Hello.
I have some Infinity Emims in a protoytpe open baffle. In using 8 pc pr side, i want to build some new baffles with 9 pcs pr side and wonder if there is something i realy should avoid and whats important to think of when i build my new baffles.
I dont want the baffle to be as wide as the RS1 baffles, som something smaler vould be mice
The wil be around 180-185cm high, and i wil squeze in a rebuild dipole Emit tweeter in the middle.
Qrossover for the midwoofers is around 200-300hz.
I have some Infinity Emims in a protoytpe open baffle. In using 8 pc pr side, i want to build some new baffles with 9 pcs pr side and wonder if there is something i realy should avoid and whats important to think of when i build my new baffles.
I dont want the baffle to be as wide as the RS1 baffles, som something smaler vould be mice
The wil be around 180-185cm high, and i wil squeze in a rebuild dipole Emit tweeter in the middle.
Qrossover for the midwoofers is around 200-300hz.
I understand the desier for a smaller baffle, However in these araingments the baffle size is a very big in response. As well lower midrange power can be trashed by a small baffle.
I few years back I was developing a large open baffle true ribbon. I too wanted a smaller baffle mostly for asthetic reasions. I thought that if I crossed over high enough 250-300 hz instead of 100-200 , that it would be fine. Nope. The baffles effects as well as the need to cross the woofers steeply meant that the ribbon was a bit weak below 500 hz and the sense of power just wasnt there.
The magority of power in live music is between about 100 and 400 hz give or take. Sure you can get some nice sound even with some weakness in this area BUT in long run it was found wanting.
basically the best sond was always a very small or a very large baffle. The in between stiff (about 12 inches to 18 inches were OK but man when I put the bigger baffles on it was emediatly obvious what I was missing. As if the soul of the music came back.
I would buy some cheap wood and very crudly experament with different size baffles and xover points/slopes.
In the end I didnt like any xover between about 150 and 350 hz. I eather went with a huge baffle and a 100 hz xover or a smaller one and a xover around 400-500 hz.
The 100hz araingment was stunning in its realism but it used a baffle 4 feet wide!
The 400 hz xover with much smaller baffle maybe 10 inches played louder and was quite good BUT not as convincing overall.
I few years back I was developing a large open baffle true ribbon. I too wanted a smaller baffle mostly for asthetic reasions. I thought that if I crossed over high enough 250-300 hz instead of 100-200 , that it would be fine. Nope. The baffles effects as well as the need to cross the woofers steeply meant that the ribbon was a bit weak below 500 hz and the sense of power just wasnt there.
The magority of power in live music is between about 100 and 400 hz give or take. Sure you can get some nice sound even with some weakness in this area BUT in long run it was found wanting.
basically the best sond was always a very small or a very large baffle. The in between stiff (about 12 inches to 18 inches were OK but man when I put the bigger baffles on it was emediatly obvious what I was missing. As if the soul of the music came back.
I would buy some cheap wood and very crudly experament with different size baffles and xover points/slopes.
In the end I didnt like any xover between about 150 and 350 hz. I eather went with a huge baffle and a 100 hz xover or a smaller one and a xover around 400-500 hz.
The 100hz araingment was stunning in its realism but it used a baffle 4 feet wide!
The 400 hz xover with much smaller baffle maybe 10 inches played louder and was quite good BUT not as convincing overall.
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Thanks for the info. So i probably should make something like the original RS1 baffle, its about 21-22inches wide and rounded. The original crossover is 150hz, dont know how steap.
I want smaler baffle beacuse the Emim and midbass towers get to wide. I dont like the speakers in the sound stage. I like the sound to be between the speakers. I should consider something in between
They sound very good as they are now to ! Crossed at 350hz, tried many thing between 200 and 350 hz.
I want smaler baffle beacuse the Emim and midbass towers get to wide. I dont like the speakers in the sound stage. I like the sound to be between the speakers. I should consider something in between
They sound very good as they are now to ! Crossed at 350hz, tried many thing between 200 and 350 hz.
well the RS1 baffle was more like 40 inches I believe as they were going down to 100 hz or even lower
below about 350 hz your smaller baffle will likley sound a bit lean on some material unless you use a shalow xover on the woofer wich can work BUT may not be as beautiful sounding.
The "curve" baffle is a good thing. The better baffles I have experamented with were basically flat with angled sides rather than a true curve. Tryed curve but the easyer to construct angled ones were just as good. Last one I had was flat about 18 inches then "wings" on each side about 10 inches each. Looks a bit better than equivalent all flat of same width.
BTW where do u intend to x over the tweeter?
below about 350 hz your smaller baffle will likley sound a bit lean on some material unless you use a shalow xover on the woofer wich can work BUT may not be as beautiful sounding.
The "curve" baffle is a good thing. The better baffles I have experamented with were basically flat with angled sides rather than a true curve. Tryed curve but the easyer to construct angled ones were just as good. Last one I had was flat about 18 inches then "wings" on each side about 10 inches each. Looks a bit better than equivalent all flat of same width.
