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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 26th September 2012, 09:09 PM   #1
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Default New drivers for my 2-way boxes

Years ago, I built some nice 2-way speakers. The woofers died of "foam rot", so I saved the enclosures (lots of work went into them... solid as a rock) They are 1.5 cu ft (I'm in US) ported boxes, for 8 inch woofer and tweeter (originally 1 inch dome) Ports are 2 inch dia by 3 inch long. Crossover is first order on woofer, second order on tweeter, crossed at 3000 Hz. I'd like to use the same crossovers with fresh capacitors (coils are homemade, but good quality, 0.6 mH) and they have "zobel" also. Original woofers were Peerless (loved em) but never liked the tweeters (hard dome) Any suggestions for new woofers/tweeters? How about the crossovers? I'm on a tight budget so nothing too exotic. Last I knew, Vifa made some woofers that should work great in these boxes. The 1.5 cu ft. boxes might sound large for an 8 inch woofer, but they sounded great (people would say "those are only 8 inch? WOW!) How about the tweeter... dome, ribbon? I'm not seeking perfection, just something that is "semi-sweet" but still can "kick ***" for the size.
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Old 26th September 2012, 10:11 PM   #2
tvrgeek is offline tvrgeek  United States
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Reasonable size for an 8, maybe some 10's. Go pick a few candidates and plug them int a sim like winISD and see which will work. Only a 2 way, you are going to need one of the tweeters that can get darn low. The SB maybe. With an 8, you are going to be crossing over below 2K. I don't know any 8 that can reach 3K well. Maybe a full range.
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Old 26th September 2012, 11:38 PM   #3
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tvrgeek, no 10 inch... must stay with 8 inch so woofer isn't too close to port. My original 8 inch woofers went to 3000 hz, and because they naturally had reduced output that high is why simple first order was all I needed. Opposite for tweeter: needed second order to protect them. I also wired tweeter reverse phase (helps when speaker is on floor... on stands might not need to do this, or upside down works) By the way, the original tweeters never blew, just the leads from voice coil to terminal broke... light touch of solder and they worked for several more years. I pushed these things hard! Even though the boxes were roomy and ported, I still used light "fluffed" stuffing... a bit would find its way into the port and looked so cool floating in/out of port. I will try to post some pics of the box and crossover. They are built like a tank (that's why I kept them)
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Old 27th September 2012, 05:21 AM   #4
system7 is offline system7  United Kingdom
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I would build a WLM La Scala Clone in that box.

Click the image to open in full size.

Drivers:
Visaton - Lautsprecher und Zubehör, Loudspeakers and Accessories
Visaton - Lautsprecher und Zubehör, Loudspeakers and Accessories

With the bass Zobel it is a 6.8uF/0.4mH/4.7R treble crossover. Without the bass Zobel, it is 3.3uF/0.4mH/4.7R. 30-60 litres as explained at Visaton for the W200S/8ohm. You can model it in Visaton's free Boxsim program download, even change the tweeter for a 94 or 104mm type.
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File Type: jpg WLM_La_Scala_Clone_FResp.JPG (61.7 KB, 217 views)
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Well, there it is! Best regards from Steve in Portsmouth, UK.
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Old 27th September 2012, 05:22 AM   #5
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Id concur with TVR, and System7 (im a slow typist).
There arent many 8s id use above 2k, maybe an 8inch fullranger would work, but then the bass is likely to be reduced.
An 8 plus inch dome isnt the easiest pairing to get working well, in my opinion. That SB29 dimple tweeter could be worth a shot, although if it were me id use a 2inch cone tweeter or widerange driver and cross around 1k or lower.
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Last edited by mondogenerator; 27th September 2012 at 05:24 AM.
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Old 27th September 2012, 07:50 PM   #6
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system7, yes, I like the "la scala", and that tweeter looks like a good choice (goes much lower than most dome type)
I took a picture of my enclosures... not the best pic, but I was in a hurry) The front plate is removable (mounts to "cleats" inside the box) so I could make another one if needed, but I'd rather keep them "as is". I do understand that it's nice to cross a 2-way at lower freq (like 1000 hz) but should I use first order (6db/oct) or second order (12db/oct)? Didn't have time to study "la scala" crossover... will study it later. Hey, can someone tell me metric equivalent to 1.5 cu ft?
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Old 28th September 2012, 12:56 AM   #7
Dissi is offline Dissi  Switzerland
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1.5 cu ft are 40.5 litres. The Dayton RS 225 S-8 fits perfectly into your cabinet and uses the same vent tuning. A crossover at 2 kHz is possible, but requires a 4th order low-pass to handle the resonances above. I made a simulation with the Dayton DC 28 F-8 Tweeter:



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Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 28th September 2012, 05:44 PM   #8
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Dissi, thank you for the suggestion (and crossover)
The Dayton looks perfect and within budget. I can't afford it, but the ScanSpeak P21WO20 looks great (and similar to Vifa woofer that I can't find anymore)
Any tweeter suggestions? I've never used a ribbon tweeter... how do they compare to dome type? MY biggest concern is the lower power rating (but they are also very efficient so I could add a resistor to help solve both issues)
By the way, my homemade boxes are high density particle board... does anyone use this or has everyone gone to medium density fiber fiber board? I used premade "shelf boards" for the sides/top/bottom... it had rounded edge already sanded/primered, and just happened to be correct width... very convenient!
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Old 28th September 2012, 09:11 PM   #9
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acefromspace View Post
Any tweeter suggestions?
Hi, Use the tweeters and x/o's suggested for the bass/mid drivers, rgds, sreten.

Not indicating where you are from doesn't help much.
Here is a cheap and cheerful option from the UK :
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Speaker-ki...#ht_3855wt_936
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Last edited by sreten; 28th September 2012 at 09:17 PM.
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Old 28th September 2012, 10:25 PM   #10
Dissi is offline Dissi  Switzerland
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Ribbon tweeters usually have much higher distortions than domes and are crossed at 3 kHz or higher. The lower power rating is not a problem because of the higher sensitivity. Example: 95 dB at 1 watt gives 105 dB at 10 watt. The Dayton tweeter I proposed will probably also reach its power handling limit at 105 dB. If you want more, you will need a driver from the semi professional sector. The Ciare MT 320 should theoretically make 110 dB...
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