PMA said:Active system with separate channels and cross-overs on line level - the best solution. And good tone controls to help with acoustic modes of the listenning room
http://www.meridian-audio.com/welcome.htm
One important thing: there is exactly one reproduction SPL that is correct: Either the original level for "natural" recordings or the one used for recording/mixdown for pure studio productions.
If the sound is lacking highs and lows at low listening volumes but O.K. at high SPLs, then either the frequency response at the lower and upper end of the playback system is bad or the playback level during recording/mixdown was way too high.
Regards
Charles
If the sound is lacking highs and lows at low listening volumes but O.K. at high SPLs, then either the frequency response at the lower and upper end of the playback system is bad or the playback level during recording/mixdown was way too high.
Regards
Charles
What I mean is if you go to a concert or listen to the master tape, you will hear those sounds through the "veil" of the frequency response shown in the whatsit curves exhibited above. If you want to accurately experience what you would have experienced at that concert or by listening in the studio, but at home, it doesn't make any sense to then start altering the frequency content of the music to compensate for "deficiences" (in your hearing. If you did you wouldn't hear what you would have heard had you been at the concert or in the studio. Your ear/brain's response is (presumably roughly) a constant in both situations, so why alter what is fed to it? If you do try to compensate, you will hear things differently for sure, but it ain't what you would have naturally experienced as a human being.
Me, I'm just glad we "hear" music the way we do, rather than, say, visualising wiggly lines. The latter might be a more accurate perception of sound waves (and I guess if we did experience sound that way we may well have developed an aesthetic for combinations and progressions of wiggly lines) but I kinda like it the way it is. It might be more accurate of course, to "listen" to music through some sophisticated oscilloscope type thing but I don't think I'm going to bother.
None of this means we shouldn't try present our "flawed" perception mechanism with the most accurate reproduction of sound it could have experienced in another time/place.
Jake
inverted commas = something of a loaded term in this context IMHO
Me, I'm just glad we "hear" music the way we do, rather than, say, visualising wiggly lines. The latter might be a more accurate perception of sound waves (and I guess if we did experience sound that way we may well have developed an aesthetic for combinations and progressions of wiggly lines) but I kinda like it the way it is. It might be more accurate of course, to "listen" to music through some sophisticated oscilloscope type thing but I don't think I'm going to bother.
None of this means we shouldn't try present our "flawed" perception mechanism with the most accurate reproduction of sound it could have experienced in another time/place.
Jake
inverted commas = something of a loaded term in this context IMHO
And that's fair enough too, but are you advocating altering the tone to compensate for the ear/brain's natural bias, or just cos you like it how you like it?
Can't argue with the latter. Can't argue with the former either if you simply want to experience what you wouldn't normally as a human being and prefer it that way, but it is hardly the argument based on "fidelity" which you appeared to be trying to make.
May have misunderstood you of course. And whatever rocks your boat rocks your boat.
Jake.
Can't argue with the latter. Can't argue with the former either if you simply want to experience what you wouldn't normally as a human being and prefer it that way, but it is hardly the argument based on "fidelity" which you appeared to be trying to make.
May have misunderstood you of course. And whatever rocks your boat rocks your boat.
Jake.
I'm with Jake
Anyone that feels the Fletcher / Munson curves effect at different listening levels has anything to do with enjoyment (or lack thereof) of music has a problem, IMVHO!
Just because the playback / ear system doesn't replicate what the real or mix / production event was should not affect one's ability to enjoy the musical content one bit - it's classic presentation over content thinking.
I'm after the substance, not the froth and not once have I ever wished I had tone controls on my system.
Andy.
Anyone that feels the Fletcher / Munson curves effect at different listening levels has anything to do with enjoyment (or lack thereof) of music has a problem, IMVHO!
Just because the playback / ear system doesn't replicate what the real or mix / production event was should not affect one's ability to enjoy the musical content one bit - it's classic presentation over content thinking.
I'm after the substance, not the froth and not once have I ever wished I had tone controls on my system.
Andy.
Here the most interesting thing I have read in a while:
http://world.std.com/~griesngr/intermod.ppt
found on
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/links.htm#Griesinger
Highlights:
-Ultrasonic capabilities / not
-How SACD doesn't contain ultrasonics in practice
-How even gross IMD might not always matter
-How the ear has its highest sensitivity at zero crossing while ignoring gross distortions elsewhere... [Class A rules hahahahaaaaaa]
-How the ear, beyond the zero crossing, essentially only hears half waves [see above hmmmpfhahaha]
etc.
All in all, good leads to clues about why so-so measuring amps can sound so good and why superb measuring amps can sound bad.
Disclaimer: No absolute truths here either
etc
http://world.std.com/~griesngr/intermod.ppt
found on
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/links.htm#Griesinger
Highlights:
-Ultrasonic capabilities / not
-How SACD doesn't contain ultrasonics in practice
-How even gross IMD might not always matter
-How the ear has its highest sensitivity at zero crossing while ignoring gross distortions elsewhere... [Class A rules hahahahaaaaaa]
-How the ear, beyond the zero crossing, essentially only hears half waves [see above hmmmpfhahaha]
etc.
All in all, good leads to clues about why so-so measuring amps can sound so good and why superb measuring amps can sound bad.
Disclaimer: No absolute truths here either
etc
She Who Must Be Obeyed........
When Vdelli are back in town (4 weeks or so) we should take you two to the Indie bar (Scarborough) for a sonic treat in what live sound CAN be like - GOOD, real good.
A good band, good system (treated) and good desk operator can be spectacularly good in the right room/environment.
Disco sound (and music) usually sucks big time and causes ear-bleed - best avoided like the plague.
Pat (WAR Audio) informs me that he constructed and installed a high-end disco system in Subiaco that he reckons is pretty good - maybe that is worth a listen too, maybe.....
Eric.
LOL.poulkirk said:
When Vdelli are back in town (4 weeks or so) we should take you two to the Indie bar (Scarborough) for a sonic treat in what live sound CAN be like - GOOD, real good.
A good band, good system (treated) and good desk operator can be spectacularly good in the right room/environment.
Disco sound (and music) usually sucks big time and causes ear-bleed - best avoided like the plague.
Pat (WAR Audio) informs me that he constructed and installed a high-end disco system in Subiaco that he reckons is pretty good - maybe that is worth a listen too, maybe.....
Eric.
Saw this graph while reading about digital jitter. Many people can hear between low and high jitter clocked digital gear.
This is the graph. The jitter error is the small red line deviation from the blue graph. The deviations are very small compared to the magnitude of the blue graph.
Visual appearance doesn't make sense. How come such a small deviation be so audible? What is our hearing sensitive to, more to the change (dV/dt) rather than absolute value?
This is the graph. The jitter error is the small red line deviation from the blue graph. The deviations are very small compared to the magnitude of the blue graph.
Visual appearance doesn't make sense. How come such a small deviation be so audible? What is our hearing sensitive to, more to the change (dV/dt) rather than absolute value?
Attachments
lumanauw said:
I have changed clocks and powersupplies in a couple of CD/SACD players and the improvement have been on such a level that anyone would here it.. audiophile or not.
That said without any measurements I assume the jitterlevels in those players was way below what your graph shows. As PMA writes the graph does not show a small thing going on... -40dB or thereabouts is very audible.
/Peter
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