You are correct Bob, and this is what I've done. But it doesn't stop someone doing the same to this thread as was done to the PS Audio thread here.
PS Audio - High-Performance Home Audio Equipment
Cheers George
PS Audio - High-Performance Home Audio Equipment
Cheers George
It seems that ondesx is very interested in optocoupler-circuits and like them a lot. Here is one from the diyparadise forum: "I tested a lot of passive interfaces, from simple pots, to auto- and transformers through stepped-attenuators, etc... Presently I'm testing a solution with opto-couplers. It seems the later will be a very good one, stay tuned...".
Beyonce and Balanced audio...
Beyonce and Balanced audio...
The benefits of this concept is obvious, the reason for the distortion figures is not obvious because there are interface issues, driver optimum load issues, etc. Without any information, what can we do? It could be a matter of how he phases his intentions, but not everyone has similar cultural backgrounds. In the past, people get good feedback if they post circuits and the problem, and ask for opinions.
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Is there a benefit using balanced audio? I think so if you have long runs of interconnects. The last time I was comparing interconnects of 2M+, I could not hear any difference between balanced interconnect vs unbalanced during a remote controled quick switch while music was playing. The other person claimed he could hear a little difference, but thought it was so small that his own emotions would effect perception more than what difference he heard. Perhaps longer runs of signal cables will make a differences.
If using 1 to 3mt interconnects balance (XLR) is actually a detriment as in approx 90% of equipment it engages an opamp into the signal path, even a expensive (for it's day) Classe DR25 poweramp engaged an opamp at it's input for balanced (XLR) then went back to single ended straight after in it's voltage stage, and if your like me, less is best it's a backward step.
As the amp output and speakers are single ended. So why convert a single ended analogue cartridge or single ended cdp to balance (XLR) and introduce more opamps in the output of the phono stage then the preamp then the input to the poweramp, you could have up to 4 x or more opamps in the signal path for a full balanced system.
Cheers George
As the amp output and speakers are single ended. So why convert a single ended analogue cartridge or single ended cdp to balance (XLR) and introduce more opamps in the output of the phono stage then the preamp then the input to the poweramp, you could have up to 4 x or more opamps in the signal path for a full balanced system.
Cheers George
George,
Would you agree that with a balanced source (DAC) and a balanced power amp it makes more sense to try to implement a balanced lighspeed configuration rather than introducing a Bal/SE converter before a "standard" lightspeed and possibly a SE/Bal converter after?
With the help of the nice guys around here I now have a current source and matched LDR "quads" for such a build. The only little detail holding me back from finishing it is that would like a neat little PCB taking the XLR connectors and series connected LDR's.
Unfortunately, doing PCB layouts is new to me
If anybody would like to help me with this please PM me.
Thanks,
Nic
Would you agree that with a balanced source (DAC) and a balanced power amp it makes more sense to try to implement a balanced lighspeed configuration rather than introducing a Bal/SE converter before a "standard" lightspeed and possibly a SE/Bal converter after?
With the help of the nice guys around here I now have a current source and matched LDR "quads" for such a build. The only little detail holding me back from finishing it is that would like a neat little PCB taking the XLR connectors and series connected LDR's.
Unfortunately, doing PCB layouts is new to me
If anybody would like to help me with this please PM me.
Thanks,
Nic
The funny thing is that almost all the professional audio gear is... balanced ! Like mikes, mixing devices, monitors... Thus, most of the music listened in the world is recorded and mixed in a balanced way in professional studios, i. e. the signal travels through an incredible number of electronic components, several tenth of meters of balanced wires and, depending of the music, the use of more or less of audio effects and corrections !...
A differential output cancels by subtraction any noise on the lines and this obviously improves the SNR (6 dB). Output levels are intrinsically higher, since most of the Hi-Fi equipment are at -10dBV whereas the professional balanced audio level is +4dBu !... Moreover for those who are aware of impedance issues, the balanced and single-ended lines have different impedance values. The main drawback of balanced gear is... its price !
I use professional gear to record music, through balanced mixing devices and monitors, this is why I do prefer XLR connections and balanced gear. But I agree that if the audio source isn't balanced it isn't mandatory to use balanced equipment.
A differential output cancels by subtraction any noise on the lines and this obviously improves the SNR (6 dB). Output levels are intrinsically higher, since most of the Hi-Fi equipment are at -10dBV whereas the professional balanced audio level is +4dBu !... Moreover for those who are aware of impedance issues, the balanced and single-ended lines have different impedance values. The main drawback of balanced gear is... its price !
I use professional gear to record music, through balanced mixing devices and monitors, this is why I do prefer XLR connections and balanced gear. But I agree that if the audio source isn't balanced it isn't mandatory to use balanced equipment.
