Gotta agree on those THD numbers. The best tube amps are usually no better than 0.05%. When you get that many decimal points over you need gear from these guys Audio Precision : High Performance Audio Analyzer & Audio Test Instruments
Sure you can.
http://vacuumtubeart.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/dsc01742.jpg
This made me feel much better about my own work.
What are you guys talking about? Come on now. You know there is nothing sound-wise that approaches the audio nuances provided by unbalanced series/parallel capacitors, generic electrolytics, and cement resistors!
So, if it is in the 'tuning', that defines your products, what is the problem discussing the schematic. This is a DIY site, I don't think anyone is going to 'steal' your design, as there is probably nothing innovative in the circuit (not much new in the last 50 years in valve amp topologies). Discussing here is not going to change your reputation as a builder or tuner amongst your clients.
Also, could you tell us how you made the THD measurements? They are quite impressive.
Cheers
I seem to recall 'Morgan' referring to "cross wires at a 90 degree angle if possible".............Those way neat bundled trunks of wiring could wreak havoc with inductances' and stray capacitances . Therefore, the most rats' nest looking P2P wiring would seem best from an inductance point of view.
While not "pretty" to most, it functions the best.
______________________________________________________Rick..........
While not "pretty" to most, it functions the best.
______________________________________________________Rick..........
Please, please let me be wrong...
Looking at the photo linked by SY, but it looks like the multi-series/parallel capacitor bank (just 'down' from the right most speaker terminal) is attached to the chassis with nothing but hot melt glue. The 'time lapse' shot in the video on the web site appears to confirm that. Note that this bank of capacitors is connected to the paralleled tube rectifiers (via pin 2, not 8!), so is at B+. I also note that several of the amps in other photos here Vacuum Tube Amplifiers by Steve White appear to only have 2 conductor power cords, and I can't see the safety earth point inside the chassis (PLEASE PLEASE LET ME BE WRONG!). You can see where this is going can't you? To me this looks like a very serious safety issue.
Maybe one of the more experienced veterans of these forums could please confirm that I have not made a mistake here.
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Yep your right....Two conductor power cord, no Earth ground. On the left side, note the irregular shaped holes (Done by drilling with a drill-bit too big, not in stages)....the holes gobbed with RTV because "they" didn't bother with a proper grommet. Note the poorly spiraled heater lines, the terminal strip on the right which has been "bent" to fit, some standard resistors in close proximity to those big heat producer ceramics. Where is the full-length Buss-Bar?? There are a few "bare" bars but nothing traversing the whole of the chassis. This looks altogether rushed to finish.
__________________________________________________________Rick........
__________________________________________________________Rick........
I was going to mention that they all looked like they had two-wire power cords
on the web site, SCARY. Safety has NOTHING to do with "tuning" or tweaking or whatever. These amps look like some had a garage full of console and jukebox amps from the 50's and 60's, tons of spray-paint, some cheap Xicon caps and normal resistors, and a lot of time on their hands. I am not trying to bad-mouth anyones work, after all I love all kinds of tube amps, but I get really antsy when someone starts talking like Yoda trained them in the jedi ways of rebuilding consoles and only the force can be used to get the magical sound.
Quote from The_Manta;
"But this is a forum where technical aspects matter. Circuits are discussed, calculated and simulated. Lots of people build with tubes just for fun. They know that a SS amp will achieve a much lower THD than that old tube stuff. But that doesn't matter. Thank god!
Me and for sure many others here are glad to see your amplifiers and that you found happy customers. No jealousy. But you don't have to tell me or other here about a superior circuit or "tuning".
Well put.....
on the web site, SCARY. Safety has NOTHING to do with "tuning" or tweaking or whatever. These amps look like some had a garage full of console and jukebox amps from the 50's and 60's, tons of spray-paint, some cheap Xicon caps and normal resistors, and a lot of time on their hands. I am not trying to bad-mouth anyones work, after all I love all kinds of tube amps, but I get really antsy when someone starts talking like Yoda trained them in the jedi ways of rebuilding consoles and only the force can be used to get the magical sound.
Quote from The_Manta;
"But this is a forum where technical aspects matter. Circuits are discussed, calculated and simulated. Lots of people build with tubes just for fun. They know that a SS amp will achieve a much lower THD than that old tube stuff. But that doesn't matter. Thank god!
Me and for sure many others here are glad to see your amplifiers and that you found happy customers. No jealousy. But you don't have to tell me or other here about a superior circuit or "tuning".
Well put.....
I must say that the standard of wiring had me look more closely. I noted the points made by Richard above, as well as having the wires for the plate caps protrude from the chassis with no grommets, and it made me curious to look a little further... I work in an industry where a big mis-match between ego and ability kills people. The claims on the web site, the responses by the builder on this site flashed the 'ego' warning light, and the pictures of the build flashed the 'ability' light.
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Look closely at the video on the web-site, note the 'mega amp version obviously pirated in part from an old console.........the pictures flash in rapid succession but by freezing the frames you can see the one build using a pair of old well rusted transformers..........correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't rusting of laminations ruin the performance of transformers?? This underside photo does show a IEE power socket in the upper right-hand of the photo.
'Doesn't it lead you to believe one could make money selling your own designs a few at a time knowing what NOT to do.'?
_____________________________________________________Rick.........
'Doesn't it lead you to believe one could make money selling your own designs a few at a time knowing what NOT to do.'?
_____________________________________________________Rick.........
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Actually, my beefs were quite technical. What he said on his web site is just plain wrong.
I'm better than "an EE of sorts". I'm an actual EE, and I have the papers to prove it. Who the hell cares? I learned onehelluavlot more sitting in the basement with a hot soldering iron and a pile of parts from Rat Shack than I ever learned sitting in some lecture hall with a hundred other guys, most of whom spent the time dreaming of what they had planned for the weekend or nursing the hang-overs from last weekend, all the while hoping to retain enough to regurgitate onto the next exam. There was a lot of that, but as to actual understanding, not so much.
Four years of that and not word one about anything relevant to how to make an audio amp sound really good. It's no big mystery to me why so many solid state amps sound as horrid as they do. There's really no excuse for that, and I get outstanding performance from solid state (that's how I got started) and I get outstanding performance from hollow state.
And, yes, I would like to go down the technical road with him. Isn't that what the DiY Audio forums are for?
Wow so true..
Its like driving, you learn to drive..then you learn to drive..
Hopfully the college/uni work you did (1976on) gave you enough to stop you getting killed..then you go back and train others to be safe..
Regards
M. Gregg
"The kid" is in his forties.😀
I was quite taken with the incredibly poor heater lead dress (not that anything else is better, but that one jumped out at me). I suspect that induced hum would overwhelm the 0.0001 distortion (note that he doesn't use %, leaving some ambiguity), but as there are no spectra shown of noise, test signals, or anything else, it's difficult to say. I haven't traced out the grounding, doesn't seem worth it.
As someone who ascribes no mystical properties to wires, I have to admit that I was still surprised at the use of what appears to be salvaged lamp cord.
Don't get too hung up on the Jedi tuning stuff- when you're running a custom business like that, you're selling a story. The word Nelson Pass uses is "entertainment." It's no different than the design gurus claiming that they have magic ways of making things sound good unknown to conventional engineers.
I was quite taken with the incredibly poor heater lead dress (not that anything else is better, but that one jumped out at me). I suspect that induced hum would overwhelm the 0.0001 distortion (note that he doesn't use %, leaving some ambiguity), but as there are no spectra shown of noise, test signals, or anything else, it's difficult to say. I haven't traced out the grounding, doesn't seem worth it.
As someone who ascribes no mystical properties to wires, I have to admit that I was still surprised at the use of what appears to be salvaged lamp cord.
Don't get too hung up on the Jedi tuning stuff- when you're running a custom business like that, you're selling a story. The word Nelson Pass uses is "entertainment." It's no different than the design gurus claiming that they have magic ways of making things sound good unknown to conventional engineers.
Bingo.
Besides, that's the difference between those modern amplifiers and vintage studio equipment. Back then not a single f*** was given to the design. Just plain simple grey in a rack-case. Nothing fancy. But the circuit and engineering was a perfection. Nothing like glued caps or too long wires.
Just look at those beauties:
review33 - ????
