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Old 25th December 2010, 01:40 AM   #461
CLS is offline CLS  Taiwan
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Nice

How I wish I can get that kind of plywood locally, sigh~

Deltalite-II 2515 has 4.8mm of Xmax. In his measurements, it looked well under 40Hz or so. (I think the big baffle helps quite some.)

Kappakite 3515LF got 9.6mm of Xmax, might be good for louder and deeper. I'm wondering if anyone tried it. (I don't remember any comment of this woofer used on OB... )
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Old 25th December 2010, 02:33 PM   #462
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Regarding Scottīs quote I think the preceding sentence should also be given:

'Over the years I have reduced my writing on actual sound - as such - as sound really cannot be described, although audio magazines may write page after page trying to give us an impression of what a given speaker sounds like. It's futile.

First of all: From a visitor hearing the prototype OBL-11s, I can report that these 15" Eminence DeltaLites beat the crap out of Eminence Alpha 15A, which is often referred to in OB connections as being an ideal driver for this application. This was my expectation and what I had hoped for by choosing a fairly low-Qt driver and applying the equalisation step.'


So second hand opinion, subjective, you name it, as long as it serves your purpose it is true.

Probably a nice OB as most are, certainly not Ultimate.

/Erling

Last edited by skorpion; 25th December 2010 at 02:44 PM.
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Old 26th December 2010, 03:18 AM   #463
ScottG is offline ScottG  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skorpion View Post
Regarding Scottīs quote I think the preceding sentence should also be given:

'Over the years I have reduced my writing on actual sound - as such - as sound really cannot be described, although audio magazines may write page after page trying to give us an impression of what a given speaker sounds like. It's futile.

First of all: From a visitor hearing the prototype OBL-11s, I can report that these 15" Eminence DeltaLites beat the crap out of Eminence Alpha 15A, which is often referred to in OB connections as being an ideal driver for this application. This was my expectation and what I had hoped for by choosing a fairly low-Qt driver and applying the equalisation step.'


So second hand opinion, subjective, you name it, as long as it serves your purpose it is true.

Probably a nice OB as most are, certainly not Ultimate.

/Erling

Sorry, I thought that the pertinent info. was presented of the part I found humorous.

-as a side note: there is nothing wrong with hearsay. The only reason why it get's a bad wrap these days is based on legal proceedings in some jurisdictions (..like the US and Great Britain.) The idea there is the inability to verify the statement and most particularly the inability to ask questions from the person who made that statement (..i.e. that the statement may be out of context). There are of course also hearsay exceptions.

I suppose if you have reason to believe that Troel's falsely made such a comment or that originator did so, or that it was taken out of context, then sure - there would be a problem. Personally I don't think that's the case, and I'd bet you don't believe that either.

Is the statement accurate? That claim was never made, rather it offered as a partial reason for a design choice (..or *a* reason for selecting the Delta-lite driver.)

Is it an ultimate OB design? Again, that claim was never made.

Are any of the designs here in this thread "ultimate"? Probably not. But this particular design is IMO as interesting as many here (..and the write-up details are excellent).
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Last edited by ScottG; 26th December 2010 at 03:22 AM.
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Old 26th December 2010, 08:11 AM   #464
felixx is offline felixx  Romania
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Same woofer here:
38cm 2 way speaker system YS-500
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"I'm glad I can build my own mistakes."
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Old 26th December 2010, 09:45 AM   #465
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Scott,

Yes, I did read the irony in your quote. Pity that Troels didn't see that himself.

As I judge it this is a bit more commerce than good passive OB engineering. But apperance is great.

/Erling

Last edited by skorpion; 26th December 2010 at 09:56 AM.
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Old 9th January 2011, 08:31 PM   #466
lenta is offline lenta  Norway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzilla View Post
>>> XO...
>>> I bet it really sounds nice as well!
>>> What are you using for the super tweeter?

Thanks guys! This is the TangBand W8-1808 on open baffle without any circuit. The woofers are Alpha 15 in H-frames powered by the Dayton APA150 amp. That amp has a crossover control on the back. Any subwoofer plate amp will do as long as it has enough power. I think the Alpha 15 needs about 100 watts to 'wake up'... and the tweeter is something i had lying around about 10+ years, a Radio Shack 'pod' super tweeter. It sounded best to me using a cap value of .69uf. The whole thing sounds wonderful!

The 1808 is the most unusual driver in my collection so far. It appears to be mostly hand made using very delicate materials. The paper cone and wizzer are very thin and the surround is not the usual foam or rubber, more like a thin 'wet cloth'... it's all connected to a heavy magnet and frame that seems heavily built compared to the delicate cone/surround.

