, but I have not heard any such effects, or seen any evidence produced by others of such effects.
In terms of construction, however, I actually see advantages of the series type. First, the series type uses fewer resistors. Second, the series type is much more compact. Third, all the resistors in the series type are used in any given position of the attenuator, so the attenuator does not have any unused/unselected resistor dangling around. In contrast, in the ladder type attenuator with the typical stereo 4-pole construction, at any give time, there are N-1 resistors dangling on the input side and N-1 resistors dangling on the output side. Do those dangling resistors have any impact on the sonic? I don't know, but at least the capacitance of the attenuator would be affected.
Just a long-winded way of saying that I am not sure a series-type attenuator is inherently inferior to a ladder type attenuator.
Kurt
Consider the example of a ladder type attenuator set at a give position (out of N positions), and a series type attenuator (also of N positions) that is set at a position that gives the same voltage-divider result, and has M resistors in the top part of the voltage divider and N-M-1 resistors in the bottom part. Conceptually, one can think of the top resistor in the ladder type resistor as having M segments, and each segment is in effect a resistor. Alternatively, one can think of the M resistors in the series type attenuator as one big resistor, and the N-M-1 resistors as another big resistor. So, in effect, there are only two "big resistors" in the series type attenuator at any given position. How is that conceptually different from the ladder type?
One may argue that all the connection paths and soldered contacts between the individual resistors in the series type attenuator would make a sonic difference, but I have not heard any such effects, or seen any evidence produced by others of such effects.
In terms of construction, however, I actually see advantages of the series type. First, the series type uses fewer resistors. Second, the series type is much more compact. Third, all the resistors in the series type are used in any given position of the attenuator, so the attenuator does not have any unused/unselected resistor dangling around. In contrast, in the ladder type attenuator with the typical stereo 4-pole construction, at any give time, there are N-1 resistors dangling on the input side and N-1 resistors dangling on the output side. Do those dangling resistors have any impact on the sonic? I don't know, but at least the capacitance of the attenuator would be affected.
Just a long-winded way of saying that I am not sure a series-type attenuator is inherently inferior to a ladder type attenuator.
Kurt
Thanks Kurt for a fresh view on this. I do like that the EIZZ is a totally enclosed unit but still serviceable if needed. The price is not killer either.
BillWojo
BillWojo
If that is the case you're looking at a incorrectly constructed ladder type attenuator. With ladder type on a 4-pole switch for 2-channel stereo construction, when done right, all the unused resistors dangle off GND, and signals go to/from nowhere but the intended 2 resistors only, likely resulting a more compact physical path.
This not to say ladder type sounds better than anything else, though.
You are right. What I described is not a "typical" construction, even though it is a possible and workable (I did it once) construction for forming a voltage divider with two resistors in the signal path. Nevertheless, even in the "correctly constructed" ladder attenuator, each unselected pair of resistors is dangling from the common ground. Perhaps having N-1 pairs of resistors all dangling off the ground is better than having N-1 resistors dangling off the input and N-1 resistors dangling off the ground. 🙂
Kurt
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