Hi,
Think every body thought before but is it possible to make a tweeter horn like Seos 12, OSWG, J-M Le Cléac'h 200 with a 3D print.
Ok some horns are not expensives, but some of the best ones are not gift for the bucks and are not easy to transport.
I know that the wood is far the best material both for the damping and vibrations proof for horns but see many plastic horns here used without philosophical problems ! So I ask the naive question.
Some advantages if plastic of 3D printers quality is good enough to avoid bad resonances and vibrations (thinking to about little OB baffle for tweeter and medium):
No polution from transport
Free transport fees and no problem of break horns with it.
just a cab with specs to send with Internet ?
Well sorry if naive question,
My motivation : I hesitate with many philosophy for my next speakers : planars (NEO 10) + NEO 3 PDR or little horn (which profil Seos, JMLC...other) or mix : Mid Planar with little horn & CD padded down (never understand if CD have better sound than little planars or ribbons/AMT ?! Is it just for efficienty?).
Reducing the cost is one of the choice factor for me...reading many thread here I see little cost CD and little horn can have good sound above 1,5 k hz...
Eldam
Think every body thought before but is it possible to make a tweeter horn like Seos 12, OSWG, J-M Le Cléac'h 200 with a 3D print.
Ok some horns are not expensives, but some of the best ones are not gift for the bucks and are not easy to transport.
I know that the wood is far the best material both for the damping and vibrations proof for horns but see many plastic horns here used without philosophical problems ! So I ask the naive question.
Some advantages if plastic of 3D printers quality is good enough to avoid bad resonances and vibrations (thinking to about little OB baffle for tweeter and medium):
No polution from transport
Free transport fees and no problem of break horns with it.
just a cab with specs to send with Internet ?
Well sorry if naive question,
My motivation : I hesitate with many philosophy for my next speakers : planars (NEO 10) + NEO 3 PDR or little horn (which profil Seos, JMLC...other) or mix : Mid Planar with little horn & CD padded down (never understand if CD have better sound than little planars or ribbons/AMT ?! Is it just for efficienty?).
Reducing the cost is one of the choice factor for me...reading many thread here I see little cost CD and little horn can have good sound above 1,5 k hz...
Eldam
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For common horn shape it doesn't seem to make sense, it's faster and cheaper to buy one.
If you need something really custom, that would be a better choice. For example, I'm waiting for 3D printer to get a custom multi-cell tweeter horn. That's not something you can buy.
If you need something really custom, that would be a better choice. For example, I'm waiting for 3D printer to get a custom multi-cell tweeter horn. That's not something you can buy.
My question is because it's possible to find more and more 3D printers in self service... and the cost falls everyday for a single customer use !
I would second my question please by : which low budget or good Q/P horn for a 1/4 or 1" CD (XO >1500 hz) ? very hard to follow the "war" between Seos, JMLC, Geedes (not on sale but some pale copy for diy), and others ? IS a planar or ribbon can do the same job if not efficienty needed ?
I would second my question please by : which low budget or good Q/P horn for a 1/4 or 1" CD (XO >1500 hz) ? very hard to follow the "war" between Seos, JMLC, Geedes (not on sale but some pale copy for diy), and others ? IS a planar or ribbon can do the same job if not efficienty needed ?
Beyma TPL150 is 99dB (1w@1m). How much do you need? (we don't know anything about your design?!) Some references
The Paper Horn
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/178187-great-waveguide-list-8.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/232159-dispersion-crossover-points.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/231551-beyma-12p80nd-tpl-150-a-16.html
The Paper Horn
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/178187-great-waveguide-list-8.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/232159-dispersion-crossover-points.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/231551-beyma-12p80nd-tpl-150-a-16.html
Now 3D printers (extruders) cost only $300 - ABS, PLA. It's really easy to make horns at home and then thicken. Disadvantage - small working area. Cost - 20$ per kg?
Thanks Inductor,
I already read and follow the TP150s'.
I just try to understand what design I can choose in regards to the price. Around 1000 euros by speaker without active XO cost.
It can be ESL or horn if it sound good, I give up the idea of B&G RD75 because the size, I give up the ESL because I found the diaphragm is problematic (tensioning & coating) but it can be : Neo 10, classic cone, horn, ribbon...
i want to go with active XO, have around 35 m² living room and want to try better than a Kef 104/2 or a Boston Lynfield 400L I have. I have the temptation to try something else than the classic cone I have but don't have the space to put a Magneplanar or OB at the midle of the room (1 meter from the front wall is the max) or a full horn solution.
Because of the good reputation of CD+horn I asked how reduce the cost of the horn for > 1500 hz
In the design the limit is the cost, the size of the room, not the efficienty (my lynnfield are 85 db/W/m) and of course quality of the synergie : if at the same price a little horn with little 1"CD can have a better sound than a little ribbon in relation with the mid driver you have to choose : it's ok. And maybe : no XO between 2000 and 7000 if possible : my ears are trebles traps !
