Hey everyone,
If you were using a pair of MBM type enclosures as speaker stands, would you run them as subwoofers through the LFE channel on your reciever, or would you use a MiniDSP to cross over your main L&R channels to these MBMs and run the resulting channel full range on your processor?
Has anyone actively crossed over a normal speaker and a sub/bass bin/MBM to create a fullrange speaker? Or would I be better off simply replacing my front subs with these new guys and recalibrating my eq setting accordingly?
If you were using a pair of MBM type enclosures as speaker stands, would you run them as subwoofers through the LFE channel on your reciever, or would you use a MiniDSP to cross over your main L&R channels to these MBMs and run the resulting channel full range on your processor?
Has anyone actively crossed over a normal speaker and a sub/bass bin/MBM to create a fullrange speaker? Or would I be better off simply replacing my front subs with these new guys and recalibrating my eq setting accordingly?
Mbm, mid bass module
They selling something like this at diysoundgroup i think. Adds midbass slam (cone area anyway), but to me you are just making your speaker from a 2 way to a 3 way. Basically a 12" woofer (not sub) in a box.
You could move your sub between the front speakers and move the crossover point up. But i found even 150hz crossover point didnt work, a big phase shift through that area, 200hz a little better.
I'd be tempted to run 2 woof boxes in parallel then use a single coil, run with you main, flip phase for best sound where you sit,may not work well with the increasing woofer's impedance curve, but may add some fun without too much trouble. And baffle step needs 3-6db depending how far from walls.
May work, may not.
They selling something like this at diysoundgroup i think. Adds midbass slam (cone area anyway), but to me you are just making your speaker from a 2 way to a 3 way. Basically a 12" woofer (not sub) in a box.
You could move your sub between the front speakers and move the crossover point up. But i found even 150hz crossover point didnt work, a big phase shift through that area, 200hz a little better.
I'd be tempted to run 2 woof boxes in parallel then use a single coil, run with you main, flip phase for best sound where you sit,may not work well with the increasing woofer's impedance curve, but may add some fun without too much trouble. And baffle step needs 3-6db depending how far from walls.
May work, may not.
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So, I originally had a more longwinded description of the scenario typed out but I pared it down for brevity.
I have a trio of DIYSG 88 Specials up front in my very open living room HT setup. Also in front, I have a pair of dayton reference 12 HO DVC subs in 2.25cuft tuned to 23hz or so. I also have a pair of Ultimax 18s in 9cu ft tuned to 18hz or so. All four subs are run through a MiniDSP 2x4 Balanced and my front left and right channels are on their own external amp.
The ultimaxs are right behind the couch so im not lacking deep bass. I dont think they do that well from around 60hz and up however. Im trying to explain this without resorting to audiophile trope type language but they definitely favor the lower octaves and thats fine because thats what they are for. They just dont sound good for most music.
What Im looking to accomplish with these new boxes is to be able to run without the Ultimaxs for most music. Basically I want the 88s to behave like nearly full range speakers down to about 35hz. I have drivers and the boxes are designed, Im just waiting on some free time to build them. The simulations look promising for a -10db point of about 27hz.
So heres the question again, with more context to what Im looking to do. If Im replacing the two smaller subs I have in the front of the room, and planning on crossing over to the mains at about 100hz, would there be anything to gain by running the new subs in stereo lowpassed off the L&R front channels versus simply replacing the old subs and recalibrating my DSP settings?
I have a trio of DIYSG 88 Specials up front in my very open living room HT setup. Also in front, I have a pair of dayton reference 12 HO DVC subs in 2.25cuft tuned to 23hz or so. I also have a pair of Ultimax 18s in 9cu ft tuned to 18hz or so. All four subs are run through a MiniDSP 2x4 Balanced and my front left and right channels are on their own external amp.
The ultimaxs are right behind the couch so im not lacking deep bass. I dont think they do that well from around 60hz and up however. Im trying to explain this without resorting to audiophile trope type language but they definitely favor the lower octaves and thats fine because thats what they are for. They just dont sound good for most music.
What Im looking to accomplish with these new boxes is to be able to run without the Ultimaxs for most music. Basically I want the 88s to behave like nearly full range speakers down to about 35hz. I have drivers and the boxes are designed, Im just waiting on some free time to build them. The simulations look promising for a -10db point of about 27hz.
So heres the question again, with more context to what Im looking to do. If Im replacing the two smaller subs I have in the front of the room, and planning on crossing over to the mains at about 100hz, would there be anything to gain by running the new subs in stereo lowpassed off the L&R front channels versus simply replacing the old subs and recalibrating my DSP settings?
Symmetric L/R subwoofer placement is not necessarily the best location for subwoofer frequencies.
Hmm, subs not sounding good for music. I find that is usually due to the integration, or crossover, phase through it anyway.
I had a similar situation running 3x 15" adire tempest subs below some double 10" scanspeak midbass cabs. Crossed at 80hz they sounded slow/ tubby etc etc..Crossed at 40Hz it was all good.
I'd suggest setting up your ultimax subs with your midbass modules as a '2 way' sub, running off the LFE channel on the processor , with all the mains running as small.
Cheers,
Rob.
I'd suggest setting up your ultimax subs with your midbass modules as a '2 way' sub, running off the LFE channel on the processor , with all the mains running as small.
Cheers,
Rob.
I agree but in my case its the best compromise I can manage in my space. My response is actually pretty smooth.
Thats possible; its been a while since I've recalibrated all the dsp settings. On the other hand, correct me if im way off base, but large, low tuned ported enclosures with low Fs, high mms drivers dont seen very efficient in the higher frequency ranges where you'd find a lot of material in rock and jazz music.maube I could create some separate dsp setups just for music listening to compensate, but I've been wanting to try out pro audio style drivers in reasonably t I ned ported enclosures for a while.
Rob, I'm considering that as well. While I was designing the new enclosures, I tried to make sure the bulk of their efficiency is above the peak of the martys. If the Martys are awesome from 12-50 or so, I want some overlap on capability so I shot for a -10 of around 30hz and port first resonance above 300hz so I can cross these guys a little higher. Thats sort of where the question in the original post comes from. If my crossover point is high enough that localization becomes a significant factor, shouldnt they be r u n in stereo?
If you want to cross significantly higher than ~100/150Hz then you could possibly use a 4 channel mixer between your av processor and the minidsp unit and mix your sub channel back into the left/right feeds to the minidsp.
(Run the front L/R as large and the rest of the speakers as small)
Cheers,
Rob
(Run the front L/R as large and the rest of the speakers as small)
Cheers,
Rob
Why not just run the main channels as "large", activate double *** or whatever setting routes LFE to the mains and use a minidsp 2x4 to cross over the speakers to the bass cabs and add PEQ?
I'm hoping to get started on construction soon so at least once I have something built I can start testing and figure out whats going to be the best solution. I'm leaning toward simply using the new cabs to replace the existing front subs since it won't require any additional hardware.
I'm hoping to get started on construction soon so at least once I have something built I can start testing and figure out whats going to be the best solution. I'm leaning toward simply using the new cabs to replace the existing front subs since it won't require any additional hardware.
My processor doesn't have that option, which is why I suggested mixing the sub signal back in with a mixer .
Cheers,
Rob.
Cheers,
Rob.