hey, I've got a t least two meters in my kit.
I remember, back in my pro sound install days, (not that long back) crawling behind a big rack, and rewiring some speaker leads to a JBL branded amp stack. They were all mono bridged. People were wondering why I was moving so slow. Once I crawled out of the back and got away from the din of the 125db (rave club)..I explained that it was about 3 to 4 electrical horsepower on peaks, it was low frequency AC, and I was holding a maglight in my teeth. and I was arguing with bare speaker wires. All at full load. I had to keep reminding myself to keep the mag light in my cheek, as I didn't want to crush my teeth if I was electrocuted.
The show must go on.
Loud, but not the best sound..
A fun day to attend, was when all the purveyors brought their demo sets to the bar, so the owner could 'choose' a manufacturer for the bar.
Maximum SPL Phil Spectre wall of sound showdown!!!
All my installs are still working, BTW. They are all at least 6-7 years old now, on the newest ones.
Do it right, or stay home.
I remember, back in my pro sound install days, (not that long back) crawling behind a big rack, and rewiring some speaker leads to a JBL branded amp stack. They were all mono bridged. People were wondering why I was moving so slow. Once I crawled out of the back and got away from the din of the 125db (rave club)..I explained that it was about 3 to 4 electrical horsepower on peaks, it was low frequency AC, and I was holding a maglight in my teeth. and I was arguing with bare speaker wires. All at full load. I had to keep reminding myself to keep the mag light in my cheek, as I didn't want to crush my teeth if I was electrocuted.
The show must go on.
Loud, but not the best sound..
A fun day to attend, was when all the purveyors brought their demo sets to the bar, so the owner could 'choose' a manufacturer for the bar.
Maximum SPL Phil Spectre wall of sound showdown!!!
All my installs are still working, BTW. They are all at least 6-7 years old now, on the newest ones.
Do it right, or stay home.
Actually what you do is to force air through the rack with a couple of fans on top instead and actually things run much cooler overall that if just the amps alone were forced air cooled. Most large broadcast facilities control and machine rooms have raised flooring and the racks extend from floor to ceiling height. The ceiling is uaually the feed air and the floor the return plenum...this air can also be chilled as well incase of nuclear powered equipment. It is done this way because cold aor is heavier and falls.
Mark
Uh, Mark, I'd rather have the warm air exhaust out the top, and the cold air come in the bottom... That way you won't get a lot of stagnant air at the top, becoming increasingly warmer, as the air at the bottom stays nice and chilly...
I've seen computer cooling devices (gee... was it 20 years ago that we had those little macintoshes?) that basically were nothing but chimneys...
I've seen computer cooling devices (gee... was it 20 years ago that we had those little macintoshes?) that basically were nothing but chimneys...
When auditioning high end home audio, the clever folks
critique the sound and if a fault is detected, they place blame
on the speakers in their environment assuming the sources and
amplifier are of good quality.
But.. all of a sudden when you critique the sound of a concert
or cinema, the first and only thing to blame is the pro audio amplifiers
critique the sound and if a fault is detected, they place blame
on the speakers in their environment assuming the sources and
amplifier are of good quality.
But.. all of a sudden when you critique the sound of a concert
or cinema, the first and only thing to blame is the pro audio amplifiers
thylantyr said:
Shootz! Who said that? Dunno about other folks, but I think the speakers are more to blame, not to mention the insane levels, at concerts and clubs anyway.
But this is an amp thread, right?
Then of course, we know the pros don't use the right speaker wire.
As for the idiots behind the console, well... I've been a member of that club, for sure.
Hmm.. fans in the top of the rack case, nice idea!
So that stops me stacking rack cases ontop of eachother and leaves a nice hole for some idiot roadie to spill beer into.
As for adding deflector shelves, I'd have to buy all new racks and a bigger van
I'll stick to fan cooling for my amps
Anything else is simply utterly inpractical for a touring system.
So that stops me stacking rack cases ontop of eachother and leaves a nice hole for some idiot roadie to spill beer into.
As for adding deflector shelves, I'd have to buy all new racks and a bigger van
I'll stick to fan cooling for my amps
Anything else is simply utterly inpractical for a touring system.
