My current 3-way floor-standing loudspeakers got annoying “Umm” noise sonically. IOW, there’s excessive mid-bass in the lower vocal range, both male and female. At first, I thought it was caused by cabinet talk, so I simply lowered woofer’s crossover point. But the problem hadn’t gone. And, I found this issue in my car audio which has no speaker enclosures there at all. So I’m wondering whether the excessive mid-bass is generated by cabinet talk or woofer sing. Thus, how to indicate the origin of the noise, cabinet vs. woofer? Note that lowering woofer’s crossover point didn’t help.
Next, I tried experimenting tri-amplification by using active crossovers. I found that removing 85-170Hz region (with 12dB/octave slopes) by means of underlapping crossovers technique helped fixing the issue. In fact, the current setting crossover points on the original 3-way passive design are 550Hz high-pass for the 2-inch dome midrange (can’t go any lower) and 200Hz low-pass for the dual 10-inch woofers. I wonder since the problematic frequency range is around 85-170Hz, is it interesting to convert this project to 3.5-way system—by applying 200Hz low-pass to the upper woofer and 85Hz low-pass to the lower woofer instead of 200Hz low-pass to both woofers, and a little SPL tweaking on mid and tweeter?
Next, I tried experimenting tri-amplification by using active crossovers. I found that removing 85-170Hz region (with 12dB/octave slopes) by means of underlapping crossovers technique helped fixing the issue. In fact, the current setting crossover points on the original 3-way passive design are 550Hz high-pass for the 2-inch dome midrange (can’t go any lower) and 200Hz low-pass for the dual 10-inch woofers. I wonder since the problematic frequency range is around 85-170Hz, is it interesting to convert this project to 3.5-way system—by applying 200Hz low-pass to the upper woofer and 85Hz low-pass to the lower woofer instead of 200Hz low-pass to both woofers, and a little SPL tweaking on mid and tweeter?
Hmm... interesting.
If you could lay out the path from pre to speakers, and which DSP/filter capabilities you have, so that we can see what kinda options we have to fiddle with - then I think it would be easier for us🙂
Also, what car, placement and type of all the equipment, with brand, size and all the technical stuff, so we can look into specs and datasheets 👍
If you could lay out the path from pre to speakers, and which DSP/filter capabilities you have, so that we can see what kinda options we have to fiddle with - then I think it would be easier for us🙂
Also, what car, placement and type of all the equipment, with brand, size and all the technical stuff, so we can look into specs and datasheets 👍
DSP is an active crossover from car audio equipment: ADS AX2.
For car audio system, it’s a 1993 Volvo 960. All speakers locate at factory’s locations. Only head unit is replaced with aftermarket Pioneer that features Bluetooth system.
Woofers play human’s voice. I expect them to reproduce only bass signal, while the midranges are expected to cover all of vocal range, both men and women’s voice, without any bass reproduction. (and they did their good job).
If you expect a woofer to play only LF, then you need a speaker with a midrange that can be crossed lower. As is, that's not possible as the dome mid can't be pushed any lower. Turning the speaker into a 3.5way is not going to solve that. You will still have one 10" playing up into the midrange. Given the fact that you're hearing this problem in your car as well points to other factors than your speakers, IMHO. Could this be psychoacoustic? Maybe you're particularly sensitive to this spectrum of the human voice and have been become focused on it when listening. I listen to a lot of rock and find cymbals and hi hats a sticking point. To me, the wrong equipment can make them sound like a cacophony. And it's not just the playback equipment, it's in the sources as well. Poor recordings and low quality formats(mp3) can be hard to listen to for me. Are there specific recordings you're finding issues with or is this general across all the music you listen to?
Then you want something more like a subwoofer (crossing around 100 Hz or lower), and not a woofer. In most 3-way speakers the woofer will be playing the lower range of voices.
In addition to @thirdicomplex's point, your mid may be rolling off higher than you think. Midrange weakness may be making voices sound more bassy than they should. It's hard to judge these things without measurements or direct, instantaneous comparison to known neutral sources. Your ear can latch onto different parts of the spectrum for its reference with different songs, so it can be difficult to pinpoint what is too much midbass vs too little lower midrange. The voice range tends to be fussy because it's one we have lots of real-world experience with. Most can easily identify frequency imbalances with voice that they wouldn't necessarily find objectionable with music.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voice_frequency
"In telephony, the usable voice frequency band ranges from approximately 300 to 3400 Hz" . . . "The voiced speech of a typical adult male will have a fundamental frequency from 90 to 155 Hz, and that of a typical adult female from 165 to 255 Hz.[3] Thus, the fundamental frequency of most speech falls below the bottom of the voice frequency band as defined. However, enough of the harmonic series will be present for the missing fundamental to create the impression of hearing the fundamental tone."
https://www.dpamicrophones.com/mic-...knowledge/facts-about-speech-intelligibility/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocal_range
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