I have been toying around with the idea of building some smaller subs for smaller gigs/weddings yet something very powerful and portable. I want to get the most out of something quite tiny/light so that I can get more use out of it for bigger gigs than normal (for its size/weight).
Power shouldn't be an issue as I plan on using a mini dsp plate amp (2400w 4r) for one or two of these.
What types or plans of subs would be best? Or does this idea seam silly when I am building high power th18's?
Power shouldn't be an issue as I plan on using a mini dsp plate amp (2400w 4r) for one or two of these.
What types or plans of subs would be best? Or does this idea seam silly when I am building high power th18's?
What you are proposing has been done but with current speaker technology you can't have it all in a single package.. low, loud, and small. Any 10" or 12"driver than can handle big power is going to have an abysmally low sensitivity so it's almost a waste of amplifier when you only need 35-40hz low end extension..IMO.
Right, well I would prefer to get down to 40-45hz (a bit lower than ss15). As for size and weight its whatever I can reasonably get away with. I have been looking at the pal12 again but with a powerful driver. I would preferably like to get smaller/lighter than that but I accept It will not go as loud or as low.
I am open to design options like ported/sealed/reflex if that makes more sense when wanting a small sub with lots of power.
Ideally something like a pal 12 with a higher low corner and a much more powerful driver or even smaller sealed/ported/vented if that makes more sense. There are a lot of commercial small subs out there but I would hope to beat them by using a much stronger driver and also maybe design so that I don't need as many, or have it be more scaleable.
I just want to make my life a lot easier for weddings and smaller high end events but do it better/more scaleable than most commercially available subs.
At this point a pal12 loaded with a B&C 12tBX100 is my plan but It will just be me handling all the equipment so lighter/smaller would be better even if compromising on other things.
I realize there's a point where you end up compromising too much, Im just not sure where that is.
I am open to design options like ported/sealed/reflex if that makes more sense when wanting a small sub with lots of power.
Ideally something like a pal 12 with a higher low corner and a much more powerful driver or even smaller sealed/ported/vented if that makes more sense. There are a lot of commercial small subs out there but I would hope to beat them by using a much stronger driver and also maybe design so that I don't need as many, or have it be more scaleable.
I just want to make my life a lot easier for weddings and smaller high end events but do it better/more scaleable than most commercially available subs.
At this point a pal12 loaded with a B&C 12tBX100 is my plan but It will just be me handling all the equipment so lighter/smaller would be better even if compromising on other things.
I realize there's a point where you end up compromising too much, Im just not sure where that is.
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this guy says his THAM12 in 1/2" BB with a neo B&C weighs around 30lb
THAM 12 loaded with B&C 12NDL76 - YouTube
http://www.martinsson.cc/blog/index.php?m=03&y=12&entry=entry120315-210219
THAM 12 loaded with B&C 12NDL76 - YouTube
http://www.martinsson.cc/blog/index.php?m=03&y=12&entry=entry120315-210219
I think 40 Hz with a 12" driver for pro audio use is do-able, but you really have to be aware of the trade-offs.
You're likely going to need to go with some sort of horn or hybrid alignment, to get the efficiency up (a simple vented alignment with a 12" driver that's reasonably flat down to 40 Hz is likely not going to be efficient enough). That means a larger box requirement, and if building a larger box is acceptable, you're going to find yourself asking if it might have been better to use a 15" vented alignment instead. Yes, it might be a bit less efficient than the 12" TH or hybrid design, but it would have significantly more linear excursion, and amplifier power is pretty cheap these days.
Having said that, I think it would be an interesting challenge to design and build one. I've built a 12" TH, but the output is basically limited by the driver's excursion capabilities (5mm Xmax) . 116dB max into 2PI across its passband. I'm looking at some of the more capable 12" drivers now to see if that peak linear SPL level can be improved...
Well I now have an FP14000 amp to use which will no doubt have to be throttled so Im pretty sure any extreme power driver 15" or under will be the limiting factor.
As for the design, I am not set on tapped horns due to the size/weight requirements but I don't know a lot about reflex/ported/sealed or other design contenders. I did think about finding the lightest/highest rms 12 or 15 inch driver and going with the plans recommended by the manufacturer.
As for the trade offs, there are a couple of great 15inch tapped horns that are nearly 35kg so is it not possible to build a slim version, with the trade off of a little bit of spl or does the decrease in internal volume make a big difference?
As for the design, I am not set on tapped horns due to the size/weight requirements but I don't know a lot about reflex/ported/sealed or other design contenders. I did think about finding the lightest/highest rms 12 or 15 inch driver and going with the plans recommended by the manufacturer.
As for the trade offs, there are a couple of great 15inch tapped horns that are nearly 35kg so is it not possible to build a slim version, with the trade off of a little bit of spl or does the decrease in internal volume make a big difference?
Well I did say "upwards of" suggesting we're probably looking at peak measurements, but even at 125db continuous that will outperform something like a Bose B2 or those entry level 18" reflex boxes and not be too difficult to move. A 4-5 ft cube isn't that hard to move if it's not too heavy and handles are strategically placed.
Ok, so you've moved up from 10/12 to 12/15?
The Eminence 3012LF looks interesting. 9.1mm Xmax. A bit on the expensive side though. A few test sims in HornResp suggest up to 120dB down to 40 Hz (2PI) in a "big vent" type of vented alignment. Net volume just above 80 litres.
the lp14000 give's 2350@8ohm 4400@4ohm per ch.(asuming 5 ohm at 40 hz)
the b&c 15 sw115 wil give 126,5 db @x-max, (128,5 @42hz)in 80 ltrs incl vent.
3db more peak (3400watts)20 mm excursion ,well below x-limit's 30 mm
no power compression calculated!
all other sugestions are good,since no budget is given.
the b&c 15 sw115 wil give 126,5 db @x-max, (128,5 @42hz)in 80 ltrs incl vent.
3db more peak (3400watts)20 mm excursion ,well below x-limit's 30 mm
no power compression calculated!
all other sugestions are good,since no budget is given.
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Well I may just have been given a good deal on sea shipping some 18 sound 18NLW9601 over for four th18s. So if that goes ahead I think it would be silly looking at anything over 60lbs for the portables as you may as well use the TH18s.
The THAM12 at 30lb is looking super appealing now apart from the 50hz roll off.
Cashflow is good atm considering the 18NLW9601 prices so yes importing a faital like the 1060hp is very possible however it would need to be quite portable in comparison to th18 to make having two systems worthwhile.
Also I am considering buying a nice plate amp to run a pair of the portables for ease of setup and it would be easier/safer to dry hire out.
This is all because I don't mind sinking some cash into making my life easier in the long run.
The THAM12 at 30lb is looking super appealing now apart from the 50hz roll off.
Cashflow is good atm considering the 18NLW9601 prices so yes importing a faital like the 1060hp is very possible however it would need to be quite portable in comparison to th18 to make having two systems worthwhile.
Also I am considering buying a nice plate amp to run a pair of the portables for ease of setup and it would be easier/safer to dry hire out.
This is all because I don't mind sinking some cash into making my life easier in the long run.
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