I begann around a Neo 10 (300 to 2000 hz) then a ?? treble (NEO 3 rdp is short for 2000 hz). Think below 300 : a light cone (OB at < 1 meter from the front wall???? no go ?) and below 80 hz : closed box or independant subwoofer. if it's possible a driver alone below 300 hz which seems not easy to match with fast planar like Neo 10 ! You know all... I am at the beginning. Don't need an another speaker but need something better I already have (Kef 104/2 : excelent, relaxing, 3D, super treble... but a little lake of resolution and low bass ; Lynfield : very fast, super bass, fast, tight, very transparent, 3D too, but I don't like the treble)
I already read and follow the TP150s'.
I just try to understand what design I can choose in regards to the price. Around 1000 euros by speaker without active XO cost.
It can be ESL or horn if it sound good, I give up the idea of B&G RD75 because the size, I give up the ESL because I found the diaphragm is problematic (tensioning & coating) but it can be : Neo 10, classic cone, horn, ribbon...
i want to go with active XO, have around 35 m² living room and want to try better than a Kef 104/2 or a Boston Lynfield 400L I have. I have the temptation to try something else than the classic cone I have but don't have the space to put a Magneplanar or OB at the midle of the room (1 meter from the front wall is the max) or a full horn solution.
Because of the good reputation of CD+horn I asked how reduce the cost of the horn for > 1500 hz
In the design the limit is the cost, the size of the room, not the efficienty (my lynnfield are 85 db/W/m) and of course quality of the synergie : if at the same price a little horn with little 1"CD can have a better sound than a little ribbon in relation with the mid driver you have to choose : it's ok. And maybe : no XO between 2000 and 7000 if possible : my ears are trebles traps !
I begann around a Neo 10 (300 to 2000 hz) then a ?? treble (NEO 3 rdp is short for 2000 hz). Think below 300 : a light cone (OB at < 1 meter from the front wall???? no go ?) and below 80 hz : closed box or independant subwoofer. if it's possible a driver alone below 300 hz which seems not easy to match with fast planar like Neo 10 ! You know all... I am at the beginning. Don't need an another speaker but need something better I already have (Kef 104/2 : excelent, relaxing, 3D, super treble... but a little lake of resolution and low bass ; Lynfield : very fast, super bass, fast, tight, very transparent, 3D too, but I don't like the treble)
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Jzagaja,
Thanks,
i know your good reputation, but for me at the moment : all this horns are the same, I am simply enable to choose one and don't know if CD is the way to go for me (I don't need high efficienty : if I go with horn it will be for room + sound blend (best design regarding the sound quality in my budget).
Thanks,
i know your good reputation, but for me at the moment : all this horns are the same, I am simply enable to choose one and don't know if CD is the way to go for me (I don't need high efficienty : if I go with horn it will be for room + sound blend (best design regarding the sound quality in my budget).
The major manufacturers design a horn, print it, measure it and then make corrections. If they are good it takes only two passes before the design is released for production.
Never understand why an Iwata in wood is so expensive for the last 30 years I look at audio world ! the price of a fridge ! Sometimes more expensive than the CD himself (I don't talk about TAD, GOTO....).
I think it's expensive because for many audiophile it's like the end of a road : nothing better, bigger...so a dream have to be expensive !
But don't want a polemic, just want to understand for the same price which is the best sound between horn or planarr, ribbon, ... don't tell me it's a trade off ! I know that, ok each drivers have to be chosen with each others and dictat the final design... i already know that.
I seems to me we are all talking about two things : the final cost and the room integration...
I think it's expensive because for many audiophile it's like the end of a road : nothing better, bigger...so a dream have to be expensive !
But don't want a polemic, just want to understand for the same price which is the best sound between horn or planarr, ribbon, ... don't tell me it's a trade off ! I know that, ok each drivers have to be chosen with each others and dictat the final design... i already know that.
I seems to me we are all talking about two things : the final cost and the room integration...
I would love to get a MakerBot and have fun with it. I don't know much about the properties of the plastic it uses or it's suitability for this use. One could do all kinds of lens and throat shapes. Not cheap though.
I read somewhere that some of the 3D printers use ABS. Avantgarde acoustics use the same stuff in their horns.
I think this is a really good idea. I have tried to find DIY 3D printers that are big enough for some of the bigger horns, but have had no luck yet.
I think this is a really good idea. I have tried to find DIY 3D printers that are big enough for some of the bigger horns, but have had no luck yet.
A buddy at work is trying to build one from old HP plotters. If he does, it will be cool - and big.
Just bear in mind that most cheap 3d printers will require a lot of supports on the part to stop it from deforming during the phase change process. These will be difficult to remove while keeping sections and wall thickness correct. Fancier printers nowadays can use water soluble supports which make things massively simpler. I work at a 3d printing company specialising in titanium and nickel super alloys for aerospace r&d and formula 1 mainly. A Formula 1 turbo casing may take 5 days to print but then it's got about the same again in finishing time. They're worth almost £30000 each at the end of it though 😀
Nice! Would be nice to see some pictures eventually 🙂
I can understand that they don't make them very big because of homeuse, but is there really any challenge in doing them bigger? What is really deciding the XYZ boundaries? I guess the programming?
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