That sounds like ad copy from Stereopile......
It certainly wouldn't be a "last step" album for me, that's for sure.
jeff
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Ha!
I think you misunderstood me. I wasn't criticizing MP3, I was talking about the Adel mix. It's a miasma of "Everything louder than everything else." Way too much stuffed into not enough space, sonically speaking.
I dunno - maybe a lot. Certainly I've heard much better vinyl playback than mine (and better than CD). But mostly on setups that cost more than my car.
Not sure what the problem is. As you know I have a Rek-O-Kut TT converted to outboard drive, a Stanton 680 cart, vintage Grado maple arm.
FR is good, balance and phase are tight, distortion low and anti-skate seems about perfect. But surface noise can be high. Usually the music drowns it out, but some of those lead-in and lead-out grooves can be frightening.
Maybe moving coil and strain gauge are just not as sensitive to surface noise as MM and MI. I need to play around with another table and cart.
It does not, and decent vinyl playback isn't any "warmer" than anything else. This "warmth" you speak of is an "old wife's tale".
jeff
Gee, you mean they might offer me a job ...
Pano points out the problem, the sound is an "everything and the kitchen sink" spectacular, it's sonic overload - it takes an extremely even-handed system to not place emphasis on the overcooking, so that one can still comfortably maintain focus on the music that lies under all the manipulation. And that even-handness is what you're using the album to test for ...
Pano, I'm no cartridge man, not by a very, very long shot - but I've just looked at pic's of that cartridge, and the way the mounting brackets are set up I find quite disturbing - what material are these made of? Personally, I would stiffen and damp those tiny bits of angle material as an experiment, see what that gave me ...
Question: Would you buy today remastered CD or you will prefer the original CD recording from an artist who make a success in 1976 - 1978?
Yesterday I made a gift to my self, the Jean Michel Jarre - Equinoxe, and it took me some time to make a choice, and I ended up to sellect the fist recording of Polydor (Made in Germany CD) because I can not imagine of what it would be the remastered version by Sony music.
Another one CD in my wish list is the Jean Michel Jarre -Oxygene and I am convinced to get the first recording too.
Either way I am open for comments, this topic is for CD sound quality, and so I think that I am in the right place to ask such questions.
Yesterday I made a gift to my self, the Jean Michel Jarre - Equinoxe, and it took me some time to make a choice, and I ended up to sellect the fist recording of Polydor (Made in Germany CD) because I can not imagine of what it would be the remastered version by Sony music.
Another one CD in my wish list is the Jean Michel Jarre -Oxygene and I am convinced to get the first recording too.
Either way I am open for comments, this topic is for CD sound quality, and so I think that I am in the right place to ask such questions.
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Not so much, no. More a function, IME, of tip type. One qualifier: many (most?) MCs have a shallow and broad frequency response dip in the brightness region which can, if severe enough, give that illusion.
We have both, in original form, and very happy with them. Got the special edition of Zoolook, and that was very satisfying as well.
post 49
CD's made on first generation manufacturing equipment are inferior to the ones made on the latest equipment. Also the raw materials used have improved over the years, making it easier to manufacture better disc's. How much this effects playback I could not say without testing the actual disc.
I have always been impressed by the Sony glass mastering system, in both the looks and test results of the disc's (BLER and Jitter etc). I know that Pink Floyd had problems with an EMI pre release of one of their CD's. The Sony version was apparently far better.
CD's made on first generation manufacturing equipment are inferior to the ones made on the latest equipment. Also the raw materials used have improved over the years, making it easier to manufacture better disc's. How much this effects playback I could not say without testing the actual disc.
I have always been impressed by the Sony glass mastering system, in both the looks and test results of the disc's (BLER and Jitter etc). I know that Pink Floyd had problems with an EMI pre release of one of their CD's. The Sony version was apparently far better.
CD disc from it very beginning is a storage media loaded with a pile of data and baked in a hot oven.
I have CD's mostly manufactured at 90s, most of them were distributed by EMI.
Non of them failed, and I have no proof or a case of inferior manufacturing process.
From the other hand how can you do Jitter comparisons when you have just a copy and not the master copy?
I have CD's mostly manufactured at 90s, most of them were distributed by EMI.
Non of them failed, and I have no proof or a case of inferior manufacturing process.
From the other hand how can you do Jitter comparisons when you have just a copy and not the master copy?
You should actually go at the start point which was live recordings by just microphones.
Mastering came later on, but all sound impressions are based according the age which an individual started listening music.
I started at the time that ABBA and Boney M become famous.
Suddenly all Daddy's become Cool back then .
I started getting into music at about the same time.
The difference is that rather than ABBA and Boney M I was into The Residents, New York Dolls, Pere Ubu, CAN etc.
Never had much time for Frank Farian products like Boney M.
