Hey Guys,
So, I've been putting off the finish of an old project.... Time to finish it up.
I have some Front Panel Express machined pieces that will sit in a recessed wood chassis. Basically, the panel is rectangular, and I have routed out a recess in the chassis for the panel to fit in so it is flush with the surface of the chassis....
I dont want to drill the panel, as I want a clean look. I was thinking about bonding either plastic or metal tabs on the inside of the panel, which could then be mounted to the inside of the wood chassis. Does anyone know what would be the best way to bond either plastic or metal to the anodized aluminum...
I am out of my element here.
Thank for any suggestions.
Bryan
So, I've been putting off the finish of an old project.... Time to finish it up.
I have some Front Panel Express machined pieces that will sit in a recessed wood chassis. Basically, the panel is rectangular, and I have routed out a recess in the chassis for the panel to fit in so it is flush with the surface of the chassis....
I dont want to drill the panel, as I want a clean look. I was thinking about bonding either plastic or metal tabs on the inside of the panel, which could then be mounted to the inside of the wood chassis. Does anyone know what would be the best way to bond either plastic or metal to the anodized aluminum...
I am out of my element here.
Thank for any suggestions.
Bryan
Ahhh bit too thin to drill and tap a blind hole from behind then...
I guess it would have to Areldite and some little mounting blocks then...Maybe rivets (traditional ones, not pop rivets) and then smoothed again could look nice (maybe surface grinder or a big linisher). Cant think of too many other ways if it has to be flush with the wood
Good luck,
Steve
I guess it would have to Areldite and some little mounting blocks then...Maybe rivets (traditional ones, not pop rivets) and then smoothed again could look nice (maybe surface grinder or a big linisher). Cant think of too many other ways if it has to be flush with the wood
Good luck,
Steve
Yup, for plastic and metal bonding, cyanoacrylates are, ummm, super. The one caution is to pay attention to thermal expansion/contraction issues between the differing materials you want to bond. If this is not dealt with in design (e.g., match of CTEs or some sort of strain relief), it can cause adhesive failure. This is most critical with relatively brittle adhesives like unmodified epoxy and cyanoacrylate.
Surprising what is bonded with tape
Cyanoacrylates will seep into the wood grain making them less effective. The consumer "super" glues also break down over time. Two part epoxy is both overkill and overly permanent. Mess it up and there is now way to fix it.
Get some double-sided tape from 3M. They are relatively cheap, fast and easy. Make sure it has acrylic adhesive. Even though rubber-based adhesive sticks better initially, acrylic adhesives don't break down over time. If you ever decide the wood panel is too dented and want to save or re-use the aluminum plate, a little solvent like lighter fluid (Zippo) will break down the acrylic adhesive enough to pull the pieces apart.
My preferences tend to be #468 transfer tape or 9500 series double-coated tapes.
http://selector.3m.com/cm/default.asp
ensen.
Cyanoacrylates will seep into the wood grain making them less effective. The consumer "super" glues also break down over time. Two part epoxy is both overkill and overly permanent. Mess it up and there is now way to fix it.
Get some double-sided tape from 3M. They are relatively cheap, fast and easy. Make sure it has acrylic adhesive. Even though rubber-based adhesive sticks better initially, acrylic adhesives don't break down over time. If you ever decide the wood panel is too dented and want to save or re-use the aluminum plate, a little solvent like lighter fluid (Zippo) will break down the acrylic adhesive enough to pull the pieces apart.
My preferences tend to be #468 transfer tape or 9500 series double-coated tapes.
http://selector.3m.com/cm/default.asp
ensen.
Hi,
They always do, don't they? I hate that stuff, honestly I do.
True but at least it does what it's supposed to; glue.
Ah, another smoker....This is just purified petrol AKA nafta.
Always useful to have around but highly flamable so be careful with it....The marks on the back of my left hand speak volumes.
The double sided tape looks like a good idea though.
Cheers,
They always do, don't they? I hate that stuff, honestly I do.
True but at least it does what it's supposed to; glue.
Ah, another smoker....This is just purified petrol AKA nafta.
Always useful to have around but highly flamable so be careful with it....The marks on the back of my left hand speak volumes.
The double sided tape looks like a good idea though.
Cheers,
fdegrove said:
Nope, but just like with lubricants, a universal type is usually universally bad for everything. Take a product like WD40....everybody knows it, and anybody who knows a bit about lubricants stay clear of it, and uses a specialized lubricant for the specific purpose. Its the same with cyanoacrylates. I have like 10 different types for each their specific application.
Take a look at the range from Locktite, they cover the most usual types of "super glue".
Magura
Actually, ex-smoker and although I had a Zippo, I didn't know the fuel had excellent qualities as a glue remover, until I worked in the trophy industry. In fact, it is better than the glue remover stuff you get at the store because it is cheaper and more widely available - like the drugstore.
