The news D-Amp DLS3000.... - Page 13 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Commercial Sector > Vendor Forums > Vendor's Bazaar

Vendor's Bazaar Commercial Vendors large & small hawking their wares

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 16th May 2006, 12:21 PM   #121
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Fredos, how about a factory tour ? It would be fun.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2006, 04:43 PM   #122
km is offline km
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: dk
hi.

>Be serious, don't make us laugh (well, make us laugh if you want )
What the pictures show, rated in standard terms, is a 2x300W rms into 8 ohm and 2x500W rms into 4 ohm amplifier.>

i think i agree.

fredo where is power factor correction (pfc) in your design?

dont you think a high power amp for proaudio use should have this?

best rgds - karsten madsen - cadaudio.dk / digiamps.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2006, 05:38 PM   #123
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Send a message via AIM to classd4sure Send a message via MSN to classd4sure
Quote:
Originally posted by km
hi.

>Be serious, don't make us laugh (well, make us laugh if you want )
What the pictures show, rated in standard terms, is a 2x300W rms into 8 ohm and 2x500W rms into 4 ohm amplifier.>

i think i agree.

fredo where is power factor correction (pfc) in your design?

dont you think a high power amp for proaudio use should have this?

best rgds - karsten madsen - cadaudio.dk / digiamps.com

I do too. They're rated from the perspective of what the power supply can deliver, for a limited time period, which is good information from the POV of the power supply if that's what you're selling. Usually though for amplifiers people are actually interested in the power that's available at the load, otherwise by that convention we'd probably all be alot more interested in class A than we are.

Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but rating in such a way is likely to at least double the given power rating.
  Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2006, 12:12 AM   #124
fredos is offline fredos  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Quebec
Sorry KM we dont need PFC for certification in Canada and USA...You can laugh as much as you whant, but compared to lot of manufacturer (Crown, QSC and now Crest), my power amp provide more ''real'' watts than competitor. Just for an example, a crest LT2000 do not provide more than 800Watts per channel in 4 ohms at begining of clipping, and 500Watts per channel at 0.1% distortion....And thermal shutdown occur in about 3 minute at full power. A crown K2 rated at 1250W per channel only provide 950W on the bench, and best a QSC PLX3402 just put out e tinny 500W per channel into 4 ohms...Whant more or you think that my bench is uncalibrated? My news pre-production prototype provide a CONTINUOUS 1500watts per channel in 2 ohms in pure resitive load for about 15 minutes before thermal trip occure.

So now I can laugh about Hypex, Ice Power and CAD audio power amp supposely rated for full power all the time with a small aluminium block of 1X2 inch....And from a lot of review, they sound disgusting at clipping. Another thing to take in consideration for pro audio...I never see a sound man that not drive all power amp in sever clipping at the end of a show...

Last thing I think that a lot of people have not understand from now is that speaker is a kind of capacitive, inductive and resistive load, so real power delivered to load is VA....You will always measure less Watts than VA in a load, but VA is real power provided to load, somebody will finish to realize this???? Or amplifier is just design to drive resistive load in a bench at full power?

If just someone realize that power amp was for speaker and play music, not for spec or long term RMS ratting, lot more of good product will be utilised by professional! Just talk about PowerSoft and all other pionner in that field...

So continue to laugh and make power amp for spec and pure resistive load driven continuously for long time with PFC because you dont have enaught power in your outlet!

Sorry for this reply, but lot of people did not realise about what they talk....And I know, I have lot to learn again!

Fredos

www.d-amp.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2006, 12:43 AM   #125
kartino is offline kartino  Indonesia
diyAudio Member
 
kartino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Gunungkidul Indonesia
OK, I got the point here, that we must read carefully the specification before buy the amps. That's it.

BTW OOT, I myself never shocked with KW rated amps at 1 ohm or 2 ohm, Why? I never connect my load less than 4 ohm, because of most of arrangement on stage is one speaker for one line amps, or two speaker parallel. Are we need big amps with low impedance?
  Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2006, 04:33 AM   #126
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Send a message via AIM to classd4sure Send a message via MSN to classd4sure
I think the reason we prefer or are attracted to "supposed" continuous sine ratings is because it speaks well to the ruggedness of the design. If it can handle that, then you know it's not penny pinched engineered and likely to fail the very day the warranty runs dry.

Kartino, I think 1 ohm load testing /ratings is useful given that speakers vary in impedance and it's good to know the amp can actually deliver in such a case, rather than clip, or go into protection.
  Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2006, 01:17 PM   #127
fredos is offline fredos  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Quebec
Your right classd4sure, but unfortunatly, lot of (big) company dont reach at all the rated power they announce, specialy QSC, so if you trust more a ''continuously'' rated power with less power than the spec, let go! But just think that if they put anything for power measurement, what about the other spec?

Yes you can trust a continuously rated power amp, but by experience, class D rated at 1/3 of maximum power stay always cooler than analog amp...Lot of discotheque and rave use my amp and analog amp and I can told you that my amp is always warm at the end of the night (or day for the rave) and analog amp will be extremly hot....So what about this if you run amp at 100% power rating??? Semiconductor can go over 150 celcius at the die so??????

