18sound 6ND430 - Zaph tested

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#1
http://zaphaudio.com/6.5test/

It appears that this driver offers midrange performance up there with the best Zaph has tested, as well as offering high sensitvity, power handling and a good value price as well.

Only thing it's missing is bass extension....



So my question is: what woofer to use to cover the bottom end?
I hope to achieve:
Similar SPL as midrange, taking at least 3db BS compensation into account.
Sealed F3 <= 80hz
Low distortion to match mid + SS6600 tweeter
Box volume for woofer <35L

Cheers 🙂
 
#3
ttan98 said:
You will find the B&C 6MD38 is equally competent at a cheaper price.

Go to this website for a new OB based on this midrange.

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=29988&page=8&pp=35
Click to expand...


Zaph's results suggest that it's not equally as competent.... (I think?) I'm not worried about the price so much.....


AE Lambda TD woofers: seem to have a good reputation, how's the distortion etc. compared to say scan speak 26w etc?


:smash: 🙂

Cheers
 
#4
Specs of 4 & 8 ohm versions from 18sound customer service:


6nd430 4 Ohm

Fs 60 Hz
Vas 12.2 lt
Rc 2.9 Ohm
Qms 6.5
Qes 0.25
Qts 0.24
Bl 7.8 Tm
dBSpl 92 dB
Mms 13.9 gr
Zmin 3.7 Ohm
L1KHz 0.17 mH


6nd430 8 Ohm

Fs 61 Hz
Vas 12.6 lt
Rc 5.5 Ohm
Qms 6.5
Qes 0.28
Qts 0.27
Bl 10 Tm
dBSpl 92 dB
Mms 13.3 gr
Zmin 6.5 Ohm
L1KHz 0.28 mH
 
#6
I looked at using this driver for a high powered PA application. What impressed me is that the off axis response was pretty flat! and that the overall response had a rising top end but was basically flat over the whole range. a simple filter network could easily level the top end.

Here is a link to my post from 2007 where i looked at using that driver.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1211131#post1211131
 
#8
I too came to slightly different conclusions when reading Zaph's data, which is why I think he delayed his comments. His comments I would probably agree with if I was planning to pick one of these drivers for a 80hz crossed sub/sat system. But I think the real use for these drivers are as a dedicated mid in a three way, which the B&C looks better for IMO.
 
#13
You know I've wondered about that before Josh. Sometimes I think you need to look at both the relative harmonic levels AND the absolute level to guage what is going on. F3 higher than F2 may imply higher BL non-linearity (high F3), OR it may just indicate a very good suspension surround (low F2). The absolute level of each harmonic would indicate which is which.

For example the 8NDL51 also shows a higher F3 than F2, but F3 is still low in an absolute sense compared to most drivers. I've seen Klippel measurements of this driver that confirm BL(x) and Cms(x) are both very symmetric.

I could be totally off base too, that's just my take.
 
#14
tinitus said:
augerpro, seems you have a lot going on your site, its bookmarked 🙂

btw, is there any evaluation on how those drivers sound ?
Click to expand...

Thanks! Don't bother with any of the stuff on the main pages-it's just a placeholder for junk. Only the folders on the left side of the screen have anything people would like to see.

No evalution on the sound, I'm not Zaph, just a monkey with a microphone 🙂
 
#15
MisterTwister said:
based on Zaphs measurements I'd choose B&C over 18sound.
At spl over 95db it's midrange distortion levels are comparable to best drivers in this group, and they are measured at much lower spl..
Click to expand...


Aren't the distortion measurements relative to the fundamental?
Perhaps I don't understand something about how speakers work 🙂


I'm not too worried about the extra sensitivity over the 18sound (prefer the lower extension) unless I can find a tweeter with _distortion_ + sensitivity to match.
 
#16
fb said:
Aren't the distortion measurements relative to the fundamental?
Click to expand...

You're right. At Zaph's measured SPL for his HD sweeps, the 18sound has better performance than the B&C. The higher sensitivity of the B&C doesn't necessarily indicate its better harmonic distortion performance at a higher level than Zaph used. To investigate, we need actual HD measurement at a higher level, not guess work.

If you want to build high sensitivity, full range capable 3-ways, the combination of SS6600, 18Sound 6ND430 (preferably 8 ohm version), and the AE Lambda TD12H will be very nice. I know there's no distortion measurement available for the Lambda. But according to its construction info, it should be one of the best 12" drivers that can go deep as well as be sensitive enough. You can go with SS or SEAS Excel woofers but you may need to use two in parallel for a desired system sensitivity. Also, usual pro drivers don't go as deep.

-jAy
 
#18
Jay_WJ said:


I know there's no distortion measurement available for the Lambda. But according to its construction info, it should be one of the best 12" drivers that can go deep as well as be sensitive enough.
-jAy
Click to expand...


I like your suggestion, but am beginning to wonder about the complete lack of measurements of AE drivers, I mean, they must have these measurements since they can make the claims they do, so why not show anything other than a few inadequate specs
Apart from apparently being nice fore home use, I dont see why they should be better than the rest
seems like we are shooting in the dark 😕
 
#19
tinitus said:



I like your suggestion, but am beginning to wonder about the complete lack of measurements of AE drivers, and I dont see any reason why they should be any better than the rest, apart from having nice specs fore home use...but at the moment we are shooting in the dark 😕
Click to expand...


It seems that many people used them and were satisfied. As for the measurements, the AE forum has some frequency and impedance measurements. Their impedance measurements indicate heavy faraday rings in the motors. I'm pretty sure that I've also seen some crude, 3rd party measurements, but not like Zaph's.

-jAy
 
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