Cloning IDS-25s - Page 4 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Full Range

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 7th November 2012, 01:14 PM   #31
haraldo is offline haraldo  Norway
diyAudio Member
 
haraldo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Roger Russel also tried with a tweeter "in the middle" of the IDS-25 proto but he claimed there be be some kind of audible "hole" that disappeared when he removed the tweeter and made it a true line source...

I wonder, of course, how audible this is, and how much of a change this makes.

Need to read more to understand what you mean by Fresnel & Frauanhofer zones .-)
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 02:51 PM   #32
Pnotus is offline Pnotus  Sweden
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Scania
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottmoose View Post
That's because they aren't.

Centre-to-centre spacing should be fine for nearfield. The separate sources don't sum above a certain point (which is why FR based line-sources require some form of Eq) but they're close enough to avoid any audible differences beyond a few feet out once you've boosted the top-end, or attenuated the bottom to match. What you will get with the central tweeter are more obviously dissimilar Fresnel & Frauanhofer zones, so there's likely to be more of an ideal listening distance than with a full array per se.
Scott - does this mean that you can repeal that the drivers would work as separate sources, not a line, above certain frequencies, here appox 4300 with c-c spacing of 80 mm, by using EQ?
Wouldn´t the sources still work as in the farfield of a domestic arrays? As separate sources, that is. The array would of course still be able to take more power and have other pros of being an array.

In my world, a pretty easy going and understandable kind of place, frequencies that suffer from destructive interference between drivers can be EQ´d to suitable dB but cannot have the characteristac -3dB dropping in amplitude. Thus - not funtional as a fullrange array.

But I am wrong alot.

Haroldo - I used to live with Adyton Cordis pre and power amps and they were just as good as you would expect for that price. I am sure that Adyton make wonderful speakers and mean no disrespect to them or their followers.
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 04:19 PM   #33
diyAudio Member
 
Scottmoose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by haraldo View Post
Roger Russel also tried with a tweeter "in the middle" of the IDS-25 proto but he claimed there be be some kind of audible "hole" that disappeared when he removed the tweeter and made it a true line source...
First I've heard that he had one with a central tweeter. AFAIK the entire point of these was that he wanted to use a single column of widebanders.

Quote:
I wonder, of course, how audible this is, and how much of a change this makes.
A big one if you change distance.

Quote:
Need to read more to understand what you mean by Fresnel & Frauanhofer zones .-)
Read 'neafield' and 'farfield.'
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 04:34 PM   #34
diyAudio Member
 
Scottmoose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pnotus View Post
Scott - does this mean that you can repeal that the drivers would work as separate sources, not a line, above certain frequencies, here appox 4300 with c-c spacing of 80 mm, by using EQ?
Wouldn´t the sources still work as in the farfield of a domestic arrays? As separate sources, that is. The array would of course still be able to take more power and have other pros of being an array.
I think we're getting into linguistic semantics for the sake of it. What I'm saying is that a column made of individual small widebanders exhibits consistant behaviour along its length, which is not the case with a central tweeter. As far as a listener is concerned, providing it is Eq'd appropriately, such a speaker is effectively a line source.
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 04:39 PM   #35
koldby is offline koldby  Denmark
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Ruds Vedby
Sorry for not responding earlier

Quote:
Originally Posted by haraldo View Post
Did you do any equalizing? how do they work for you? Is it closed box?

Dansk Dynamit
Thanks Haraldo
Oh yes eq. is nessesary. Not that much, but absolutely nessesary.
The one with Aura sound is eq. by a Behringer deq96 and is palying in my HT room. Does a good job here. Crossed over to 4x 10" subwoofers @120Hz and aided in the top by a 19mm ring radiator.

The Vifa source is my main reference speaker. Eventually I will mate it with a IB subwoofer as it cannot play loud enough in the bottom octave to my taste.
I use Audiolense to eq. it and room correct at the same time.
These are amazing speakers!!!
The best I have had. A little trick:
Put a little Isopunkt made thinner with turpentine on the paper cones and let oit harden in UV light. Takes them a step up in clarity and definition.
It is closed boxes both of them.
The alu boxes are actually a little too small, but when the subs are ready, makes no problems.
They play insanely loud when crossed over about 80-100 Hz.

