I expect so, but I have the free copy, so I can't actually try it.
I suspect it will not be a problem, but you could ask someone that has it to try to generate one of their files then try it.
sure. i usually document all my work.
No calculations. I've drawn the waveguide of the TPL-150H , and used its opening angle as base to design the curve of my own wave guide.
Angelo,
You are doing a lot of hard work.
But in effect you are working in the dark. You can not "see" your results.
That's like being a photographer with glasses that are so very dirty with splashed mud... you sort of see what is in front of you, but it is hard to tell if that is an Elephant or a gray TRUCK!!
Yes, I know that in the end you have to listen to the sound...
While everyone is talking about the "accuracy" of these mics, I go back to my original statement, ANY of these MLS/FFT software packages and ANY $1USD Panasonic electret mic mounted in a drinking straw will be sufficient to measure rather well up to somewhere around 10kHz... which is what you need right now.
Later you can get a more accurate mic for the 10kHz range...
The RTA smooths over too much and gives you a fake look at what is going on...
Ok?
_-_-bear
You are doing a lot of hard work.
But in effect you are working in the dark. You can not "see" your results.
That's like being a photographer with glasses that are so very dirty with splashed mud... you sort of see what is in front of you, but it is hard to tell if that is an Elephant or a gray TRUCK!!
Yes, I know that in the end you have to listen to the sound...
While everyone is talking about the "accuracy" of these mics, I go back to my original statement, ANY of these MLS/FFT software packages and ANY $1USD Panasonic electret mic mounted in a drinking straw will be sufficient to measure rather well up to somewhere around 10kHz... which is what you need right now.
Later you can get a more accurate mic for the 10kHz range...
The RTA smooths over too much and gives you a fake look at what is going on...
Ok?
_-_-bear
Bear is right. You need the right software (i.e., HolmImpulse) and some mic and preamp.
However, there is another dimension to this puzzle that has not been addressed; measurement technique.
First, it is meaningless to measure the speaker response from the sofa and it is meaningless to measure both at the same time.
The correct or better procedure is to place the speaker in the middle of the room facing a corner. The speaker needs to be elevated so that the tweeter is equidistant between the floor and the ceiling. The higher the ceiling you have the better.
The mic should be on-axis to the tweeter and 1 meter away. Typically, the mic is mounted on a long horizontal boom so as to minimize reflections from the mic stand.
Now that you have the mic positioned you can manually compute the lowest frequency you will be able to measure by measuring the imaginary path between the woofer to a point on the floor exactly 1/2 meter from the face of the cabinet and in-line with the path to the mic. Now measure the distance from that point on the floor to the microphone.
That total distance of those two paths in meters is subtracted by 1 (the on-axis distance from the tweeter to the mic). The difference is the distance that the first echo will be in time from the start of the signal from the speaker. In other words, you are calculating the "time" for the first echo at the mic, which in this case is called floor bounce.
You can now calculate the lowest frequency you will be able to measure by knowing the speed of sound (343 m/s). That means a one Hertz sound wave is 343 meters long. Divide 343 by the difference in meters to the mic to get the frequency. If that number is 1.1 meters, then the lowest frequency will be about 312 Hz. If that number was .7 meters, then the lowest frequency would be 490 Hz.
That calculated frequency is also the resolution you will be able to discriminate at across the frequency sweep. It is known as the gating frequency.
Ideally, it would be nice to put that speaker in a huge building way up in the air so you can get a very low gating frequency, but for most of us we would be delighted with 200 Hz to 300 Hz as a gate frequency.
Now you will be getting your first real look at your speaker's response. Of course there is a lot more to this and a good book on the subject is Joseph D' Appollito's Testing Loudspeakers.
I'll let others chime in where I left off.
However, there is another dimension to this puzzle that has not been addressed; measurement technique.
First, it is meaningless to measure the speaker response from the sofa and it is meaningless to measure both at the same time.
The correct or better procedure is to place the speaker in the middle of the room facing a corner. The speaker needs to be elevated so that the tweeter is equidistant between the floor and the ceiling. The higher the ceiling you have the better.
The mic should be on-axis to the tweeter and 1 meter away. Typically, the mic is mounted on a long horizontal boom so as to minimize reflections from the mic stand.