Any explanation for this? Have you ever work with a pro audio kit, or just play at home with home amplifier? I have 15 years experience in pro audio installation and configuration, I have learn a lot on what pro whant and dont whant, and better, I have try a lot and a lot of power amp, I can only told you at this time I only trust the CA serie of crest and the old QSC 3000 serie, from now that the only real ''spected'' amplifier. I never see nothing except these amp with real spec. So now, one thing I do with my company, I try to always be higher than what customer expect, and that's why I sold as much amplifier to replace competitor amplifier in club and rave....

Finaly, have understand what I talk about when I talk about VA deliver to the load or you still think that watts are more effective than VA TO THE load?

Have a nice day classd4sure! When did you come to montreal? I wish to meet you!

Fredos

www.d-amp.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 19th May 2006, 12:37 AM   #128
kartino is offline kartino  Indonesia
diyAudio Member
 
kartino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Gunungkidul Indonesia
Fof test, 1 ohm, yes we need for very low frequency behaviour.

The problem is that most of people will say: "woow big amps, coool!" because only see the first page of the brochure. But OK if fredos said that most of pro manufacturer claim their power rating with same way, then we must read carefully for every line in specification. I thiks that the manufacturer already prepare for legal things. So there is no complain anymore. Lucky for sound engineer who know that!

I agree with Crest if the good on stage amps, (QSC? hate complex one!) how compared with yours fredos?
  Reply With Quote
Old 19th May 2006, 07:54 PM   #129
fredos is offline fredos  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Quebec
Hello Kartino

On the bench the LT2000 of crest is more powerfull than my small DLS 800 that I rate at 400W/ch at 4 Ohms (versus 800W per channel for the crest at 4 ohms too) but on loudspeaker their is no difference, except that sound is more ''wide'' with the D-Amp. Voice are more in front and instrument is more detailed. The LT2000 versus the DLS 1500 (750W per channel 4 ohms) and the DLS 3000 (1500W per channel into 2 ohms) seem to be lot less powerfull than these 2 D-Amp. The QSC PLX3402 at 500W per channel at 4 ohms on the bench is the most ''lean'' amplifier. It sound agressive, do not have bass at all and sound the less powerfull. The Crown K2 rated at 1250W per channel into 4 ohms with 950Watts on the bench seem as much powerfull than the D-Amp DLS 3000, but unfortunately lean in bass, but these one have the better sound in mid-hi frequency. Is more wide and more definition than all other amp. But for the price, I continue to think that we have the better ratio power/sound quality/price!

What I expect for the lean bass in the Crown is the toroidal transformer....For the QSC is the name on the box :-) (I hate QSC too...Now that they have a name, they make scrap...) An about the Crest, maybe the design because at +/- 135V, they should have lot more power!

Have a nice day everybody!

Fredos

www.d-amp.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 20th May 2006, 01:41 AM   #130
diyAudio Member
 
Workhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Quote:
Originally posted by fredos
Hello Kartino

On the bench the LT2000 of crest is more powerfull than my small DLS 800 that I rate at 400W/ch at 4 Ohms (versus 800W per channel for the crest at 4 ohms too) but on loudspeaker their is no difference, except that sound is more ''wide'' with the D-Amp. Voice are more in front and instrument is more detailed. The LT2000 versus the DLS 1500 (750W per channel 4 ohms) and the DLS 3000 (1500W per channel into 2 ohms) seem to be lot less powerfull than these 2 D-Amp. The QSC PLX3402 at 500W per channel at 4 ohms on the bench is the most ''lean'' amplifier. It sound agressive, do not have bass at all and sound the less powerfull. The Crown K2 rated at 1250W per channel into 4 ohms with 950Watts on the bench seem as much powerfull than the D-Amp DLS 3000, but unfortunately lean in bass, but these one have the better sound in mid-hi frequency. Is more wide and more definition than all other amp. But for the price, I continue to think that we have the better ratio power/sound quality/price!

What I expect for the lean bass in the Crown is the toroidal transformer....For the QSC is the name on the box :-) (I hate QSC too...Now that they have a name, they make scrap...) An about the Crest, maybe the design because at +/- 135V, they should have lot more power!

Have a nice day everybody!

Fredos

www.d-amp.com
Hi Fredos,

You were Absoulutely Right!

If you look at QSC's older designs such as 3800 series, Usa series they were good, but these newer Class-H amps with Switching power supplies were all just a scrap they were selling by manufacturing them in China, RMX[Linear supply],PLX[Switching supply] all sounded harsh....and much contaminated sonics...
Yes, Crest is a little bit different and has some sonics performance edge above these amps...but costs alot...

Whereas in Class-D, if implemented properly , I could say it would outperform many of the Linear High-End amps in that category and the pro-amp segment could be very easily conquered.

The designers [With Knowledge limited to Class-A/AB]who simply donot know how [Or some even donot want to know] to design a good Class-D would simply start to criticise it because the Class-D technology gives them a deadly blow in many areas such as
Less Power-Supply requirements,
LightWeight,
Less Heatsinking,
Absence of Cross-Over distortion,
Outstanding reactive load handling
All these features makes Class-D a perfect choice for High power solutions in Pro-audio segment and even Hi-End.

QSC has also developed a 1.2kW Class-D amp modules for powering up their Active Speakers HPR series...

regards,
K a n w a r
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 12.jpg (45.0 KB, 1036 views)
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
There's good news and there's bad news Magnetmaz The Lounge 14 2nd January 2012 06:39 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:58 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2