If you'd have read my previous posts you wouldn't have bothered to ask me to attend your tests. I already know I probably wouldn't hear a difference.
In my own system, with my gear, over a long period of time - I'm confident I could hear a difference (Assuming one exists).
World' Best Midranges - SHOCKING Results & Conclusions.
Suggestions to improve this test:
1. Remove all room treatments and move closer to boundaries so that the ratio of reflected sound increases. There should be early and late reflections. Listener should sit far enough away that the ratio of direct to reflected sound is significant.
2. Have subjects repeat the exact same on-axis EQ sitting 45 degrees off axis.
3. Do it in stereo and add in subjective image evaluation with test tracks that create strong images.
4. Repeat test with speakers tilted or listeners sitting on the floor so that the vertical response can be evaluated.
In my opinion these changes will help listeners distinguish between drivers more easily....
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Suggestions to improve this test:
1. Remove all room treatments and move closer to boundaries so that the ratio of reflected sound increases. There should be early and late reflections. Listener should sit far enough away that the ratio of direct to reflected sound is significant.
2. Have subjects repeat the exact same on-axis EQ sitting 45 degrees off axis.
3. Do it in stereo and add in subjective image evaluation with test tracks that create strong images.
4. Repeat test with speakers tilted or listeners sitting on the floor so that the vertical response can be evaluated.
In my opinion these changes will help listeners distinguish between drivers more easily....
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It's actually WORSE than that: speakers can sound the same even without the same FR response!
Refer to our matchup #1: there is a 1/2 octave difference.
I've updated on page 1 the total % with my results of yesterday.
Still 50% of participants failed the test.
Believe me, ALL speakers sound the same!. You just need to gather deaf people to prove it. I think this is very easy to understand... The more important phenomenon or hypothesis is not yet addressedIt's actually WORSE than that: speakers can sound the same even without the same FR response!
Interesting comment.
That would imply the test is flawed because participants we had so far do not represent the ''normal'' population.
It's perfectly possible, indeed. Unlikely, but possible. Only way possible to adress this issue is to continue testing on more participants; different ages, background, etc...
Believe me, ALL speakers sound the same!. You just need to gather deaf people to prove it. I think this is very easy to understand... The more important phenomenon or hypothesis is not yet addressed
It's funny but I've noticed all male Gorillas look the same too. Same goes for German Shepherd dogs and Ginger cats.
Think I need to sort out a quick ABX type of test to confirm this...
Haha!
i see you comin', Jay, i see you comin'...
Among other things, i do wine blind tastings on a regular basis and i can assure you that a Cali Chardonnay won't taste the same as an Alsacian Riesling. I'd bet on that, blindly!
... and that is my whole point. Thank you for bringing it up.
I am SURE i'd have one hell of a hard time trying to MIMIC an Armand Rousseau Burgundy with any other wine/recipe/whatever.
I am SURE it would be impossible to MIMIC a Ferrari F488 with any other ''cheap'' car (just the noise!)...
The HiFi market is based on an illusion: the illusion that human auditory capacities are actually enough to hear ''high resolution'' differences.
I am SURE i'd have one hell of a hard time trying to MIMIC an Armand Rousseau Burgundy with any other wine/recipe/whatever.
I am SURE it would be impossible to MIMIC a Ferrari F488 with any other ''cheap'' car (just the noise!)...
The HiFi market is based on an illusion: the illusion that human auditory capacities are actually enough to hear ''high resolution'' differences.
I would not advise it. Please be very careful with male gorilla ''B'', he bites. Well, the good news is you'll find him easily.
Even though being blind in a room with 2 male gorillas might bring a lot of stimulus in your life, make sure you won't test the reflections of the room based on the power response of said gorillas.
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Whether the test is flawed or not, it depends on the goal or the question you try to find the answer for (so it relates to the conclusion)...
If you tried to understand human capacity in a blind test, your test is not flawed. But it's a very old story. Some of us already know the outcome...
It is natural to expect that human's capacity will follow the bell curve. There will always be people in the 10th and 90th percentiles.
But if you want to improve your definition of "human capacity" beyond just "human capacity in a blind test", you may need a different test!
What is meant by "auditory capacity"? It's dubious or subjective. In general you are right. YOU thought that you and/or the participants would be able to pass the test but you were wrong. YOU overestimated your "auditory capacity"...
Please note carefully, the way you came to your conclusion. It's different than mine. I came to the same conclusion by observing how people have difficulty to listen to things I can easily do. That's not the point, but important to mention for a reason.
This is also non-definitive statement. What is meant by "King"? Like you have mentioned regarding how you can pass the test with 15/15, you focused on frequency segment where there is huge different in the SPL level (the missing half octave). It is the difference in SPL that works for you, as a result of different FR. But from this, you cannot tell the difference in quality, only difference in sound (so not useful at all)...
Difference in level is probably the easiest clue for human to use in a blind test. There are some much more advanced/difficult clues (which are more useful)...
Jf4828 already had suggestions. We don't always listen to on-axis response. Often, off-axis is the real clue of a good speaker. This is not addressed by a DSP technique where off-axis cannot be equalized.
Electrical "limits" also non-definitive.
But the hypothesis that I have mentioned for more than 10 years on this site is: Even if people cannot succeed in a blind test where there is difference, it doesn't mean that the difference doesn't affect them...
So please note that here, human auditory capacity is under-estimated by people... They think that, when they cannot hear any difference in a blind text then no difference matters... This is imo a wrong conclusion.
Learning from my own capability in blind test, I know that there are things that I can hear after longer time. I also learned that there are thing that I can do in minutes today, was days years ago. I have learned to understand what causing these effects, and even to learn to correlate with "numbers" in speaker and amplifier design. It is hard to assume that whatever applies to me applies to others too. But I strongly believe that my hypothesis is true.
Do you interested with more advanced question for your test? That's why I suggested that the ones who pass your test should give their comments. It is important to know what they hear. Many variables are trade-off of other variables. But I myself more interested in what I can perceive in the prolonged listening (aka distortion or fatigue or enjoyment).
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The WINO market is based on an illusion: the illusion that human Olfactory and Taste capacities are actually enough to recognize ''high resolution'' differences.
The strongest Influence seems Price which over rides the Senses.
Tests show, Swill is Acceptable as long as the Label looks good.
There is a Lot of BS involved in not just Audio.
I appreciate the "Shocking Results & Conclusions".
The strongest Influence seems Price which over rides the Senses.
Tests show, Swill is Acceptable as long as the Label looks good.
There is a Lot of BS involved in not just Audio.
I appreciate the "Shocking Results & Conclusions".
i can assure you that a Cali Chardonnay won't taste the same as an Alsacian Riesling. I'd bet on that, blindly!
Were you born with the ability to tell the difference between wine, or did you improve your wine tasting skills over a period of time?