Hi all, I made some midbass horns a while ago, they are fitted with vintage 12" drivers, Richard Allen cg12 super qt apparently 0.105.
The horns are front loaded and although very low in waf relatively small, about 4ft2 mouth 4ft long.
ATM I cross them to some dh1a in hp940 at 750hz then to Beyma tpl150h at 2500. These are all driven with 6e5p PSE amplifiers via a pair of minidsp 2x4, about 5w. I have been keeping an eye on eBay for some of the better EV horns.
Idiosyncratic setup I know, more a rolling experiment than a hifi.
So I thought I'd try a sealed bass section to compare against the horns, if they are ok I'll get waf points and get some of the living room back! I'm prepared to lose some efficiency of course (presently ~103-105db/w) and have more powerful amplifiers available, but would like to maximise efficiency within reason.
I have a few vintage 12 inch high efficiency drivers to hand, Goodman's audium 61 etc but fancy trying a pro audio 15" to try and retain some of the horn speed and thwack.
My days of spending hundreds on drivers I'm afraid is behind me, so budget is an issue.
I've spent a few days searching the forum and the top end of budget would be perhaps faitalpro 15pr400 but cheaper is better if I don't have to sacrifice too much.
Pooh recommended celestion tf1530 which In the UK cost about Eminence delta territory.
I have subs but getting bellow 50hz or so would be nice, my horns are reasonably flat to 80 in room. Cabinet volume I can go to 150l and I'd like to try sealed.
Priority is probably voice region.
Any other driver recommendations or ideas or links to similar projects much appreciated!
Many thanks
Enzo
The horns are front loaded and although very low in waf relatively small, about 4ft2 mouth 4ft long.
ATM I cross them to some dh1a in hp940 at 750hz then to Beyma tpl150h at 2500. These are all driven with 6e5p PSE amplifiers via a pair of minidsp 2x4, about 5w. I have been keeping an eye on eBay for some of the better EV horns.
Idiosyncratic setup I know, more a rolling experiment than a hifi.
So I thought I'd try a sealed bass section to compare against the horns, if they are ok I'll get waf points and get some of the living room back! I'm prepared to lose some efficiency of course (presently ~103-105db/w) and have more powerful amplifiers available, but would like to maximise efficiency within reason.
I have a few vintage 12 inch high efficiency drivers to hand, Goodman's audium 61 etc but fancy trying a pro audio 15" to try and retain some of the horn speed and thwack.
My days of spending hundreds on drivers I'm afraid is behind me, so budget is an issue.
I've spent a few days searching the forum and the top end of budget would be perhaps faitalpro 15pr400 but cheaper is better if I don't have to sacrifice too much.
Pooh recommended celestion tf1530 which In the UK cost about Eminence delta territory.
I have subs but getting bellow 50hz or so would be nice, my horns are reasonably flat to 80 in room. Cabinet volume I can go to 150l and I'd like to try sealed.
Priority is probably voice region.
Any other driver recommendations or ideas or links to similar projects much appreciated!
Many thanks
Enzo
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Not surprisingly Pooh chose a pioneer's mid-bass horn driver T/S, FR spec wise, so you can spend more for a bit more LF output and maybe a bit more 'snap' that's lost in the XO's roll off BW, so your call.
The Celestion is fine as an inexpensive direct radiator. It should be good 50 (vented) to 750 but never will have the snap and dynamics of the RA driver in the front horn. That RA driver is interesting. A pair of the 15's a side will get you closer but will need more like a 250L box. Using a pair the upper range will suffer so you may need a bigger mid horn to crossover lower. Maybe a big MTM will work? Pick your poison.
Thanks for your reply Pooh, and your work generally, it's an inspiration!
I knocked up a quick 750 X 590 X 415mm test cabinet yesterday and had a listen to a few vintage 12" I have to hand. I'll try and measure some today.
As you say nothing so far has the speed and snap of the horns. Trade depth for speed and efficiency.
My wife's first reaction to the horns was 'absolutely not!' lol but after placating her that they were a temporary experiment she seems to have gotten used to them. She's unusually tolerant amongst her many good features. A pair of enclosures would work visually in the room much better, but if they sound bad I'll keep the horns.
Worst case scenario I use whatever 15 I settle on and some Pyle cd wave guides and Celestion compression drivers I bought to build some econowaves to do just that.
I have a celestion 1525e on its way, couldn't resist for £25, 4ohm and down on efficiency and I think bass extension, so doubt it's where I'll end up but I can use it to set a 15 inch baseline.
I knocked up a quick 750 X 590 X 415mm test cabinet yesterday and had a listen to a few vintage 12" I have to hand. I'll try and measure some today.
As you say nothing so far has the speed and snap of the horns. Trade depth for speed and efficiency.
My wife's first reaction to the horns was 'absolutely not!' lol but after placating her that they were a temporary experiment she seems to have gotten used to them. She's unusually tolerant amongst her many good features. A pair of enclosures would work visually in the room much better, but if they sound bad I'll keep the horns.
Worst case scenario I use whatever 15 I settle on and some Pyle cd wave guides and Celestion compression drivers I bought to build some econowaves to do just that.
I have a celestion 1525e on its way, couldn't resist for £25, 4ohm and down on efficiency and I think bass extension, so doubt it's where I'll end up but I can use it to set a 15 inch baseline.
Nice horn response . The newer Celestion e drivers look better than the originals I have for HiFi.
Looking on the celestion website I can't actually see any difference between the 1530 and 1530e? I thought e was for extended bass response? TS all look identical?
Thanks👍,
I clearly can't read !
Anyone have an opinion on which would be more suitable for a sealed midbass?
I clearly can't read !
Anyone have an opinion on which would be more suitable for a sealed midbass?
Celestion tf1530e arrived today.
Looks like sealed its pretty flat to F ~42hz.
Not as flat frequency response as my horns, but think I'll make a second and live with it for a bit. Don't sound bad, not the speed of the horns but warm and deeper.
Apologies for filthy 940..
Might have a go at a 402 style horn for the Dh1a, little smaller perhaps , would it be worth trying to match the tpl150h horn figures? 80 30 off the top of my head?
Horns might move into an outbuilding area planned for projector, two way horn system instead of econowaves perhaps.
Looks like sealed its pretty flat to F ~42hz.
Not as flat frequency response as my horns, but think I'll make a second and live with it for a bit. Don't sound bad, not the speed of the horns but warm and deeper.
Apologies for filthy 940..
Might have a go at a 402 style horn for the Dh1a, little smaller perhaps , would it be worth trying to match the tpl150h horn figures? 80 30 off the top of my head?
Horns might move into an outbuilding area planned for projector, two way horn system instead of econowaves perhaps.
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Have you thought about making a larger waveguide for Beyma TPL-150 and cross it directly to woofers?
I have, the lowest I've heard tpl's crossed is 1000hz, but I think 2000+ is much better sq wise, I think 1000 would be pushing the tf1530e too.
But a meh with the TPL and a small mid driver might be worth pursuing... Wish I hadn't sold my faitalpro 5m12's. Pretty sure someone has done a unity with TPL before?
All part of the fun of the hobby, so many different avenues to explore.
But a meh with the TPL and a small mid driver might be worth pursuing... Wish I hadn't sold my faitalpro 5m12's. Pretty sure someone has done a unity with TPL before?
All part of the fun of the hobby, so many different avenues to explore.