And what this has to do with your primary comment? Which was translated as that older CD production tecniques was creating inferior CD's.
I am an industrial electician of our times, I do accept the descrption of a " Better machine" when it goes down to productivity counters.
From the other hand I have the elusion that old produced CD's was made by not following that strictly the recycling policy (regarding plastic), and this possibly answers the question of why they do not die that easy.
Newer CD production methods produce a better CD.
The first CD's were made in a batch system. Compare it to car manufacturing pre Henry ford. Each process has its own department of machines and personnel with the discs moving in batches though the plant. Many orders running simultaneously though the departments. In 1988 the first inline equipment was developed as well as QA scanners. All the processes are placed in a self contained production unit with scanners to check the discs. One order per production unit.
Then there are the improvements in moulding equipment and optical grade polycarbonate.
All discs now are coated/printed with UV coatings/inks in contrast to most of the pre 1988 discs which use solvent based coatings/inks.
The first CD's were made in a batch system. Compare it to car manufacturing pre Henry ford. Each process has its own department of machines and personnel with the discs moving in batches though the plant. Many orders running simultaneously though the departments. In 1988 the first inline equipment was developed as well as QA scanners. All the processes are placed in a self contained production unit with scanners to check the discs. One order per production unit.
Then there are the improvements in moulding equipment and optical grade polycarbonate.
All discs now are coated/printed with UV coatings/inks in contrast to most of the pre 1988 discs which use solvent based coatings/inks.
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My eyes and mind I like to believe that they are trained enough to distinguish details that makes the difference to consumer level, in simple English if the sum of improvements is just at the chemical processes and the CD's did not gain a better scratch resistant coating?
In this case I can not feel any excitement about the improvements regarding how better the product looks externally.
Either way I like to thank you, because this conversation it did brought some more light regarding CD manufacturing.
Right now I am a bit exited, just scored on eBay original J.M. Jarre Equinox CD (Canadian production 1992) FDM 36141-2 by Koch International USA.
And also original J.M. Jarre Oxygene 800015-2 Germany 1983
(possibly red one).
And I will compare both regarding sound quality with the CD : The Concerts in China, which I got it in my city in 90s.
In this case I can not feel any excitement about the improvements regarding how better the product looks externally.
Either way I like to thank you, because this conversation it did brought some more light regarding CD manufacturing.
Right now I am a bit exited, just scored on eBay original J.M. Jarre Equinox CD (Canadian production 1992) FDM 36141-2 by Koch International USA.
And also original J.M. Jarre Oxygene 800015-2 Germany 1983
(possibly red one).
And I will compare both regarding sound quality with the CD : The Concerts in China, which I got it in my city in 90s.
If you want to test your CD's on their playback ability try optidrivecontrol or plexUtil, you want to check the BLER. The Redbook spec for BLER<220.
The BLER would normally be less than 5 for a well made disc.
CD manufacturing is a bit like a photocopier. Make 10000 copies and they are all the same. If the original has a typo so will the 10000 copies.
The CD specification has not changed but the technology used in the equipment has.
I did the production training at the first CD factory in Greece, Digital Press Hellas in Athens. I had a great time.
The BLER would normally be less than 5 for a well made disc.
CD manufacturing is a bit like a photocopier. Make 10000 copies and they are all the same. If the original has a typo so will the 10000 copies.
The CD specification has not changed but the technology used in the equipment has.
I did the production training at the first CD factory in Greece, Digital Press Hellas in Athens. I had a great time.
Possibly I am lucky by owning Plextor CD recorder but is not that fresh, lets hope that the latest PlexUtil will cooperate with it.
I am living in central Greece - Volos, there is also here a CD's factory, it did some profits by making CD discs mostly behalf printed magazines ( the ones which come as gift) with the magazine.
I think that the company called as as Arkadia ( or close enough) I have visit this factory, there was some heavy smell in it, my story is 12 years old, I had approach them by seeking the position of the electrician.
In my recent past I was cooperating with many local industries as link between them and the headquarters of high-tech systems for metal forming (large pipes) and cutting lasers (Bystronic) and even water jet cutting systems.
The last five years all that activity disappeared, nowadays I have expand to technical Blogging and this is a way out for now.
I am living in central Greece - Volos, there is also here a CD's factory, it did some profits by making CD discs mostly behalf printed magazines ( the ones which come as gift) with the magazine.
I think that the company called as as Arkadia ( or close enough) I have visit this factory, there was some heavy smell in it, my story is 12 years old, I had approach them by seeking the position of the electrician.
In my recent past I was cooperating with many local industries as link between them and the headquarters of high-tech systems for metal forming (large pipes) and cutting lasers (Bystronic) and even water jet cutting systems.
The last five years all that activity disappeared, nowadays I have expand to technical Blogging and this is a way out for now.
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