Now that you have the mic positioned you can manually compute the lowest frequency you will be able to measure by measuring the imaginary path between the woofer to a point on the floor exactly 1/2 meter from the face of the cabinet and in-line with the path to the mic. Now measure the distance from that point on the floor to the microphone.
That total distance of those two paths in meters is subtracted by 1 (the on-axis distance from the tweeter to the mic). The difference is the distance that the first echo will be in time from the start of the signal from the speaker. In other words, you are calculating the "time" for the first echo at the mic, which in this case is called floor bounce.
You can now calculate the lowest frequency you will be able to measure by knowing the speed of sound (343 m/s). That means a one Hertz sound wave is 343 meters long. Divide 343 by the difference in meters to the mic to get the frequency. If that number is 1.1 meters, then the lowest frequency will be about 312 Hz. If that number was .7 meters, then the lowest frequency would be 490 Hz.
That calculated frequency is also the resolution you will be able to discriminate at across the frequency sweep. It is known as the gating frequency.
Ideally, it would be nice to put that speaker in a huge building way up in the air so you can get a very low gating frequency, but for most of us we would be delighted with 200 Hz to 300 Hz as a gate frequency.
Now you will be getting your first real look at your speaker's response. Of course there is a lot more to this and a good book on the subject is Joseph D' Appollito's Testing Loudspeakers.
I'll let others chime in where I left off.
thanks for your kind advice, and from all others. I apprechiate it. My horn satellites do weight however over 600 pounds each. To move them around in the room is a pain in the a**. Even if the measurments are not as accurate , as they should/could be , they have revealed a lot so far, and the observed coloration in the midrange channel has gone away almost entirely with the crossover modification. Sound is now much more balanced and natural, with better integration with the other channels. Sure , further refinement is possible, through more accurate measurements, but i am satisfied with the progress so far. I will wait the virtin arrive, and then see further. BTW. my measurement has shown a peak at 3khz of the Beyma tpl150, and that correlates with others measurements of it without waveguide, so that might be a indication that i am not that far from what is accurate. I use now a microfone stand, so the mic stands free air, and i've done the last measurements at 1m distance from the speakers. But in the end, the main goal is/was to see and compare the S2/H104 with the Beyma, and even with the progress done, the Beyma still sounds far better, specially in the higher register, even revealing details of the recordings, the S2/H104 don't. With the waveguide on place, i think i will have a big improvement in my system.
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600 pounds! That is going to be pretty much hopeless to move.
You will get so much floor bounce at that position that measurements will be pretty much useless.
You might try tilting the cabinets slightly down toward the floor and trying a ground plane measurement. However, your floor carpet probably rules that out.
600lbs....
The horns are massive MDF. The lower midrange horn alone is 300 pounds.....
it is not impossible to get meaningful measurements.
just position the mic nearfield - ie. 1m or less from the mouth of each driver...
But you must get yourself some MLS/FFT software!!.
Please!
It is actually painful to read of your quest and see you not having the proper equipment.
Would you go on a hike into the back woods without proper gear??
_-_-bear
just position the mic nearfield - ie. 1m or less from the mouth of each driver...
But you must get yourself some MLS/FFT software!!.
Please!
It is actually painful to read of your quest and see you not having the proper equipment.
Would you go on a hike into the back woods without proper gear??
_-_-bear
Angelo did order a virtins measurement package and the software included seems to be quite capable (including FFT, MLS and so on).
Although some useful functionality requires additionial fee, the measured data can be exported and the missing parts could be done by external software.
From the data sheets given the package seems to be ok for loudspeaker measurements.
All good I look forward to seeing some gated and nearfield measurments of each of the horns in Angelo's system!
The listening position measurements should be interesting too... but EQ'ing for a "flat" response in the listening position without being able to discriminate between the direct energy and the reflected energy often does not give the info needed to do the EQ properly.
So, the new software package should yield some good information.
_-_-bear
The listening position measurements should be interesting too... but EQ'ing for a "flat" response in the listening position without being able to discriminate between the direct energy and the reflected energy often does not give the info needed to do the EQ properly.
So, the new software package should yield some good information.
_-_-bear
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