• WARNING: Tube/Valve amplifiers use potentially LETHAL HIGH VOLTAGES.
    Building, troubleshooting and testing of these amplifiers should only be
    performed by someone who is thoroughly familiar with
    the safety precautions around high voltages.

Tube amp, output capacitor and headphones impedance

Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.

PRR

Member
Joined 2003
Paid Member
What happened to "47uf, 400V polyprop audyn cap is only 10.25€ a piece"? That gives 10 or 15Hz response and is not THAT expensive. I just paid -almost- that much for lunch. (First good lunch in a long week....) And an amp-cap lasts longer than a lunch.
 
diyAudio Senior Member
Joined 2002
Hi,

What happened to "47uf, 400V polyprop audyn cap is only 10.25€ a piece"? That gives 10 or 15Hz response and is not THAT expensive. I just paid -almost- that much for lunch. (First good lunch in a long week....) And an amp-cap lasts longer than a lunch.

The Audyn caps are definetely fine caps but no match for the BG non-polar range IME.

Yes, that came as a surprise to me too...

Cheers,;)
 
PRR : in fact, i can get more uf for the money with BG. For 19€ a pop (best price i found, and it's in Belgium), I've the choice between 150uf of BG VK or 82uf of Audyn mkp-qs.

Furthermore, jeffreyj on head-fi made a good point with the possibly erratic load of the K340, rulling out 47uf. So, i shot for safety with the BG.
 
Why aim as low as 10Hz?

I wonder, are headphones really able to produce 10Hz? or even 30Hz for that matter? I mean, in a manner one could really notice?

I don't like too much elcos at the output. And don't understand what's all that hype for Elnas, BGs, etc.

I had a couple Cerafines at a CF OTL headphone amp, and ok, there's bass certainly (dunno if it's there or is the cap adding some on its own) but there's also "graininess" in the mids.

Yes, I tried bypassing them with quality 1/100 musicaps, audionotes or generic quality MKPs (RIFA I believe) but the graininess didn't go. I also left them for time for "run-in".

Even worse, Panasonic FCs sounded and measured better. Slightly less bass (though cleaner) and much less "grain".

My point is: are going below 20-30Hz worth for headphones? As I see them: there's much benefit from using MKPs here, as they don't suffer from those distortions and will last forever without changing its sonic qualities, not to speak for prices, being cheap alternatives available.

I have now a couple SCPs (solens) 600V/47uF MKPs and they give the cleanest sound I¡ve listened through this amp. They cost about $19.

Wonder if using a cheap alternative like motor start types (they're usually up to 450V/25uF 5%), and even parallelling them will be on most aspects superior to those exotic ($130 for a cap? no way!) electrolitics.

Those caps run for about $6 at your nearest home electronic appliances repair shops (used on washing machines, refrigerators, etc).
 
here is the explanation i got for the need of the lowest as possible Frequency Corner (Fc) :

Well, part of the problem is bass rolloff, yes, but another part is the *phase shift* that accompanies it. At Fc (the corner frequency) the phase shift will be 45 degrees, approaching 90 degrees deep into the stop band (defined as one order of magnitude away from the cutoff frequency).

The phase shift vs. frequency graph is the tangent function, so small changes in Fc can result in surprisingly large changes in phase shift for frequencies between 0.1 and 10 Fc. To wit, the phase shift amounts at 20Hz for the Fc's you calculated, as well as the recommended 2Hz, are:

Fc = 5.9Hz; phase shift = 16.4 degrees
Fc = 4.8Hz; phase shift = 13.5 degrees
Fc = 2.0Hz; phase shift = 5.71 degrees
 
bulk for sure but...

Yes, the bulk is unavoidable :)

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.


I revised a post I did in the past regarding this and forgot that ratings go usually to 47uF max in the 400-500V range, but reach 330uF in the 220V range, which I believe is very suitable for medium to high Z headphone OTL amp output caps. No need to parallel...

They're usually below $6 a piece, so you probably can't beat those $12 for a couple of 330uF/220V MKP caps.
 
Electric home appliances spare/repair shops

Look for shops that carry spare parts (or repair) washing machines, refrigerators, and the like: i.e. knobs, handles, seals, pipe adaptors, etc.

I live in a "small" town (about 150.000 people) and there are a couple shops that carry this kind of things.

Those caps are used to start electrical motors...
 
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.