BTW where do u intend to x over the tweeter?
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dude thats a preety good response from the emims only a few down at what 15khz. Most cant hear above there anyway.
From that response I would increase baffle size to re enforce output below 300 hz and to fix the shelf down your seeing below 1khz ( possably a baffle diffraction issue) and I might even forgo the tweeter altogether. Its soooo much easyer to get good sound from one driver and then you dont have the issues of going from a line source to point source in a critical region. If your bent on using the tweeter I would probably xover at around 10k but I would try it without it
Then to make it sound right I would probably use a rake filter till I got a smooth downward tilt of about 2db down at about 10khz. Play with this until tonal belevability is found
Then play with baffle size and woofer xover till I like. My guess is an xover around 125-150.
However this will be very dificult if not impossable with passive xovers on the woofers. If passive xovers then 300 or so likley better.
From that response I would increase baffle size to re enforce output below 300 hz and to fix the shelf down your seeing below 1khz ( possably a baffle diffraction issue) and I might even forgo the tweeter altogether. Its soooo much easyer to get good sound from one driver and then you dont have the issues of going from a line source to point source in a critical region. If your bent on using the tweeter I would probably xover at around 10k but I would try it without it
Then to make it sound right I would probably use a rake filter till I got a smooth downward tilt of about 2db down at about 10khz. Play with this until tonal belevability is found
Then play with baffle size and woofer xover till I like. My guess is an xover around 125-150.
However this will be very dificult if not impossable with passive xovers on the woofers. If passive xovers then 300 or so likley better.
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The IRS baffle is to big for my room, but im planing to use the same width as the RS1 baffle and about the same angle on the wings. The RS1 baffle are rounded but im going to use a stright angle.
The plan is to use MDF in the center where the Emims are and 10mm glass in the wings, the acryl is to expencive. The MDF im painting gloss black. The hight vil be 185cm for the baffle and some moer including the foot.
The plan is to use MDF in the center where the Emims are and 10mm glass in the wings, the acryl is to expencive
. The MDF im painting gloss black. The hight vil be 185cm for the baffle and some moer including the foot.The IRS baffle is likley flat in middle section for about 36 inches approx. ,then transitions to a curve with a total of about 45 inches or so total width. These are guesses based on experience and the assumption that the IRS X over is about 70-100hz.
Ok that said, on your pics, the flatter baffle(larger angle) will give a more robust bottom range, the less flat will roll off the bottom a bit more.
In the end if your set on a specific baffle size then I find it best to set up the measurment system and stand behind the baffle and manipulate the angles til you get the smoothest response. Difraction effects can be strongly effected by the smallest changes in these dimensions/angles.
I have spent hrs and hrs adjusting baffle size shape/ x over slope point till get what want. Its always suprising to see the changes
Ok that said, on your pics, the flatter baffle(larger angle) will give a more robust bottom range, the less flat will roll off the bottom a bit more.
In the end if your set on a specific baffle size then I find it best to set up the measurment system and stand behind the baffle and manipulate the angles til you get the smoothest response. Difraction effects can be strongly effected by the smallest changes in these dimensions/angles.
I have spent hrs and hrs adjusting baffle size shape/ x over slope point till get what want. Its always suprising to see the changes
Yes the IRS baffles i huge They are about twice sice of the RS1 baffle.
IRS 47 inches (119cm) wide and the RS1 is 23,5 inches (60cm).
The RS1 baffles are slightly angeled, so i think its a good idea to stick with that.
I have the uportunity to adjust the angle on the wings when the middle sektion is finish. I will glue the glass to the middle sektion, so im free to play with the angle. But im gessing the RS1 baffle angle isnt a coinsidence
They are about twice sice of the RS1 baffle.IRS 47 inches (119cm) wide and the RS1 is 23,5 inches (60cm).
The RS1 baffles are slightly angeled, so i think its a good idea to stick with that.
I have the uportunity to adjust the angle on the wings when the middle sektion is finish. I will glue the glass to the middle sektion, so im free to play with the angle. But im gessing the RS1 baffle angle isnt a coinsidence
5 middle Emims in serial, the rest 4 (2topp and 2 bottom) i serial. Then paralell these groups give about 7.3 ohm. This wil give a db difference about 0,95db from the middle and topp/bottom Emims. And vil give almost like curved baffle. Only easyer to build
On my protoype baffles im using a rebuild Emit, with a faceplate instead of the backpiece, so its dipole like the Emims.
Im not realy shure what tweeter sulotion im going for on my new baffles.
I see your running 9 emims, I used 8 so I could keep them at 4ohm, to me they sound better and seem to have more bass output from 100hz up, also the treble side of it seemed smoother. jmho
Im using 8 in my test baffles, but planing to use 9 in the new ones. Did you test with 9 also ?
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