The sound is not quite neutral rather somewhat midrangy but in a mellow 'round' way. It's not as bright as the two Fostex drivers i have but i do like Fostex drivers too. It's light on its feet but does do bass. It's very detailed and relaxed. Listening fatigue is very low and i do listen a lot to this speaker for pleasure rather than messing around with crossovers all the time. I could live with this for a long while and am playing around with cheaper drivers now until i feel these overstay their welcome. They sound very pure with a bit of personality. If you like your vocals pushed slightly forward (as well as sax and trumpet) and your treble slightly recessed (but very clear) these are nice drivers. They also do that 'tone' thing where instruments have great decay and vibrato. For many this is what will make them worth the price. Piano sounds big and the notes ring out unlike most of the cheaper drivers i have. Guitars pop out sounding holographic on well recorded cds. I think they are pretty amazing actually and catch myself really enjoying music without thinking about changing things around. I think they would work well with just about any tweeter crossed over very high, above 15khz, and a large number of subwoofers crossed over below 100hz. They can also stand alone as a full range driver in a sealed or ported box without any help to be used in smaller rooms.

Sorry, i'm just trying to describe the drivers sound before someone makes a purchase. They are expensive but worth it imo.
Your speakers are very, very close to that I want to build!!

These new paper fullrangers from TangBand realy looks good, but i wish there would be off axis response plots somewere

Most OB speakers use smaller fulranges like fostex FE103E, Monacor MS100CHQ probably becouse OB rolloff affects drivers in the same frequency and then there is no advantage in 8" fullranges.
I want to use bigger than 3", 4" drivers too, but off-axis suffers considerably and then this rollof thing.
Do you considered about using smaller Tangband drivers like these?
W4-1879 http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1230_04/w4-1879.htm
W5-1880 http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1230_04/w5-1880.htm

There is some off-axis and hd plots off TangBand fullrangers!
A TB 'big-dog' has arrived.... - Page 2 - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video, and Electronics Customer Discussion Forum From Parts-Express.com

Seems that wizzer affects off-axis of W6-1916
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Old 14th January 2011, 07:24 PM   #467
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Wood consumtion is further reduced for The Blindstone OBs:

Click the image to open in full size.

AE IB15s have replaced Eminence Alpha15s and to quote Troel's friend: 'I can report that these 15" AE IB 15s beat the crap out of Eminence Alpha 15A'

I was and still is a bit critical over Troel's design because he evidently exaggerates bass performance for that loudspeaker.

In this case it is all true, performencewise. Not much altered just bass EQ + 7.4 dB at 40 Hz shelving 12 dB/oct to compensate. Otherwise it sounds like a vail has been removed from the speakers, pretty amazing.

/Erling
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Old 14th January 2011, 09:09 PM   #468
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>>> Do you considered about using smaller Tangband drivers like these?

I would consider using just about any Tangband driver. Whichever you choose, just build around that driver's strengths and you should have a winner.
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Old 16th January 2011, 06:01 PM   #469
ific is offline ific  Argentina
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Default How low

Quote:
Originally Posted by skorpion View Post
Wood consumtion is further reduced for The Blindstone OBs:

Click the image to open in full size.

AE IB15s have replaced Eminence Alpha15s and to quote Troel's friend: 'I can report that these 15" AE IB 15s beat the crap out of Eminence Alpha 15A'

I was and still is a bit critical over Troel's design because he evidently exaggerates bass performance for that loudspeaker.

In this case it is all true, performencewise. Not much altered just bass EQ + 7.4 dB at 40 Hz shelving 12 dB/oct to compensate. Otherwise it sounds like a vail has been removed from the speakers, pretty amazing.

/Erling
Hi Skorpion,

I really like your design.

What F3 are you getting with the IB15?

Thanks.

Ific.
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Old 16th January 2011, 06:27 PM   #470
ra7 is offline ra7  United States
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Hey guys,

Here's my current set up. Its an Audio Nirvana 8" crossed to a Eminence 15A
using the FirstWatt B5 crossover (the woofer has been smooshed in by a new
pup in the house). The low pass is a 2nd order 80 Hz and the high pass is a
2nd order 130 Hz with a boost near the crossover. The B5 has the 'boost' built
in at the flick of a switch which is pretty neat.

There is a 6db notch at 4 kHz and 2db shelving filter past 1kHz. I started with
a big 4x2 baffle and ended up with this design. With the big baffle, bass doesn't
need EQ, but the soundstage depth is not as good. The current shape, for me,
is a good compromise between appearance and sound. The angled top spreads
the dipole peak better and the rounded edges help with diffraction (although, I'm
not sure how much). The wood is 1 1/8" thick plywood. It is a huge step up over
MDF. It is cheap too - available as 'sub flooring' plywood from home depot (in the
US).

Suffice to say it sounds great. I've compared it with a MiniDSP in the system, and
the B5 is in a different league.
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