Agreed - it means the designer focussed so hard on this one measure other important aspects are almost certain to have been missed. As a designer myself the resource that always limits a design is the designer's attention. Over-attending to one area to me means lack of attention elsewhere which sets off the alarm bells.
Besides that there's Goodhart's Law - 'When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.'
<afterthought> The Mola Mola DAC is perhaps the one with the greatest attention to THD+N. On his blog, Bruno spoke about optimizing those figures far beyond other competing designs 'as a matter of pride'. So the question is - how does it sound?
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It used to be fashionable to say things like that, never seen (heard) any substantiation. Low distortion oth means low Zout and high PSRR, nothing wrong with that.
I am sorry to show my ignorance here because I have been a member for years, but cannot figure why one would need a DAC.
I probably have several DACs in my CD, DVD, BluRay, Phone, PC, etc. Why then the need for a standalone DAC. Where is the CODEC kept in order to play the different formats, surely not in this box.
Assuming you still need the likes of a sound card to decode the MP3, FLAC, WAV or whatever format, how do we know that the decoding process is providing optimum data to be listened through this DAC with noise floor of -130 dB or whatever.
Why is so much importance attached the the make of the DAC does nothing before the DAC have any influence on the sound it produces?
I probably have several DACs in my CD, DVD, BluRay, Phone, PC, etc. Why then the need for a standalone DAC. Where is the CODEC kept in order to play the different formats, surely not in this box.
Assuming you still need the likes of a sound card to decode the MP3, FLAC, WAV or whatever format, how do we know that the decoding process is providing optimum data to be listened through this DAC with noise floor of -130 dB or whatever.
Why is so much importance attached the the make of the DAC does nothing before the DAC have any influence on the sound it produces?
I don't understand your point...There are 2 things that average DIYers/audiophiles miss in order to get to the best sound, and they aren't aware of it: (1) Good DAC when source is digital (2) Good speaker.
Only one good, they will not know what is possible...
No disrespect meant but what is it that we average DIYers are missing. Jay, you have not answered my question. Why would I need a DAC external to any equipment. A DAC on its own will not decode the data, or does it know the format such as FLAC, MP3 or WAV and able to decode it. Not any DAC that I know off can do such a thing.
Is it a certainty that the pre-processing of the data is perfect before it is put through a DAC and the sound that we hear is then dependant on the preprocessed data? Why do you still need a sound card in your PC and why would a Windows Player software sound better or worse than A JPriver or other software and drivers.
I am not trying to pull the *** from the chicken, but like guys like abraxalito or SY to tell me a bit more regarding external DACs.
Is it a certainty that the pre-processing of the data is perfect before it is put through a DAC and the sound that we hear is then dependant on the preprocessed data? Why do you still need a sound card in your PC and why would a Windows Player software sound better or worse than A JPriver or other software and drivers.
I am not trying to pull the *** from the chicken, but like guys like abraxalito or SY to tell me a bit more regarding external DACs.
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Agree with Jay ! You could never know to what is able a good speaker without a good source ! I'm very surprise each time how a speaker can perform better with a better DAC : at home the weakest link was (is) always the source ! Even with the lowest dynamic headroom like a 16 bit dac (95 dB iirc from theory !) chip have with a TDA1541 e.g. !
If you cure the layout before and after the chip, the same speaker can sound from borring or bad to astonishing ! I surmise many bought expensive speakers without care more to their source !
@ Nico ras: As far it's bit perfect and there are not pre-treatments (filters) your external will just see jitter issues. As most of the time the signal is not reclocked and resynchronised just before the dac chip then you hear différences with a same dac chip ! Few embeded sound cards take care of the layout around the dac chip. That's why a good dac with carefull input treatment, clocking, buffering and average output work best ! So one need no soundcard to decode format and send datas to an USB output ! You will hear more the USB hardware/pilot combo than the processor/ram ! That's why again USB to I2S soundcards with asynchronous recloking work best ! Does it exist with embeded soundcard ? And when at the end the signal is buffered (I2S) with acurate timing : one can not hear a difference between two streamer softs if bit accurates ! Maybe off topic, I don't understood so much your input about a soundcard needed before an external dac but for the commodity of output (spidf or symetric e.g.). Btw just two cents, don't know if this helps !