Hi BlackCatSound,
-Chris
Well yeah, that's been my point all along. Make sure you clean the filters on a regular basis. Compressed air will help keep the inards cleaner.
Well, for stationary installations the racks are either open or have a fan at the top. Racks are about 7' high and the area is roadie free. The odd moron will get in there, but amp rooms have controlled access as a rule.
They work great and make a huge difference in temperature. Highly recommended for Bryston installations.
-Chris
anatech said:
From my about decade of years of experience in projecting, install and service of pro audio and video equipment (hate to brag but everyone does so..)
The greater speed of air less dust build builds up.
In a great volume dust is more prone to stick to surfaces due to low airspeed.
A stack whith air shelves takes more space in height.
A single fan is also a single point of failure for x nbr of amps.
Create a low speed air intake (great area) to forced cooled amps and the will collect less dust also.
What big convection amps do you find in PA market?
Hi 4fun,
How many empty filter holders have you seen?
The problem is that the air stream has eddy currents where it drops it's load inside the amp. I have an air compressor expressly for cleaning these out.
The truth be known, all amps collect dust. Convection cooled seem to be cleaner than forced air designs.
-Chris
How many plugged filters have you seen?
How many empty filter holders have you seen?
The problem is that the air stream has eddy currents where it drops it's load inside the amp. I have an air compressor expressly for cleaning these out.
The truth be known, all amps collect dust. Convection cooled seem to be cleaner than forced air designs.
When the big noisy fan(s) stop, people notice. and it's not instantly destructive like forced air type amps. Individually cooled amps can suffer fan failure and not be noticed until the thermal lamp turns on.
-Chris
anatech said:Hi 4fun,
How many plugged filters have you seen?
How many empty filter holders have you seen?
The problem is that the air stream has eddy currents where it drops it's load inside the amp. I have an air compressor expressly for cleaning these out.
The truth be known, all amps collect dust. Convection cooled seem to be cleaner than forced air designs.
When the big noisy fan(s) stop, people notice. and it's not instantly destructive like forced air type amps. Individually cooled amps can suffer fan failure and not be noticed until the thermal lamp turns on.
-Chris
Ok, i have seen many clogged filters and removed filters,
but in a properly maintained amp usually not.
Actually more problem with amps with filters than those without.
A duct for air in to case with intake from area not close to floor helps a lot as you also say.
If forced cooling amp thermal lamp torns on amp usually turns off due to heat protection and that is noticeable. But it should not turn off.
I am very interested in what high power convection cooling pro amps there is on the maket.
Hi 4fun,
The thermal light tells you why the amp isn't making noise any more, that's true.
-Chris
Designers should always take human nature into account. As I said before, it's rare that people actually have a maintenance plan in place. The only guys that do seem to be the larger professional companies.
The thermal light tells you why the amp isn't making noise any more, that's true.
-Chris
Hi 4fun,
Single fans are not that noisy. I've heard a rack of forced air cooled amps that all just screamed. One or the other.
Actually, an entire rack of Carver PM series is hilarious to listen to. The fans whinning to the music ... great fun.
Now, if you were to leave the amps in the trailer, they don't get wet either.
Single fans are not that noisy. I've heard a rack of forced air cooled amps that all just screamed. One or the other.
Actually, an entire rack of Carver PM series is hilarious to listen to. The fans whinning to the music ... great fun.
Now, if you were to leave the amps in the trailer, they don't get wet either.
anatech said:
Ok, we have come to a conclusion that noisy fans can be anoying.
But my point is that you can not notice them due to high listening level. An if one fan is allowed to stop without varning there is problem and the more that depends on that particular fan the bigger problem lies ahed.
Maybe we discuss from different perspectives.
If I contract a customer there is usually a maintinence plan involved witch is actually of benefit to customer in the long run.
I am no nonger in this business for profession but my interest still attracts me to it. Nowday it is IT business and there we have mutch cleaner enviroments thankfully. But lots of noisy fans to combat still exists.
If one fan (many exist for redundancy) fails in on server i get warning though network. I go to server and slide it out (server still running) and replace fan without interupt server funtion a single bit.
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