What about these two drivers, as an alternative to the B&C 18TBW100?
The SB Audience seems a great alternative if you want to cut costs.
On the other hand, for the same price, the Beyma seems a much better driver.
- SB Audience Rosso 18SW800: More sensitive (99db vs 96db), a bit less xmax (11mm vs 12mm), lower LE (1.25 vs 2.45mH), lighter cone (200gr vs 245gr), cheaper (276€ vs 327€).
- Beyma 18LEX1000Nd: More sensitive (98db vs 96db), a bit less xmax (11mm vs 12mm), lower LE (1.6 vs 2.45mH), lighter cone (185gr vs 245gr), same price, seems a recent Beyma design, uses the latest Malt Cross technology, almost indestructible (60 mm peak-to-peak excursion before damage), much lighter (7.3 kgs vs 15.5kgs).
The SB Audience seems a great alternative if you want to cut costs.
On the other hand, for the same price, the Beyma seems a much better driver.
Just a quick note about the "almost indestructable" aspect: if you hit any subwoofer with lots of power below the port tuning frequency, it can be destroyed in short order.
I folded the cone of a Beyma 15P1200Nd this way. The excursion was impressive, though.
Chris
I folded the cone of a Beyma 15P1200Nd this way. The excursion was impressive, though.
Chris
The sensitivity is measured on a flat baffle at higher than sub frequencies you will probobly find all of them to be simlar if you simulate them. Also different manufacturers will report xmax differently as many of them include extra xmax for fringe field effects. For B&C they report both the geomatry derived xmax and also a figure xvar which is from kipple analysis that gives the maximum linear excursion. Realy it would be great if all manufacturers just gave a kipple driver test report, you can try asking but they quite often want you to be an established company to give this data. This is quite ammusing as when you see the kipple reports for things like 18 sound drivers they are astoundingly good so would make great marketing material. Anyway what I'm trying to say is that beyond gross clasification of drivers looking for small differences in xmax and sensitivity data isn't telling you much.
Voice coil magazine is a free subscription and tests drivers. Looking at a Beyma driver using the same technlology:
https://audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-the-beyma-12lex1300nd-pro-sound-woofer
overall performance looks good but the xmax is over stated on the datasheet:
". Displacement limiting numbers calculated by the Klippel analyzer for the 12LEX1300Nd were XBl @ 82% Bl = 8.4mm and for XC @ 75% Cms minimum was 4.6mm, which means that for this Beyma driver, the compliance is the most limiting factor for prescribed distortion level of 10%. If you apply the less conservative 20% criteria, XBl goes to 10.3mm and XC to 8.3, so definitely better."
I'm not sure what distortion level B&C use for xvar but it looks like it would be rated for considerably less than 11mm xmax by them.
Voice coil magazine is a free subscription and tests drivers. Looking at a Beyma driver using the same technlology:
https://audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-the-beyma-12lex1300nd-pro-sound-woofer
overall performance looks good but the xmax is over stated on the datasheet:
". Displacement limiting numbers calculated by the Klippel analyzer for the 12LEX1300Nd were XBl @ 82% Bl = 8.4mm and for XC @ 75% Cms minimum was 4.6mm, which means that for this Beyma driver, the compliance is the most limiting factor for prescribed distortion level of 10%. If you apply the less conservative 20% criteria, XBl goes to 10.3mm and XC to 8.3, so definitely better."
I'm not sure what distortion level B&C use for xvar but it looks like it would be rated for considerably less than 11mm xmax by them.
Thanks for the link to the LEX review.
It seems to re-enforce the idea of the Beyma driver being the best of the 3 that i mentioned: "... [the LEX driver] looks to be a very well-crafted driver with a good set of performance trade-offs, not to mention a world-class cooling system with Maltcross.
It seems to re-enforce the idea of the Beyma driver being the best of the 3 that i mentioned: "... [the LEX driver] looks to be a very well-crafted driver with a good set of performance trade-offs, not to mention a world-class cooling system with Maltcross.
Another interesting option? (Although i still think the Beyma LEX is the best option for the price)
Fane Colossus BR18XS, the link also has detailed plans for a vented enclosure.
A discussion on this driver here.
Fane Colossus BR18XS, the link also has detailed plans for a vented enclosure.
A discussion on this driver here.
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We use 10*Fane 18XB in bass reflex subs tuned to 40Hz with 2000W per driver. No issues they are very solid drivers, in sufficent quantity the output is good and the prime is presumably an upgraded version.
For small events we often use two per side with a 12" coaxial top.
For small events we often use two per side with a 12" coaxial top.
Thank you all for your input.
After some simulations on WinISD with all the drivers mentioned on the thread, I'm choosing the B&C 18TBW100, the reasons are:
I did some box simulations on subbox.pro to get an ideia of the final size os the box:
Link: 170L Box at 37Hz
It is 675 × 550 × 653.9 mm now...
WinISD simulations (with highpass filter to protect the driver):
BLUE: 170L 37Hz
RED: 170L 32Hz
PINK: 115L 37Hz
I think 37Hz would do well for my application, DJ work, playing a little bit of everything, some EDM, Hiphop, Latin, Rock, etc...
Do you agree?
What king of bracing do you suggest?
After some simulations on WinISD with all the drivers mentioned on the thread, I'm choosing the B&C 18TBW100, the reasons are:
- Costs are similar
- No SPL advantages (B&C is slightly better on the lower frequencies)
- Availability, it appears to be easier to get (will see about that...)
I did some box simulations on subbox.pro to get an ideia of the final size os the box:
Link: 170L Box at 37Hz
It is 675 × 550 × 653.9 mm now...
WinISD simulations (with highpass filter to protect the driver):
BLUE: 170L 37Hz
RED: 170L 32Hz
PINK: 115L 37Hz
I think 37Hz would do well for my application, DJ work, playing a little bit of everything, some EDM, Hiphop, Latin, Rock, etc...
Do you agree?
What king of bracing do you suggest?
I don't have any experience with this type of alignment (all my DIY subwoofers and speakers are sealed), so i don't know if this would apply.
But looking at Ricci's files, his designs are heavily braced, such as:
Skorn:
CKRAM:
Maybe you can use this type of bracing in your design?
But looking at Ricci's files, his designs are heavily braced, such as:
Skorn:
CKRAM:
Maybe you can use this type of bracing in your design?
Actually, you could use an hybrid solution, such as this:
This has the advantage of taking less wood, which will reduce weight, and you could use leftovers to do it.
This has the advantage of taking less wood, which will reduce weight, and you could use leftovers to do it.
Have a look at this thread, it has some interesting solution: https://www.avsforum.com/threads/ho...-stop-it-from-rattling.2962486/#post-55822252
What about threaded metal rods?
That would be super easy to install, cheap and they would use less volume...
But they add more weight and maybe vibrate more?
That would be super easy to install, cheap and they would use less volume...
But they add more weight and maybe vibrate more?
Saw this post about bracing and I like the idea, appears to be a good fit for my enclosure...
Link: Window bracing
Link: Window bracing
Today I did the box on Sketchup with bracing in place...
What do you guys think about that?
Another thing, is there a way to calculate the internal volume on Sketchup? It would help a lot to check/adjust the port's final length...
What do you guys think about that?
Another thing, is there a way to calculate the internal volume on Sketchup? It would help a lot to check/adjust the port's final length...
Looking good, but think about where you're going to put handles if this is for mobile/portable use.
You don't really want to impede airflow in the vent, albeit some commercial manufacturers seem to get away with it.
You don't really want to impede airflow in the vent, albeit some commercial manufacturers seem to get away with it.