Not for that, but the TM1/3 XO was the best integration i heard with the KEF pair. I expect a bump near the bottom, giving them the illusion of more bottom then they did.
dave
rom the KEF blue binder. I don’t think the numbers are consistent with those supplied today. By my modeling based on the numbers, i get much larger box.Can’t argue with how well they sounded.
dave
Measured data from another topic:
Model: B200 SP1014
Piston Diameter = 172.0 mm
f(s)= 37.68 Hz
R(e)= 7.52 Ohms
Z(max)= 59.42 Ohms
Q(ms)= 5.965
Q(es)= 0.864
Q(ts)= 0.755
V(as)= 56.650 liters (2.001 cubic feet)
L(e)= 1.20 mH
n(0)= 0.33 %
SPL= 87.34 1W/1m
M(ms)= 23.89 grams
C(ms)= 0.75 mm/N
BL= 7.02
If that's the case here, don't shrink the box. Just close the openings and add polyester wool to the entire volume. Determine the required amount by listening, so that there is not too much that will deaden the sound.
The existing boxes need to be renewed, add some stiffening inside, refresh the crossover, replace the wiring and put better connectors. It's not worth spending too much money there.
Model: B200 SP1014
Piston Diameter = 172.0 mm
f(s)= 37.68 Hz
R(e)= 7.52 Ohms
Z(max)= 59.42 Ohms
Q(ms)= 5.965
Q(es)= 0.864
Q(ts)= 0.755
V(as)= 56.650 liters (2.001 cubic feet)
L(e)= 1.20 mH
n(0)= 0.33 %
SPL= 87.34 1W/1m
M(ms)= 23.89 grams
C(ms)= 0.75 mm/N
BL= 7.02
If that's the case here, don't shrink the box. Just close the openings and add polyester wool to the entire volume. Determine the required amount by listening, so that there is not too much that will deaden the sound.
The existing boxes need to be renewed, add some stiffening inside, refresh the crossover, replace the wiring and put better connectors. It's not worth spending too much money there.
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Lots and lots of suggestions! Thank you!
I am still eager to try squeezing it into a smaller volume sealed enclosure box. I will of course keep the current boxes and just move it all back if I’m not satisfied.
I am still eager to try squeezing it into a smaller volume sealed enclosure box. I will of course keep the current boxes and just move it all back if I’m not satisfied.
Small box and high Qt driver will be boom boom box. 😁
It can be solved by adding a capacitor in line with the midbass.
It can be solved by adding a capacitor in line with the midbass.
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The internal volume of your Tangent TM-1 ported speaker is shy of 55 litres: https://thunders.ca/tangent/tm1.php
Compare that with that of the Tangent TM-3 sealed speaker which, being shy of 25 litres, has less than half the volume.
Unless you are au fait with loudspeaker design, I suggest that you go for a sealed box of 25 to 30 litres internal volume.
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Re the potential of adding a large value series capacitor to the positive input of the mid/bass driver as illustrated by @NIXIE62:
In order for the capacitor in series with the woofer modification to work effectively:
- The woofer must have a low resonance frequency fs (below 30 Hz) and a high Qts (above 0.40).
- The cabinet volume for the woofer should be calculated based on a sealed box of Qtc around 1.0.
As I have tried to point out, I’m entirely new to this. Q and Qt and other terminology is new to me. I don’t have any specific equipment to measure this.
I will probably do this by ear, and trust what I hear. I do however want to avoid ending up with burned components.
What are the risks involved doing this without measuring?
I will probably do this by ear, and trust what I hear. I do however want to avoid ending up with burned components.
What are the risks involved doing this without measuring?
You haven't yet told us what you plan to do in the light of the advice that has been given.
You simply have to migrate the drivers from the large ported TM1 cabinets to smaller sealed cabinets like those of the TM3 (25 to 30 litres internal volume).
You don't even have to change the crossovers, so I see no risk involved in the migration process.
You simply have to migrate the drivers from the large ported TM1 cabinets to smaller sealed cabinets like those of the TM3 (25 to 30 litres internal volume).
You don't even have to change the crossovers, so I see no risk involved in the migration process.
But in conclusion I think I can be confident in trying a smaller box, then spend some more time on a more refined design if the size proves effective and sound to my liking.
If you like less bass extension, and a bump up in mid bass centered around 75Hz, then go for it.
jeff
Yes, you can confidently go ahead without fear of damaging the drivers.
The TM3 speakers are described as "a little bass shy", something that is often designed into a speaker to allow close to rear wall mounting.
He doesn't have to make a new box. It can easily reduce the volume of the existing speaker box for rehearsal. Let's say, pieces of a thick dense sponge (50mm +) are taken and distributed inside on the sides, top and bottom of the box until the free volume is reduced to the desired 20-30l. And of course to close the opening on the box, which has not been done yet as far as I can see.
As for designing the new crossover, firstly the T27 is not a match for the B200 (it's a wrong combination), a larger tweeter or midrange is needed, and secondly, without experience and measuring equipment, there is no chance.
Additional box stiffeners will do nothing to make the bass deeper, only the interaction of the driver and the volume of the box is responsible for that. Stiffeners are added to reduce the box wall resonances in amplitude and move them higher in the spectrum where they are easier to remove with damping materials.
As for designing the new crossover, firstly the T27 is not a match for the B200 (it's a wrong combination), a larger tweeter or midrange is needed, and secondly, without experience and measuring equipment, there is no chance.
Additional box stiffeners will do nothing to make the bass deeper, only the interaction of the driver and the volume of the box is responsible for that. Stiffeners are added to reduce the box wall resonances in amplitude and move them higher in the spectrum where they are easier to remove with damping materials.
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