I'm working on a 10" inch monitor/light PA top. Got a pair of ELX-112 waveguides (clones) from AliExpress. I want to pair them with B&C 10CL51.
I'd like opinions on their subjective sound and can anyone recommend a CD for them? Only documentation I have found is this, with Celestion CDX1-1731 and the polars look pretty nice.
https://www.mtg-designs.com/tips-tricks-tests/waveguide-shootout/1in-bolt-horns/ev-elx112-wg
I'd like opinions on their subjective sound and can anyone recommend a CD for them? Only documentation I have found is this, with Celestion CDX1-1731 and the polars look pretty nice.
https://www.mtg-designs.com/tips-tricks-tests/waveguide-shootout/1in-bolt-horns/ev-elx112-wg
using this horn, EV crossed their 12" woofer at 2.1k and the 15" at 1.7k. Seems high for a good directivity match. Would that be more about their tweeter being wimpy, or the shallow horn unloading? Where would you start to design an XO for the 10CL51?
A 15" has around 132 square inches SD, the 10" only 49, ~7dB more output, a 12 is ~80 square inches, 3dB more output if they have the same excursion.
They are also more sensitive, using about half the power to produce that output compared to the 10"
That makes the HF driver on that horn the weak link, it would run out of excursion trying to keep up if the crossover was lower.
With the light duty 10", you could probably drop to ~1500-1600Hz with a steep crossover.
The 10"" would be at least 90 degrees wide that low.
I'd first use DSP to get as good sounding, safe crossover without using delay (the shallow horn may not require any for the woofer), then attempt to duplicate the response with my trunk full of passive crossover parts. That said, I'd rather sell the trunk (cheap!) and never do that again..
If you individually measure the frequency, phase, and impedance response of the drivers in the cabinet, you could use a program like VituixCAD2_setup.exe. to help with a passive crossover design. You'd still need proper long term and peak limiting- the 10CL51 can't take much power without fading (heating up, impedance rises) which plays havoc with passive crossover frequencies. Then you also need to protect the HF driver from some clown pointing the mic at the speaker...
I tried to get Vituix to work on my Mac yesterday, but couldn't get it to go.
With the price of amps and DSP now, there really isn't much reason to go passive- you could easily drop $200 on crossover components alone, after spending days figuring out what (might) work.
Cheers,
Art
They are also more sensitive, using about half the power to produce that output compared to the 10"
That makes the HF driver on that horn the weak link, it would run out of excursion trying to keep up if the crossover was lower.
With the light duty 10", you could probably drop to ~1500-1600Hz with a steep crossover.
The 10"" would be at least 90 degrees wide that low.
I'd first use DSP to get as good sounding, safe crossover without using delay (the shallow horn may not require any for the woofer), then attempt to duplicate the response with my trunk full of passive crossover parts. That said, I'd rather sell the trunk (cheap!) and never do that again..
If you individually measure the frequency, phase, and impedance response of the drivers in the cabinet, you could use a program like VituixCAD2_setup.exe. to help with a passive crossover design. You'd still need proper long term and peak limiting- the 10CL51 can't take much power without fading (heating up, impedance rises) which plays havoc with passive crossover frequencies. Then you also need to protect the HF driver from some clown pointing the mic at the speaker...
I tried to get Vituix to work on my Mac yesterday, but couldn't get it to go.
With the price of amps and DSP now, there really isn't much reason to go passive- you could easily drop $200 on crossover components alone, after spending days figuring out what (might) work.
Cheers,
Art
Art, I wasn't clear in my post, I'll be using DSP filters on a Hypex Fusion amp. But I do plan to put a protection cap on the tweeter.
My current mobile system uses 12" woofers with the QSC horn, Faital 12PR320 + HF10AK, LR4 at 1.3k, all DSP filters. Subs are a pair of 18TBW100 in 10 cu ft each. The mains are reflex ofc but monitors are slightly smaller sealed cabinets with the same components (but they still are pretty big and heavy) Also there is a rack cabinet... I'm really in love with this system and it's nice to have mains/monitors that sound alike. But it's too much cargo for small events. I hope these new cabinets will have the same sound signature and give me more options to mix and match for gigs. What I really want is these reflex 10's and a pair of 15" subs that will be my "house party" system so my load-in can be like half the volume/weight. The ELX horn looks like a scaled-down clone of the QSC, except for the mumps in the throat. I have the 10CL51 and DE250 on my shelf, so this sounds like a plan. Thanks for your help!
My current mobile system uses 12" woofers with the QSC horn, Faital 12PR320 + HF10AK, LR4 at 1.3k, all DSP filters. Subs are a pair of 18TBW100 in 10 cu ft each. The mains are reflex ofc but monitors are slightly smaller sealed cabinets with the same components (but they still are pretty big and heavy) Also there is a rack cabinet... I'm really in love with this system and it's nice to have mains/monitors that sound alike. But it's too much cargo for small events. I hope these new cabinets will have the same sound signature and give me more options to mix and match for gigs. What I really want is these reflex 10's and a pair of 15" subs that will be my "house party" system so my load-in can be like half the volume/weight. The ELX horn looks like a scaled-down clone of the QSC, except for the mumps in the throat. I have the 10CL51 and DE250 on my shelf, so this sounds like a plan. Thanks for your help!