As just about everyone can attest, removing something stuck with foam tape is the proverbial beach. There is always some foam and glue bits left over on at least one of the dis-bonded surfaces.
To fix your aesthetic problem, pour a little Zippo on it, let is sit for about 5 minutes (no don't light it) and it can be rubbed off with a little paper towel. For tougher tapes, a little "scrubbing" will usually work and the worst offenders can be scraped gently with an edge of the softer material (for wood use plastic, for metal use wood, etc.).
Warning: be careful with some finishes as the fluid can dissolve them, like relatively weak paints, etc. If in doubt test in the usual hidden spots.
Still, it evaporates very quickly so it usually doesn't wreck a finish that has been around long enough to cure.
And just in case some of you don't believe me about tapes... try peeling off the various trims on your car... they are taped. Membrane switches are taped and even some parts of airplanes. If it were feasible, I would consider taping together speaker boxes!
ensen.
As just about everyone can attest, removing something stuck with foam tape is the proverbial beach. There is always some foam and glue bits left over on at least one of the dis-bonded surfaces.
To fix your aesthetic problem, pour a little Zippo on it, let is sit for about 5 minutes (no don't light it) and it can be rubbed off with a little paper towel. For tougher tapes, a little "scrubbing" will usually work and the worst offenders can be scraped gently with an edge of the softer material (for wood use plastic, for metal use wood, etc.).
Warning: be careful with some finishes as the fluid can dissolve them, like relatively weak paints, etc. If in doubt test in the usual hidden spots.
Still, it evaporates very quickly so it usually doesn't wreck a finish that has been around long enough to cure.
And just in case some of you don't believe me about tapes... try peeling off the various trims on your car... they are taped. Membrane switches are taped and even some parts of airplanes. If it were feasible, I would consider taping together speaker boxes!
ensen.
Magura is right that not all are bad, but most of the retail stuff is highly overated. For example, Krazy Glue works in less than 5 secs but doesn't last that long.
Most cyanoacrylates give up strength or durability to bond fast. In some cases, though, the strength is often more than enough for the application.
So, if you insist on a liquid adhesive, try the Loctite 400 series industrial cyanoacrylates. They will bond most metals but will still have some problem with the wood porosity. The slower ones need some clamping but are stronger. Some of the faster ones will achieve 80% max strength within 10 secs, like #411. It's surprisingly good, almost magical with metal to metal bonds.
ensen.
Most cyanoacrylates give up strength or durability to bond fast. In some cases, though, the strength is often more than enough for the application.
So, if you insist on a liquid adhesive, try the Loctite 400 series industrial cyanoacrylates. They will bond most metals but will still have some problem with the wood porosity. The slower ones need some clamping but are stronger. Some of the faster ones will achieve 80% max strength within 10 secs, like #411. It's surprisingly good, almost magical with metal to metal bonds.
ensen.
The 467 is thinner, probably better for joining two nonporous materials. But... to realize the superb strength of that line of adhesives, you've got to apply a LOT of bonding pressure. I ran a factory making membrane switch-like assemblies, and we had to use a roll laminator or (for small volume stuff) brayers and a lot of muscle. With two rigid objects, you have to think through how you're going to get the required pressures and how to prevent air bubbles (a VERY nontrivial problem).
BTW, 468 works great for veneering, too.
Actually, 3M just discontinued the #467 due to low demand. But no matter since this is hand-made work, I believe the #468 is the better choice, because the thicker tape will conform more easily to variations in the surface flatness. IOW, being thick enough to fill gaps between each surface, the tape will put more area into contact and hold better. This is why foam tapes work so well.
Another thing about pressure sensitive adhesive is that a lot of pressure is only necessary if you need high bond strength in a very short time. If you are willing to wait 3 days to a week, these types of adhesives will begin to near 80% of final bond strength. In the case of the #468, this is probably close to the strength needed for structural components, not just pretty faceplates. So, while it is overkill, it is still cheaper, and less messy than liquid glues.
If you are having trouble sourcing the #468, try calling a local picture framer, a trophy/awards shop, a shipping supplies vendor or an art supplies store. Even if they don't have #468, these places may have something similar from another mfg like Tesa 4970 or Scapa D-series tapes.
ensen
Another thing about pressure sensitive adhesive is that a lot of pressure is only necessary if you need high bond strength in a very short time. If you are willing to wait 3 days to a week, these types of adhesives will begin to near 80% of final bond strength. In the case of the #468, this is probably close to the strength needed for structural components, not just pretty faceplates. So, while it is overkill, it is still cheaper, and less messy than liquid glues.
If you are having trouble sourcing the #468, try calling a local picture framer, a trophy/awards shop, a shipping supplies vendor or an art supplies store. Even if they don't have #468, these places may have something similar from another mfg like Tesa 4970 or Scapa D-series tapes.
ensen
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