Hey guys, firstly Ive learned so much reading through this thread about subs and its helping me decide what type of subs to get because there are so many types to choose from, Cheers.
Im a Dj and use 2x dual 15"+ cd tops and 2x 18" w bins, i recently bought a Behringer cx2310 c/o and it seems they play better(louder) around 120hz and below.
So are they designed for 50hz and above? when they play lower frequencies my amp clips and turns off! for the size of them you'd think they'd shake shake everything to bits lol.
W bins 18" Beyma GT400, 300w
Amp QSC RMX1450 1400w @ 4ohms
Im a Dj and use 2x dual 15"+ cd tops and 2x 18" w bins, i recently bought a Behringer cx2310 c/o and it seems they play better(louder) around 120hz and below.
So are they designed for 50hz and above? when they play lower frequencies my amp clips and turns off! for the size of them you'd think they'd shake shake everything to bits lol.
W bins 18" Beyma GT400, 300w
Amp QSC RMX1450 1400w @ 4ohms
"W" bins are not "designed" for any frequency in particular. It's just a convenient way to *fold* a bass horn. Beyond that the actual dimensions, mouth size, and flare rate are a few of the determining factors. The selection of a proper driver has an effect as well.
Fwiw, with 300w drivers, you can't run 1400watts into them for very long without overheating the voice coils. Assuming they are in parallel you can run 600watts or 300w per driver, while in series you can still only run 300watts per driver. You can't exceed the power rating of any driver.
In general larger size horns (regardless of configuration) will do lower in frequency. An exception is where you use multiple truncated (mouth too small) and identical horns arrayed together so that the effective size of the mouth is increased - and/or they are run against the floor, floor/corner boundaries (making the effective mouth size larger).
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Fwiw, with 300w drivers, you can't run 1400watts into them for very long without overheating the voice coils. Assuming they are in parallel you can run 600watts or 300w per driver, while in series you can still only run 300watts per driver. You can't exceed the power rating of any driver.
In general larger size horns (regardless of configuration) will do lower in frequency. An exception is where you use multiple truncated (mouth too small) and identical horns arrayed together so that the effective size of the mouth is increased - and/or they are run against the floor, floor/corner boundaries (making the effective mouth size larger).
_-_-
Hummm!
Do you have one driver in each enclosure?
(My first guess would be an impedance problem or amp not impedance stable, amp can work with stereo 2 ohms outputs also.)
RMX1450 Power Amplifier ? QSC
Beyma 18 GT400
Yes 1 driver per bin, im running them bridged into 1 channel, ill try them in stereo tomorrow and see how that goes and Ill let you guys know how it went, also there are no markings on the speakers and have matched them visually to beyma pics on the net so they could be a 4ohm version, heres a pic, also the terminals are at opposite sides.(more photos on photobucket)
Take ur ohmeter and measure the DCR of the VC, the DCR is always slightly *lower* than the impedance.
For example if you get a 6.8ohm DCR, you likely have an 8 ohm speaker. So, if you have a DCR under 4 ohms, you have a 4 ohm speaker.
You did not say if the amp is running ONLY the "w" bins, or if it is running the "w" and the 15" cabinets too?
IF ur running the amp in bridged and you have the w bins in PARALLEL, then your impedance is likely too low for the amp to drive at full or nearly full output. You can still run in bridged, IF you switch to a SERIES connection so that the series impedance is DOUBLE the impedance of a single driver or "w bin".
Probably not much difference in max spl with either the series connection + bridged amp vs. parallel connection + "stereo" (two channel) operation.
For example if you get a 6.8ohm DCR, you likely have an 8 ohm speaker. So, if you have a DCR under 4 ohms, you have a 4 ohm speaker.
You did not say if the amp is running ONLY the "w" bins, or if it is running the "w" and the 15" cabinets too?
IF ur running the amp in bridged and you have the w bins in PARALLEL, then your impedance is likely too low for the amp to drive at full or nearly full output. You can still run in bridged, IF you switch to a SERIES connection so that the series impedance is DOUBLE the impedance of a single driver or "w bin".
Probably not much difference in max spl with either the series connection + bridged amp vs. parallel connection + "stereo" (two channel) operation.
You can't run an RMX1450 at 1400 watts for very long either. It's not even a 1/3-duty-cycle-rated amp at 4 ohm bridge. That amp will shut down before it delivers enough average power to hurt the VCs. Excursion could still be a killer, though. At frequencies below where the horn has significant "gain" the impedance will tend to be low - the deeper the bass you try to feed them the worse the situation.
these beyma are 18 gt200
most w-bins sound ugly above 100hz,and because you run dual 15" tops,you might as wel cross in that area
you wil need a high pass filter on them,(depending on what model)~40 hz lr
w-bins are not the n1 choice nowadays.you better of bilding a th of the same size(or bigger) to get some more low end
edit/ 250watt rms asuming 500 watt aes.
ive had these myself ,weak cone ,x-max 6mm .
you might want to inspect the cones for folds/damage.
most w-bins sound ugly above 100hz,and because you run dual 15" tops,you might as wel cross in that area
you wil need a high pass filter on them,(depending on what model)~40 hz lr
w-bins are not the n1 choice nowadays.you better of bilding a th of the same size(or bigger) to get some more low end
edit/ 250watt rms asuming 500 watt aes.
ive had these myself ,weak cone ,x-max 6mm .
you might want to inspect the cones for folds/damage.
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Thats exactly what i was thinking, i can turn it on, play a song with low bass (40-60hz on the c/o) and it will shut off within a few seconds, raise the c/o fq to 100hz and it sounds like there's less stress on the driver which is why i asked what fq these played at,(also the "Excursion being a killer" i heard them bottom out and quickly turned them down, oops lol ) and yes the deeper bass and the amp cuts out, i thought the qsc rmx series was a good amp so im trying to figure out whats going on (maybe the amp needs a service?), i still have to run it in stereo so i still have some more testing to do.
w-bins are not the n1 choice nowadays.you better of bilding a th of the same size(or bigger) to get some more low end
W-style horns typically have a fast flare rate and a short path, which implies a high cutoff frequency. W-style folds are only space efficient if the flare rate is relatively fast, for slower expansion rates the snail shell does better. 50 to 60 Hz is pretty much all you get, and that's without the local excursion minimum typical of THs which will let you play a bit below the quarter wave frequency. Stacking them in parallel doesn't help the LF corner either - if the path is too short the path is too short.
these beyma are 18 gt200
most w-bins sound ugly above 100hz,and because you run dual 15" tops,you might as wel cross in that area
you wil need a high pass filter on them,(depending on what model)~40 hz lr
w-bins are not the n1 choice nowadays.you better of bilding a th of the same size(or bigger) to get some more low end
edit/ 250watt rms asuming 500 watt aes.
ive had these myself ,weak cone ,x-max 6mm .
you might want to inspect the cones for folds/damage.
Ill have a look at them for damage but ideally Id love to make some TH subs, i first came across the design accidentally while looking for info on w bins and have now been reading about the Synergy Speakers and TH subs for MANY HOURS lol
Do you think i could take out the inside braces of the w bins and change the design to TH or would it be easier building a new box, the w bins are carpeted, have wheels and handles and are ideal for transporting.
It's a "good" amp, but for the heavy, almost sine wave duty of EDM you need a "touring grade" amp. Especially at low impedance (4 ohms bridged). If your amp isn't up to those standards, run it stereo and keep it 4 ohms or more. Even then, unless it's a low heat class H or D, you'll have nuisance shutdowns in heavy use. I have some old USA1310's that would quit after about 2 hours outside in the heat with 4 ohms stereo on subs or even mids if I'm running into any sort of real distortion. The RMX2450's or even 5050's would be fine with that load but run too hot for comfort 2 ohms stereo. The 2450 actually runs cooler than the 1450. The CA18's would run all day 2 ohms stereo (driving lab horns).
Well that's not bridged mode, you have to connect the speakers to the RED binding posts only or make a special Speakon cable with the amp end wired to the 1+/2+ terminals and connect that to the Ch1 output. But before you go doing that..
In general a W bin is going to cover from 50-60hz and up so there is absolutely no point setting the crossover at 40-50hz. To prevent driver damage you want to engage the 50hz low-cut filters on the rear panel and if your drivers are 4ohm then you will want to run them in stereo/dual mono mode because the amp isn't stable into that load in bridged mode and it's too much power for the drivers anyway.
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Hi,
W bins in their heyday were designed for stacking in multiples,
if you want to get any decent low bass out of them, basically
the more the merrier, and made big PA's easier to breakdown.
A single W bin is a poor solution, think 3 or more per side.
A typical number is 4, and a typical W bin a 1/4 of the design.
rgds, sreten.
W bins in their heyday were designed for stacking in multiples,
if you want to get any decent low bass out of them, basically
the more the merrier, and made big PA's easier to breakdown.
A single W bin is a poor solution, think 3 or more per side.
A typical number is 4, and a typical W bin a 1/4 of the design.
rgds, sreten.
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