I tried the inverted polarity of the mids for a few weeks, in my system it gives a much deeper soundstage where vocals are concerned...
In the respect that it puts the vocals very deep into the soundstage, (maybe too deep in contrast with the rest of the image) whilst the
stereo instruments appear 'upfront' but the expense of this - I found was that the vocals began to get lost in the mix and lost their presence
so I have since reverted back to standard polarity.. I only have the non dipole, version of the RAAL and only purchased because I was lucky
enough to pick a pair up cheaply second hand with a lifetime supply of spare ribbons
I almost wish I hadent seen the dipole version now
though, never knew they brought that ou and I'll be forever wondering
I'd be interested to hear your impressions and findings of inverted mid...
In the respect that it puts the vocals very deep into the soundstage, (maybe too deep in contrast with the rest of the image) whilst the
stereo instruments appear 'upfront' but the expense of this - I found was that the vocals began to get lost in the mix and lost their presence
so I have since reverted back to standard polarity.. I only have the non dipole, version of the RAAL and only purchased because I was lucky
enough to pick a pair up cheaply second hand with a lifetime supply of spare ribbons
I almost wish I hadent seen the dipole version now though, never knew they brought that ou and I'll be forever wondering
I'd be interested to hear your impressions and findings of inverted mid...
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I tried the inverted polarity of the mids for a few weeks, in my system it gives a much deeper soundstage where vocals are concerned...
In the respect that it puts the vocals very deep into the soundstage, (maybe too deep in contrast with the rest of the image) whilst the
stereo instruments appear 'upfront' but the expense of this - I found was that the vocals began to get lost in the mix and lost their presence
so I have since reverted back to standard polarity.. I only have the non dipole, version of the RAAL and only purchased because I was lucky
enough to pick a pair up cheaply second hand with a lifetime supply of spare ribbons
though, never knew they brought that ou and I'll be forever wondering
I'd be interested to hear your impressions and findings of inverted mid...
Yes, the Dipole RAAL is sooo tempting but given the Neo3 cost $57.00, I will give them a run first & probably last
.If you crossover low enough you should miss the dip at about 6-6.5Khz. The dip at 900Hz seemed to be diminished when I inverted the mid but I need to redo the measurements to confirm. At this stage the music doesnt seem much different to me but I am still a bit deaf.
I might try Treols mods to the mid in a small pair of speakers I'm going to build for the garage, my work/play place.
If you cross over low enought
The One, I hope
Well this is the latest design.
The drivers are:
I don't know what I will be using as the final amps, maybe D class for bass & AB for Mid Tweeter.
So what do you think, don't hold back
David
Well this is the latest design.
The drivers are:
- Dipole 15
- Neo10
- Neo3
- 200-230Hz, before H frame Peak
- Not really sure, first Peak will be at approx 1500Hz Any suggestions?
I don't know what I will be using as the final amps, maybe D class for bass & AB for Mid Tweeter.
So what do you think, don't hold back
David
Attachments
REduce the space between the Neo3 and the Neo10. Also, you may want to consider stuffing the cavities of the H-frame to attenuate the peak as well as preferentially damp the harmonic distortion (not a strong effect though).Well this is the latest design.
The drivers are:
I am thinking of crossing the bass driver over at:
- Dipole 15
- Neo10
- Neo3
I will be using MiniDSP as the Crossover/EQ
- 200-230Hz, before H frame Peak
- Not really sure, first Peak will be at approx 1500Hz Any suggestions?
I don't know what I will be using as the final amps, maybe D class for bass & AB for Mid Tweeter.
So what do you think, don't hold back
David
Thanks for the input,
What benefit will reducing the space between the drivers have?
Hi David,
Congratulations for the advance in the project.
Which software you use to model the H Frame to find the dimensions?.Thx
Congratulations for the advance in the project.
Which software you use to model the H Frame to find the dimensions?.Thx
Well this is the latest design.
The drivers are:
I am thinking of crossing the bass driver over at:
- Dipole 15
- Neo10
- Neo3
I will be using MiniDSP as the Crossover/EQ
- 200-230Hz, before H frame Peak
- Not really sure, first Peak will be at approx 1500Hz Any suggestions?
