Hi All,
I am after some advice on suitable replacement drivers for this particular bass horn. Edgar used a ECM 12 L unit which, as far as I am aware, has been discontinued.
The specs can be found in the PDF in the Articles section here:
Download Section
Fs-55
VAS (Cu. Ft)-3.3
QES-0.25
EFF (db)-98
ST (Sq. in.)-36
FHM-440
Edgar also explains why this particular driver seemed to suit the Show horn well.
I am intrigued by this driver-
AE Speakers --- Superb Quality, Unforgettable Performance, Definitely.
Any thoughts on the aespeakers, Lambada 12" offering for this application also most welcome.
Just wondering if anyone else has any experience on this particular design and maybe able to offer advice on the matter, maybe something from B&C has been successfully implemented?
Best wishes,
Simon.
I am after some advice on suitable replacement drivers for this particular bass horn. Edgar used a ECM 12 L unit which, as far as I am aware, has been discontinued.
The specs can be found in the PDF in the Articles section here:
Download Section
Fs-55
VAS (Cu. Ft)-3.3
QES-0.25
EFF (db)-98
ST (Sq. in.)-36
FHM-440
Edgar also explains why this particular driver seemed to suit the Show horn well.
I am intrigued by this driver-
AE Speakers --- Superb Quality, Unforgettable Performance, Definitely.
Any thoughts on the aespeakers, Lambada 12" offering for this application also most welcome.
Just wondering if anyone else has any experience on this particular design and maybe able to offer advice on the matter, maybe something from B&C has been successfully implemented?
Best wishes,
Simon.
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Hi Simon, that TD12X driver is not good if you intend going to 400-500Hz. You have to look after drivers with 2Fs/Qes over 400Hz. These have big magnets (high BL, low Qes) and not so low Fs (no lower than 50Hz).
But if you want to use the "Show Horn" not over 200Hz then TD12X is just OK.
But if you want to use the "Show Horn" not over 200Hz then TD12X is just OK.
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You can't find EV EVM12Ls?
That's a very very very popular speaker and should be really easy to get.
That's a very very very popular speaker and should be really easy to get.
Eminence now makes EM12L, a reasonable reproduction of it.
Speaker Detail | Eminence Speaker
You can find this at Parts Express. But suffers a sales flyer characterized for
musicians rather than a spec sheet. Go to Eminence website for the full TS.
DeltaPro12A very similar, darker, less sensitive, slightly more xmax and LE.
For many years considered close enough substitute. But never quite exact.
There may be applications where this is better or worse suited than EM12L,
but should be on your short list.
Speaker Detail | Eminence Speaker
You can find this at Parts Express. But suffers a sales flyer characterized for
musicians rather than a spec sheet. Go to Eminence website for the full TS.
DeltaPro12A very similar, darker, less sensitive, slightly more xmax and LE.
For many years considered close enough substitute. But never quite exact.
There may be applications where this is better or worse suited than EM12L,
but should be on your short list.
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A little digging reveals even Elecrovoice makes a reproduction EVM12L Classic.
Bumped backplate looks very different from the original EVM12L, but maybe a
legitimate improvement if all else was kept faithful. Also a "Black Label" variant
with unspecified improvements and one of those useless guitar oriented spec-
sheets.
Electro-Voice EVM12L Classic World?s greatest guitar loudspeaker
Bumped backplate looks very different from the original EVM12L, but maybe a
legitimate improvement if all else was kept faithful. Also a "Black Label" variant
with unspecified improvements and one of those useless guitar oriented spec-
sheets.
Electro-Voice EVM12L Classic World?s greatest guitar loudspeaker
load a few drivers into hornresp and see what you can get for bandwidth - B&C's 12pe32 is a classic horn driver spec-wise
Parameters *
Fs 51 Hz
Re 5.8 Ω
Qes 0.19
Qms 7.6
Qts 0.18
Vas 101.0 dm3 (3.56 ft3)
Sd 522.0 cm2 (80.9 in2)
η₀ 6.8 %
Xmax 2.8 mm
Xvar 5.0 mm
Mms 37 g
Bl 19.1 Txm
Le 1.2 mH
EBP 268 H
Parameters *
Fs 51 Hz
Re 5.8 Ω
Qes 0.19
Qms 7.6
Qts 0.18
Vas 101.0 dm3 (3.56 ft3)
Sd 522.0 cm2 (80.9 in2)
η₀ 6.8 %
Xmax 2.8 mm
Xvar 5.0 mm
Mms 37 g
Bl 19.1 Txm
Le 1.2 mH
EBP 268 H
"B&C's 12pe32 is a classic horn driver spec-wise"
+1
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g196/dkleitsch/12PE32x2_zpsbe9adcef.jpg
A design showing off the bandwidth or the 12PE32.