Koldby
__________________
What is Home Theatre without good sound?
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 04:42 PM   #36
koldby is offline koldby  Denmark
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Ruds Vedby
Quote:
Originally Posted by norman bates View Post
and you like how it sounds?
Amazing. Really amazing.

If you think such beast are big and bloated - think again..
They can pinpoint if it is in the recording, make vast spaces if it is there, and are ligthning quick and dynamic.

koldby
__________________
What is Home Theatre without good sound?
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 04:50 PM   #37
koldby is offline koldby  Denmark
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Ruds Vedby
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pnotus View Post
Not taking anything away from the obvious quality of the Adyton stuff, but, c-c spacing is to big to get full nearfield line array effect through the entire register with these drivers. I wonder where they cross-over to the ribbon..
This has been an ongoing discussion.
It is true that such a line array will have some dropoff in the treble (in the vifa case starting around 6 Khz).
But if you are more than 2-3 meters away, there is absolutely no lobing effect. Of course you have to compensate for the HF dropoff, either by using a tweeter or eq the line array.

I have not yet tried the tweeter solution (I want to mate it with a linesource tweeter) as they are sounding sooo good without, that there is a lot of other projects coming before that.
koldby
__________________
What is Home Theatre without good sound?
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 05:52 PM   #38
haraldo is offline haraldo  Norway
diyAudio Member
 
haraldo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by norman bates View Post
I like the idea of the honker tweeter in the middle of the array.
But can it take 6db crossover while keeping up with a row of midranges ? Probably not.
As far as I know Adyton uses only a simple 1st order x-over arlund 10Khz, and I never heard of burned tweeters, and they give them lots of power!!!!

The speakers with aluminum FR drivers is crossed more around 15KHz - 18KHz as far as I heard.....

Last edited by haraldo; 7th November 2012 at 06:08 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 7th November 2012, 06:08 PM   #39
haraldo is offline haraldo  Norway
diyAudio Member
 
haraldo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by koldby View Post
Sorry for not responding earlier


Thanks Haraldo
Oh yes eq. is nessesary. Not that much, but absolutely nessesary.
The one with Aura sound is eq. by a Behringer deq96 and is palying in my HT room. Does a good job here. Crossed over to 4x 10" subwoofers @120Hz and aided in the top by a 19mm ring radiator.

The Vifa source is my main reference speaker. Eventually I will mate it with a IB subwoofer as it cannot play loud enough in the bottom octave to my taste.
I use Audiolense to eq. it and room correct at the same time.
These are amazing speakers!!!
The best I have had. A little trick:
Put a little Isopunkt made thinner with turpentine on the paper cones and let oit harden in UV light. Takes them a step up in clarity and definition.
It is closed boxes both of them.
The alu boxes are actually a little too small, but when the subs are ready, makes no problems.
They play insanely loud when crossed over about 80-100 Hz.

Koldby
Tusen tak !!!!

This is very encouraging, I played with the thought if I should look into smething with the Fountek FR drivers and when I see the results you guys get here, it's really getting more and more tempting.....
  Reply With Quote
Old 8th November 2012, 03:57 PM   #40
haraldo is offline haraldo  Norway
diyAudio Member
 
haraldo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Pardon me if this is a stupid question, but..... well, actually my father told me there are no stupid questions, only stupid answers

Could it be that the ribbon tweeter in the middle of the line source, as is on the Adyton's... are there to fill in some of the high frequency loss you otherwise would have and as such meaning, less eq need in the high frequency band?
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cloning WAMM? mephistoso Multi-Way 9 21st February 2014 03:37 PM
Cloning transformers jon_010101 Tubes / Valves 29 31st May 2008 03:48 PM
Anyone try cloning Kharmas? polkymon Multi-Way 27 26th June 2006 02:44 PM
Cloning a Loudspeaker red Multi-Way 6 12th April 2005 07:14 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 03:06 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2