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It will be interesting to see what will happen at a mixing room I will be doing a demo and presentation at on the 23rd. Most pro equipment expected to allow users to run long interconnects, so balanced transmission is a plus. However, I have tested on two home audio systems against balanced transmission. We got better reproduction performance out of unbalanced. So we really should consider as much issues as practical when we select unbalanced or balanced transmission. There is no hard rule one will be better than the other. I am going for additional testing for 10M unbalanced interconnect. The first step is to see how well it can get compared with 2M+ unbalanced transmission.
Are there any truly balanced DA converters around? I am under the impression that most convert to balanced for transmission pusposes.
I once posted a question in a mic group: "how do you know you have the correct polarity during recording and mixing?" boy, that created some confusion.
Are there any truly balanced DA converters around? I am under the impression that most convert to balanced for transmission pusposes.
I once posted a question in a mic group: "how do you know you have the correct polarity during recording and mixing?" boy, that created some confusion.
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Not only there are several DACs who are balanced by construction, but moreover even the "old" turntable phono output is by essence... balanced ! Then if you take the advantage of this facility for phono signals (current mode instead of tension it's much better of course...) then you instantly get a much better sound and an improved SNR...
George,
Would you agree that with a balanced source (DAC) and a balanced power amp it makes more sense to try to implement a balanced lighspeed configuration rather than introducing a Bal/SE converter before a "standard" lightspeed and possibly a SE/Bal converter after?
With the help of the nice guys around here I now have a current source and matched LDR "quads" for such a build. The only little detail holding me back from finishing it is that would like a neat little PCB taking the XLR connectors and series connected LDR's.
Unfortunately, doing PCB layouts is new to me
If anybody would like to help me with this please PM me.
Thanks,
Nic
Only if you are running 10-20mt interconects, and then it's only to stop noise/hum, your not gaining any sound quality. The true balanced input of a power amp attached is found on very few balanced amps, most just implement an opamp to do the balance input job and then after revert back to single ended, it is at this point the single ended rca is wired in, and in this case the single ended will sound better because it bypasses the opamp used for the balance work.
And then there is dacs/cdp's with so called balanced outputs, very few are balance all the way from the dac chips outputs right through to the xlr connectors usually they are single ended from the dac chips through the I/V stage then through 2 opamps to give the balanced output where the same but single ended output goes through 1 opamp after the I/V stage
Cheers George
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And here is a true balanced dac, from dac chips right through to the xlr outputs.
And don't think for a minute that cartriges are balanced because they have 4 wires, 2 of the wires are earthed to the shielded cable, and only have one hot per channel not 2 +&- like balanced should be, otherwise they would have 6 wires.
Cheers George
And don't think for a minute that cartriges are balanced because they have 4 wires, 2 of the wires are earthed to the shielded cable, and only have one hot per channel not 2 +&- like balanced should be, otherwise they would have 6 wires.
Cheers George
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Not true... If we are speaking of Moving Coil these cartridges are balanced current generators and match best with balanced current amplifiers... We're here on a different "balanced" approach called floating balanced!
Anyway, we process the audio signal in a... differential way. Two other very important consequences of these mode : no input offset and no impedance sensitivity of the device since we are in current mode.
In current mode even very low output level MC cartridges will perfectly match the preamp !
There is at least one commercial phono preamp using this facility... I own one of course !...
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I think all of the phono RIAA input and output I have seen are unbalanced except for the input of one. However, this had nothing to to with volume control. Mc cartridges with transformer stepup is a different issue. Quite interestingly, I would have though balanced input would be better for interface with phono cartridges, but as George has mentioned, the negative side is always grounded. I've made it known in other forums that I might be interested in getting back to phonos if nobody had made significant improvements by the time I'm 80.
Your thought is correct and George is incorrect. With the exception of some Shures (which can be made balanced by cutting a small strap on one of the pins) and Deccas, there is no reason whatever that cartridges can't be run balanced. My phono stage takes advantage of this and runs the input balanced, and I'm far from the first or only one.
DIY : Opus - A Balanced DAC,...
Hi-Fi gear : Daniel Weiss Hi-Fi model,...
Professional gear : Daniel Weiss prof version, Orpheus from Prism Sound,...
Etc. Google will help you finding a lot more...
Please, again don't take my word, even if it's a bit irritating to be always undeservedly corrected, go to the Aqvox preamp Ci2 web page...
Here : Phono, stage, best Phonostage, highend, audiophile, balanced, Single-Ended, Class-A, current amplifier, phonostages, phonoamp, phono amplifier, phono preamp, RIAA,