+1
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g196/dkleitsch/12PE32x2_zpsbe9adcef.jpg
A design showing off the bandwidth or the 12PE32.
Thread reopened.
I’ve wanted to try a multi-way horn system ever since I got into DIY.
I have a pair of Bruce’s “salad bowl” tractrix midrange horns I picked up a while ago and played with a few times.
I also ended up with a pair of reconed EVM15B I was going to use to build mid bass horns.
I haven’t read the articles in years, but I thought Bruce eventually ended up using the 15B in this design?…or maybe I’m confusing that with Volvotreter’s later conical front mid bass horn?
There’s also the Quarter Pie Horn that Claude built over on the Klipsch forum. I believe he originally used the 15B.
Anyway, just interested in finding out why the thread was reopened.
I have a pair of Bruce’s “salad bowl” tractrix midrange horns I picked up a while ago and played with a few times.
I also ended up with a pair of reconed EVM15B I was going to use to build mid bass horns.
I haven’t read the articles in years, but I thought Bruce eventually ended up using the 15B in this design?…or maybe I’m confusing that with Volvotreter’s later conical front mid bass horn?
There’s also the Quarter Pie Horn that Claude built over on the Klipsch forum. I believe he originally used the 15B.
Anyway, just interested in finding out why the thread was reopened.
One important thing is to identify the best frequency range to use a horn and to not try to use it outside this range.
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👍Just do man.
You'll never regret it!
As you build the system (I did it Upper Mid horns down to tapped horns), everything can just fit into place and create a system your dream $$$$$'s could not buy.
I’m currently living like a gypsy between two houses since we only closed on a new one mid November and haven’t sold the old one or even finished moving.
That being said, I think a horn system will finally now be a realistic option with the additional space we have…if I can just figure out how to arrange furniture to keep everyone happy.
The other day I was able to move my back horns from the old house into the new “great room”.
This room will probably be my best bet to pursue some of my long standing audio fantasies 😉
That being said, I think a horn system will finally now be a realistic option with the additional space we have…if I can just figure out how to arrange furniture to keep everyone happy.
The other day I was able to move my back horns from the old house into the new “great room”.
This room will probably be my best bet to pursue some of my long standing audio fantasies 😉
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Almost always, not sometimes. Other factors will apply. ie there is nothing on the walls.
dave
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That room looks fine.
Now with horns you are interested in the outside of the cabinets which is a good thing. Horns or not, it's the control aspect I'm talking about.
Now with horns you are interested in the outside of the cabinets which is a good thing. Horns or not, it's the control aspect I'm talking about.
I like your priorities, get some form of system playing before all else (packing cases/boxes in the background 👍)😂
Music is a daily requirement for me…it helps keep me centered.
Relocating after being in the same house 18 years has created an enormous amount of stress.
We were only into the move a few days when I needed to set something up.
Here is a shot of the other end of the room where I set up the first amp I built (an LM3875 gainclone) and first small bass reflex speakers (with Fostex 107e) that I modeled in WinISD. I lugged an old Jamo sub in to fill in the bottom by ear.
There was also some 3/4” plywood left behind in the attic. Looks like enough to build a pair of horns for the 15Bs 😏
Music is a daily requirement for me…it helps keep me centered.
Relocating after being in the same house 18 years has created an enormous amount of stress.
We were only into the move a few days when I needed to set something up.
Here is a shot of the other end of the room where I set up the first amp I built (an LM3875 gainclone) and first small bass reflex speakers (with Fostex 107e) that I modeled in WinISD. I lugged an old Jamo sub in to fill in the bottom by ear.
The former owner was a musician and had a baby grand piano in this room. He commented that the acoustics were quite good…a big selling point for me.
There was also some 3/4” plywood left behind in the attic. Looks like enough to build a pair of horns for the 15Bs 😏