And what is the formal definition of "right"? I would call something that works and doesn't cost anything extra pretty right.
There is a pretty wide range between "doesn't care at all" and "is totally obsessed with". Somewhere between those two extremes there might be a "works for me" and a "good enough".
Better gain structure has its advantages. I'll leave it at that.
Happy to agree with that - but not sure about the invisible moderation...
Last edited:
Hi guys,
I´m new with the DCX 2496 for my 4-way system. I have 2 problems with both of my DCX (manufacted in 2009), which are,
1st, a constant high noise (nice to hear on my compressiondrivers), it´s loud like standing behind the Niagara-Falls ;-). The noise is still the same, independently by changing the input or the channel gain! I use them with anlogue input, coming from a monitor controller (tc-electronic BMC2) with XLR output.
2nd, they are buzzing!
I checked for both problems the direction of the powerstrip and I cutted the ground from the powerstrip, - no changes!
Has anyone an idea?
Thx!
I´m new with the DCX 2496 for my 4-way system. I have 2 problems with both of my DCX (manufacted in 2009), which are,
1st, a constant high noise (nice to hear on my compressiondrivers), it´s loud like standing behind the Niagara-Falls ;-). The noise is still the same, independently by changing the input or the channel gain! I use them with anlogue input, coming from a monitor controller (tc-electronic BMC2) with XLR output.
2nd, they are buzzing!
I checked for both problems the direction of the powerstrip and I cutted the ground from the powerstrip, - no changes!
Has anyone an idea?
Thx!
Sorry to hear you are having such a hard time. I have to ask, how is your gain structure?
- Do you have volume controls in front of your amps?
- How hard are you driving the inputs?
- What do you see on the output VU meters?
- Is there any noise using the digital input (even if not connected)
- Is there noise with the outputs muted?
Thx Pano and barleywater.
Pano, I think you are right, these are some things I have to test for!
My amps are these ones http://www.albs.de/Spec/DAC-MOSII-120-240-360_Info.pdf
I can´t say something about the output sensivity at the moment. I will check the mute and the digital input.
Yes, i have two DCX, one for each my 4-way speakers. The DCX are new old stock from 2009.
Pano, I think you are right, these are some things I have to test for!
My amps are these ones http://www.albs.de/Spec/DAC-MOSII-120-240-360_Info.pdf
I can´t say something about the output sensivity at the moment. I will check the mute and the digital input.
Yes, i have two DCX, one for each my 4-way speakers. The DCX are new old stock from 2009.
OK, cool. If you have no volume control at the input of the power amps, that's going to be a problem right there, at least for domestic use.
Also try muting the DCX analog inputs with the outputs unmuted. You want to chase down where the noise is coming from. I suspect you simply have too much gain. You may have to reduce gain in a couple of places.
Also try muting the DCX analog inputs with the outputs unmuted. You want to chase down where the noise is coming from. I suspect you simply have too much gain. You may have to reduce gain in a couple of places.
I'd say the assessment is fairly straightforward: if you regularly have two LEDs flashing and sometimes a third on each output channel, your S/N is easy to live with. My present vacation-system set-up rarely tinkles a third LED and can't say the noise level is an issue. Naturally, more LEDs is better... till you are getting bits of limiting occurring.
And if you hardly ever see more than one LED flash on a given output channel, you are not in the ballpark.
With pop music (that tends to be badly compressed) you can expect to routinely run the unit hotter than for classical music. But overall, kind of an illusion that you can eke out lamps right to the top of the display. For sure, we play at all levels (day and night) and does anybody fuss with their DCX each time they play softly?
Others can have more picky criteria and/or other issues related to S/N (like peaky horn tweeters), but I'll stick with that. If the system sounds lousy with two LEDs as the regular level, the problem is not with hair-tuning to the unit's "pro" level.
Footnote: anybody have any idea what makes the LEDs flash? Peaks? Short peaks? Are they on a VU-meter simulator? Or what?
Ben
Ben
And if you hardly ever see more than one LED flash on a given output channel, you are not in the ballpark.