If you cure the layout before and after the chip, the same speaker can sound from borring or bad to astonishing ! I surmise many bought expensive speakers without care more to their source !
@ Nico ras: As far it's bit perfect and there are not pre-treatments (filters) your external will just see jitter issues. As most of the time the signal is not reclocked and resynchronised just before the dac chip then you hear différences with a same dac chip ! Few embeded sound cards take care of the layout around the dac chip. That's why a good dac with carefull input treatment, clocking, buffering and average output work best ! So one need no soundcard to decode format and send datas to an USB output ! You will hear more the USB hardware/pilot combo than the processor/ram ! That's why again USB to I2S soundcards with asynchronous recloking work best ! Does it exist with embeded soundcard ? And when at the end the signal is buffered (I2S) with acurate timing : one can not hear a difference between two streamer softs if bit accurates ! Maybe off topic, I don't understood so much your input about a soundcard needed before an external dac but for the commodity of output (spidf or symetric e.g.). Btw just two cents, don't know if this helps !
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Think of an external DAC as like having a desktop monitor. Sure some equipment has its own display but then again if it has a VGA output (like my oscilloscope) or an HDMI (like my laptop) then it has the capability for being much bigger and hence easier to see by plugging in the desktop screen.
By no means a perfect analogy, but its a start.
@ Vaccuphile : You mean a better dac is needed what ever it's on a sound card which are pluged or an external dac which are wired ! But not twice (two dacs I mean)!
That's I undertand from SY input : both are not needed (but anachronism contexts : e.g. using a pc soundcard with a spidf to feed a spidf input on an external dac ! ).
Now the best a PC can give if no soundcard is the USB in relation to the todays external DAC !
Soundcard is not anachronic if outputing analog (with jack plug often ?) while a sota external dac will often sound better due to the better layout around the chip !
I would say : wires are anachronics ! and force us to trade offs ! buffering and reclocking after wifi transport should be the rule or at the worst, just RJ45 TCPIP if no sota soundcard with long wires to the pre/amp !
But hey, soon we will have sota DDX amps, no ? with H2 made from scratch !
That's I undertand from SY input : both are not needed (but anachronism contexts : e.g. using a pc soundcard with a spidf to feed a spidf input on an external dac ! ).
Now the best a PC can give if no soundcard is the USB in relation to the todays external DAC !
Soundcard is not anachronic if outputing analog (with jack plug often ?) while a sota external dac will often sound better due to the better layout around the chip !
I would say : wires are anachronics ! and force us to trade offs ! buffering and reclocking after wifi transport should be the rule or at the worst, just RJ45 TCPIP if no sota soundcard with long wires to the pre/amp !
But hey, soon we will have sota DDX amps, no ? with H2 made from scratch
!
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... and for Laptop, God invented : USB soundcards.... ouf !.... and usb dacs, argh !
@redrooster : because all the crazy wires, one have to ask : what dac according to my : ???? USB, SPIDF, Toslink, etc....
keep the dac chip and ask to George here for a better layout ! if SPIDF, one can find on second hand cheap and good enough Subbu DAC !
@redrooster : because all the crazy wires, one have to ask : what dac according to my : ???? USB, SPIDF, Toslink, etc....
keep the dac chip and ask to George here for a better layout ! if SPIDF, one can find on second hand cheap and good enough Subbu DAC !
Abrax, what makes you feel this is better than the AK4490 DAC (well < 80 USD) I referred to earlier http://www.ebay.com/itm/252056604514?
It is old versus new technology, and certainly looking at specs, evolution has gone in the direction of incremental progress towards better performing parts.
It is old versus new technology, and certainly looking at specs, evolution has gone in the direction of incremental progress towards better performing parts.