And that's the difference. Speaking of High-Fi/End today, you don't need the experience and the knowledge as it was necessary for those studio units. Shiny looks, demanding good $$$ and some people who praise your products - you're done.
Ans no, I'm not a typical "everything used to be better in the past" guy.
What a bunch of bitter ladies. lol P2P wiring messy? Where have you been? All the old hand wired gear that you guys covet look like that, please.
I myself am a little more anal about wiring, but that never once made anything sound better, unless from avoiding interference.
You have the head moderator give his opinion now all the minions come out hide behind his legs. Typical DIYaudio style gang rape.
Look over there, an outsider! Alert the curmudgeons and inflate your egos!, attack!
"How could somebody possibly build a better amp then me? After all I'm a crusty old dude that has been working with tubes since 1939, therefore I must be better then anyone. Who dare challenge my knowledge."
Please, his wiring looks the same as most practical point to point amps, if you say no, you are a lying. Secure and hum free is the name of the game. Looks are a niceity.
Miles Plower, you reported my last response to you, and had my post edited, what can I say to you.
I admit I'm a sucker for a 3 prong cord, now the rest of you better run around the house and put 3-prong cords on ALL your lamp fixtures then you can talk safety. mmm k?
So just to get this straight for all the readers, looks aren't important to sound but you are complaining about it's looks?
So your saying he should have painted the wires inside and left the outside alone? Now I get it.
Now let's have a peek under the hood of some of your work shall we?
I myself am a little more anal about wiring, but that never once made anything sound better, unless from avoiding interference.
You have the head moderator give his opinion now all the minions come out hide behind his legs. Typical DIYaudio style gang rape.
Look over there, an outsider! Alert the curmudgeons and inflate your egos!, attack!
"How could somebody possibly build a better amp then me? After all I'm a crusty old dude that has been working with tubes since 1939, therefore I must be better then anyone. Who dare challenge my knowledge."
Please, his wiring looks the same as most practical point to point amps, if you say no, you are a lying. Secure and hum free is the name of the game. Looks are a niceity.
Miles Plower, you reported my last response to you, and had my post edited, what can I say to you.
I admit I'm a sucker for a 3 prong cord, now the rest of you better run around the house and put 3-prong cords on ALL your lamp fixtures then you can talk safety. mmm k?
So just to get this straight for all the readers, looks aren't important to sound but you are complaining about it's looks?
So your saying he should have painted the wires inside and left the outside alone? Now I get it.
Now let's have a peek under the hood of some of your work shall we?
UnReal! You all (other than GloBug) are like a bunch of old hens in a hen house! This reeks of jealousy! I thought this was a friendly forum where you all share thoughts and ideas. After seeing you try to basically gang rape my work like a pack of wolves, I'm not about to share anything with any of you. Don't get the wrong idea, I am not in anyway upset by this. In fact it has been very entertaining and only goes to prove how cruel people can be to someone new, even people who claim to be educated like yourselves. Shame on all of you! It figures that only one who has any kind of real common sense and a sense of comradery is a fellow Canadian (GloBug), the rest of you are no better than the caveman. Just take a look at yourselves! Your all pathetic! I really feel sorry for all of you! Is your own lives that uneventful that have to play like this? Grow-up!!!
Well, I'm going to continue selling my handcrafted vacuum tube amplifiers like I always have, and I'm going to keep building them like I was taught. My business is a thriving one. You can all stay here and nit-pick and tear the next guy who happens to fall into your nest apart. I hope he has the same thick skin and self confidence as I have. You are all the worst examples of human-beings I have ever not personally met! Just a bunch of silly jealous kids ganging up on the new guy who seems to have it all together. Just pathetic!
Take care.
Steve White
E E AMPS
Well, I'm going to continue selling my handcrafted vacuum tube amplifiers like I always have, and I'm going to keep building them like I was taught. My business is a thriving one. You can all stay here and nit-pick and tear the next guy who happens to fall into your nest apart. I hope he has the same thick skin and self confidence as I have. You are all the worst examples of human-beings I have ever not personally met! Just a bunch of silly jealous kids ganging up on the new guy who seems to have it all together. Just pathetic!
Take care.
Steve White
E E AMPS
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