With pop music (that tends to be badly compressed) you can expect to routinely run the unit hotter than for classical music. But overall, kind of an illusion that you can eke out lamps right to the top of the display. For sure, we play at all levels (day and night) and does anybody fuss with their DCX each time they play softly?
Others can have more picky criteria and/or other issues related to S/N (like peaky horn tweeters), but I'll stick with that. If the system sounds lousy with two LEDs as the regular level, the problem is not with hair-tuning to the unit's "pro" level.
Footnote: anybody have any idea what makes the LEDs flash? Peaks? Short peaks? Are they on a VU-meter simulator? Or what?
Ben
Ben
Last edited:
Probably, but it doesn't hurt to check. In a system with a high gain power amp followed by a non-attenuated horn, all sorts of noise can show up.
For moderate listing levels my DCX is in the 2 bar VU range. It's not noisy, but I don't use the stock analog output section of the beast. I wouldn't mind finding better input settings for the amps, allowing the DCX to play higher. But as you know, that's a pain to adjust every time.
Sounds like a pita , Makes you wonder whatever happened to good old electronic xovers and parametric Eq's ...
Exactly the same issue*... except you rarely had flashing LEDs constantly berating you, "You poor soul... you aren't eking out the last bit of S/N benefit... poor soul..."
Truly silly not to have separate channel volume controls at the input to all devices. Almost always helpful to tap-down the incoming chain of residual noises. Almost always room to add some little VCs to the back panel.
Ben
*not exactly since the S/N specs on the DCX look better than old analog crossovers to start with... and might sound better.
Worked well for you for years , right ..?
Yes.
If you just want it for subwoofer duty, don't worry too much about the mods. The stock outputs are pretty clean below 1kHz. Power supply mods might help dynamics, tho.
The only thing I find bad about the DCX is the analog in/out sections. They were done to a price point, and it sounds like it (midrange and up). Yes, the power supply could be better, yes, the digital receiver chip has a bug, but I rarely find those to be a problem. The DSP is actually quite good, as are the ADC and DAC. That's the heart of the system and the part you should use.
Ben's right about those pesky VU meters. If you look at them, you'll think you ought to be driving them harder. Mine used to be hidden in a cabinet and I didn't worry much. Now that it's out in plain sight, well......
Can't say that the S/N ratio out of the chip is any worse than the full analog crossovers I've used, Ashely, Rane, DBX, etc. Seems much better, actually. If you drive the stock analog section fairly hard, then attenuate down for your power amps, the S/N ratio isn't bad either. It's IMD and HD that aren't great.
The only thing I find bad about the DCX is the analog in/out sections. They were done to a price point, and it sounds like it (midrange and up). Yes, the power supply could be better, yes, the digital receiver chip has a bug, but I rarely find those to be a problem. The DSP is actually quite good, as are the ADC and DAC. That's the heart of the system and the part you should use.
Ben's right about those pesky VU meters. If you look at them, you'll think you ought to be driving them harder. Mine used to be hidden in a cabinet and I didn't worry much. Now that it's out in plain sight, well......
Can't say that the S/N ratio out of the chip is any worse than the full analog crossovers I've used, Ashely, Rane, DBX, etc. Seems much better, actually. If you drive the stock analog section fairly hard, then attenuate down for your power amps, the S/N ratio isn't bad either. It's IMD and HD that aren't great.
FALLACY ALERT
Two issues you might keep in mind
First, the single S/N ratio is not always a good indicator of "noise annoyance." If the S/N is filled with 60 Hz hum, it might be more annoying than expected coming out of most woofers.
I'd be glad if someone could explain what the DCX (or other digital device) noise looks like, please?
Second, just because you think it is a woofer, it is a fallacy to think it won't make an ungodly racket with broadband noises possibly coming out of the DCX. Maybe not noise at 10kHz, but might play stuff at 2kHz louder than you imagine*. But a crossover will clobber noise outside its passband arising from upstream devices.
Ben
*this is a far worser problem than most folks imagine. If you use strategically located subs and/or mixed bass to one or more subs, and/or mild crossover slopes, even small amounts of these higher frequency sounds will greatly harm the system illusion... and particularly if they are decorrelated from the music.
Last edited: