DB listening tests are unfortunately found to obscure differences that pop right back, after the test is concluded. In other words, they appear to 'just hide' the listening differences, momentarily, and this is 'science'?
Yeah, DBTs are valid in the world of science. Do you have credential to question the scientific world?
Well, I KNOW that tires make a difference on my Porsche. And real leather is kind of nice, but I won't say more comfortable. Did you mean $200 for a set of 4 tires? Or just one tire? Do you buy PS tires at a discount store or what?
Well, I KNOW that tires make a difference on my Porsche. And real leather is kind of nice, but I won't say more comfortable. Did you mean $200 for a set of 4 tires? Or just one tire? Do you buy PS tires at a discount store or what?
one tire.....there are extremely expensive tires that have no performance gains.
I have a degree in physics. Is that enough?
Thats great so you do not believe DBTs are worth much at all?
How would you go about controlling external influences then in any listening test?
DB listening tests are unfortunately found to obscure differences that pop right back, after the test is concluded. In other words, they appear to 'just hide' the listening differences, momentarily, and this is 'science'?
It is psychosomatic. The thing with me is I am not so concerned with what people *can* hear as much as what they *will* hear.
Well, I KNOW that tires make a difference on my Porsche. And real leather is kind of nice, but I won't say more comfortable. Did you mean $200 for a set of 4 tires? Or just one tire? Do you buy PS tires at a discount store or what?
$200 sounds kinda cheap for performance tires. I googled C6 Corvette tires and go a page where most of the tires were $300 and UP, on sale!
Jeff
They are test to help families decide which is healthiest for them. You do realize lots of people buy cereal for the nutrition they ACTUALLY provide, which is tested and scurtinized far beyond anything in Audio.
Do they come with an automatic feeding spoon?
Anytime anything is scurtinized in audio, you get similar characters like yourselves calling everyone else "Deaf" or "having Untrained Ears". Its the same old trick and its too bad there isnt checks and balances in this industry.
Can't recall that I've called anybody deaf. Untrained ears..., well I'm still learning, it is very worthwhile if you are willing to put in the effort. 😉
Its actually sad that many pushing the same old "Just listen" wont go and measure and do the proper controlled tests themselves.
Unfortunately all that matter is what you can hear, no measurements will ever change that.
I have done it all ways possible (just listening, proper testing, measuring as much as I can and learning) because Im honest to the hobby. I can only conclude that people here are not truely honest to the hobby.
Sure, you can only be honest if you can't hear any differences.

I've done more measuring and comparative listening than you would imagine, some blind also but apparently nothing will be good enough, not if you hear differences anyway.
I did a test once with a 100K Mercedes and a 40K Acura. I was a blind folded passenger.....
Yeah but Doug, most folks by a car to drive, not ride in. You should try a driving test blindfolded.
Oh, um -- maybe not.....

Yeah but Doug, most folks by a car to drive, not ride in. You should try a driving test blindfolded.
Oh, um -- maybe not.....![]()
lmao, yeah.....maybe not 😉
Doug20, I am also a 'life member' of the IEEE. That is because I was a member in good standing for more than 40 years. If you read more about DBX testing, you would find my input on it from more than 30 years ago. Yes, I have debated with Dr. Lipshitz, Dr. Toole, and their associates for many, many years. Who is your reference?
Doug20, I am also a 'life member' of the IEEE. That is because I was a member in good standing for more than 40 years. If you read more about DBX testing, you would find my input on it from more than 30 years ago. Yes, I have debated with Dr. Lipshitz, Dr. Toole, and their associates for many, many years. Who is your reference?
So how do you suggest we control the external influences?
misconceptions
I guess higher quality gives rise to these sort of reviews, eh?😱
my750.com - My BMW 750iL, a Driving Machine Disaster!
Misconception? I think not. It is just that some people are more tolerant of junk (sound, cars, or food) than others. There is nothing wrong with this. Some people, like the lady upstairs with the Bose, eats very often at Chez Panisse at great cost to the pocketbook. It is where she wants to put her extra income.
I guess higher quality gives rise to these sort of reviews, eh?😱
my750.com - My BMW 750iL, a Driving Machine Disaster!
I believe my system sounds better with cables. I also think that in a DBT I could tell the difference.
I again will say that I have never sold anything to anyone that did not have an opportunity to audition said cables in their systems.
Don't repeat yourself Curly.They know what you mean,but simply ignore you.If they stop ignoring you,they will have nothing to allow them call others with "cosmetic" names like idiots etc......This maybe makes them feel smarter and able to have absolute control over thei brains 🙂 Unfortunately that does not help them with their hearing though.
Member
Joined 2002
Don't repeat yourself Curly.They know what you mean,but simply ignore you.If they stop ignoring you,they will have nothing to allow them call others with "cosmetic" names like idiots etc......This maybe makes them feel smarter and able to have absolute control over thei brains 🙂 Unfortunately that does not help them with their hearing though.
I agree, it's just feeding the Fire, I think doug20 is just here to waste time and argue with any thing.
I agree, it's just feeding the Fire, I think doug20 is just here to waste time and argue with any thing.
I don't know if this is the reason he is here,I hope not 🙂
No matter how you slice and dice it, boconnor has a good point.
Why should the audio equipment and cable makers be treated differently?
As auplater said, ".... engineering fact trumps subjective appraisal in the real world outside of high end audio any day of the week."
High quality sound used to be associated with good engineering, now it seems there are people hell bent on having it associated with mysticism. 😕
Why should the audio equipment and cable makers be treated differently?
As auplater said, ".... engineering fact trumps subjective appraisal in the real world outside of high end audio any day of the week."
High quality sound used to be associated with good engineering, now it seems there are people hell bent on having it associated with mysticism. 😕
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