I don't know what I will be using as the final amps, maybe D class for bass & AB for Mid Tweeter.
So what do you think, don't hold back
David
I have used various calculation's from various people. ABC Dipole is easy and can be run on Excel, which makes things easier.
I created a little spreadsheet with a few calc's in it which is handy for playing around. No graphs or anything fancy just a couple of calc's I found useful. Everybody seems to do there calc's a little different. So everybody's answers are a little different.
If you want the spreadsheet send me a PM & I'll send it to you.
David
Nice design David,Well this is the latest design.
The drivers are:
I am thinking of crossing the bass driver over at:
- Dipole 15
- Neo10
- Neo3
I will be using MiniDSP as the Crossover/EQ
- 200-230Hz, before H frame Peak
- Not really sure, first Peak will be at approx 1500Hz Any suggestions?
I don't know what I will be using as the final amps, maybe D class for bass & AB for Mid Tweeter.
So what do you think, don't hold back
David
Is for the neo3 and 10 one big panel in the same shape as now for the neo 10 a nicer looking frame.
Now, I heard claims that AE drivers work good at mid frequencies, that I find hard to believe. In my opinion, from what little experience I have, even 8" bass drivers usually no good at 1kHz, they lose resolution, start beaming, you know...
Now what exactly makes Dipole12 work to 1kHz versus SLS 12" working to 300Hz, is it a)smaller diameter? b)smaller moving mass? c)all of the above? or is there something else that can contribute to driver's capacity to play higher frequencies well?
Does anyone see anything obviously wrong (acoustically) with the design?
I have done a lot of reading & research since this journey started. I was rightfully accused of not knowing what I was doing at the start & hopefully I have learnt something.
I was hoping you guy's might set me straight if you saw any major errors in the design.
Structural integrity will be a challenge, and I'm sure plenty of people see the aesthetics as "challenged" but that is such a personal thing. If I could make them look like attractive naked women I would. My daughter said "why do you have a person standing on your speakers" I didn't set out to make them look like people, but I'm happy with the look.
David
I have done a lot of reading & research since this journey started. I was rightfully accused of not knowing what I was doing at the start & hopefully I have learnt something.
I was hoping you guy's might set me straight if you saw any major errors in the design.
Structural integrity will be a challenge, and I'm sure plenty of people see the aesthetics as "challenged" but that is such a personal thing. If I could make them look like attractive naked women I would
. My daughter said "why do you have a person standing on your speakers" I didn't set out to make them look like people, but I'm happy with the look.David
NoDoes anyone see anything obviously wrong (acoustically) with the design?
It was a fast learning curve
I'll start making the prototype during Christmas holidays, I'll just make it out of MDF to see if it measures ok & sounds ok. I always plan to get things done at Christmas, but rarely succeed, too many interruptions.
In the short term I'll be using six channels of my receiver, I didn't want to rush in to the amp side of things just yet, all types are still on the table, except valves, as they would be out of my budget.
David
One thing I'm really not sure of, is the angle I should make the chamfers in the timber around the drivers. The drivers are only set back about 10mm from the front face. I have drawn them at 45 degrees but was wondering if I should make it more like 60 degrees, or doesn't it matter
David
David
Attachments
Neo10 Mod
Im thinking of trimming the Neo10 frame as shown in the picture. All of the rivets will still be in place.
Does anyone know if there in anything in where I'm cutting that could cause problems.
I don't want to cut the corners only to find out I cut through something I shouldn't have.
David
Im thinking of trimming the Neo10 frame as shown in the picture. All of the rivets will still be in place.
Does anyone know if there in anything in where I'm cutting that could cause problems.
I don't want to cut the corners only to find out I cut through something I shouldn't have.
David
Attachments
Mmm..IMHO, I would not touch the driver. Why do you want to do it?
As you will see the speaker design doesn't have many structural strengths, also the latest version has a slightly smaller surround, to make things worse, so getting it to be structurally sound is a challenge. I am working a metal sub-frame to go under the timber, but there is not much room, if I cut the corners off it will give me extra space for the metal sub frame.
David
I would also highly recommend keeping the mid and tweeter as close as possible
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