Well, I've only posted a few times and have no building experience but made two cool finds today that I thought I might share. I've read a lot and just haven't made a decision on what to build first.
My wife and I moved into a house built in 1961 about 2 years ago. One large room I've been using as a photography studio with plans on spiffying it up at some point. I think when the house was built this room was probably designed for entertaining and listing to music because it's got acoustic ceiling tile and this dampening fabric all over the walls. I'd like to eventually use this as my own listening room when I don't need it for my business any more. Anyway, today in an effort to fix a few of the ceiling tiles, I discovered hidden behind both ceiling tile and speaker grill, a pair of JBL LE8T's and JBL PR8's in quite good condition mounted in boxes that stuck into the crawl space above the room. The surrounds on both of the passive radiators are cracked, but the surrounds on both speakers are fully intact, with only a minor bit of glue on one where they glued the ceiling tile over the speaker grills, probably assuming the speakers were out of date and no good.
So, what should I do with them? They seem to be fairly rare as they are the alnico magnet version. I've got a quote at $50 a piece for re-foam and thought maybe I should do all of them, I don't know. The cones seem to be in good condition, just not real pretty, they are extremely rough in texture, didn't know if that was normal or not.
Secondly, I was down the street at an estate sale and saw two speaker cabs in the corner that were obviously from the 50's or 60's but had no markings of any kind. I could see enough through the grill to see that they had coaxial Pioneer speakers in them so I assumed they were car speakers stuffed in some old cabinets. Boy was I wrong. I bought them for $28 for the pair expecting to have some new car speakers for the doors of my vehicle as I had a friend that had accidentally kicked one in yesterday. Apparently the speakers are extremely rare especially in the English speaking world as I only got about 50 hits on Google, only 4 in English and none that showed any experience with the drivers. So, what should I do with them? They are dead mint.
Please see the pictures:
You'll see the sticker on the tweeter magnet has a Mitsubishi Logo on it. Hope someone finds these interesting.
Tony
My wife and I moved into a house built in 1961 about 2 years ago. One large room I've been using as a photography studio with plans on spiffying it up at some point. I think when the house was built this room was probably designed for entertaining and listing to music because it's got acoustic ceiling tile and this dampening fabric all over the walls. I'd like to eventually use this as my own listening room when I don't need it for my business any more. Anyway, today in an effort to fix a few of the ceiling tiles, I discovered hidden behind both ceiling tile and speaker grill, a pair of JBL LE8T's and JBL PR8's in quite good condition mounted in boxes that stuck into the crawl space above the room. The surrounds on both of the passive radiators are cracked, but the surrounds on both speakers are fully intact, with only a minor bit of glue on one where they glued the ceiling tile over the speaker grills, probably assuming the speakers were out of date and no good.
So, what should I do with them? They seem to be fairly rare as they are the alnico magnet version. I've got a quote at $50 a piece for re-foam and thought maybe I should do all of them, I don't know. The cones seem to be in good condition, just not real pretty, they are extremely rough in texture, didn't know if that was normal or not.
Secondly, I was down the street at an estate sale and saw two speaker cabs in the corner that were obviously from the 50's or 60's but had no markings of any kind. I could see enough through the grill to see that they had coaxial Pioneer speakers in them so I assumed they were car speakers stuffed in some old cabinets. Boy was I wrong. I bought them for $28 for the pair expecting to have some new car speakers for the doors of my vehicle as I had a friend that had accidentally kicked one in yesterday. Apparently the speakers are extremely rare especially in the English speaking world as I only got about 50 hits on Google, only 4 in English and none that showed any experience with the drivers. So, what should I do with them? They are dead mint.
Please see the pictures:
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An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
You'll see the sticker on the tweeter magnet has a Mitsubishi Logo on it. Hope someone finds these interesting.
Tony
But, seriously they look awesome, gotta do something special with them!
Nice find!!! Its that time of the year I guess. My dad answered a an ad on craigslist and scored. A laywer was clearing a house for client who had died and for 75 dollars got a nice fairchild turntable with an expensive tonearm and stylis, a pair of 15 inch dual concentrics, the first pair of koss headphones made, a marantz system consisting of an 8B tube amp, matching tuner, and preamp. Plus more tube stuff all of it mint with paperwork!!! I wish I had seen it 
Nice find though I like old jbl stuff.
Dan
Nice find though I like old jbl stuff.Dan
An 8B for $75 makes my story seem pretty weak. Anyway. I still haven't decided whether to build for only the LE8T's or both the speakers and PRs or just sell them, as OB experimentation is something I'm really interested in. Also, I've been using google to translate alot of what I could find about the Pioneers, and apparently they were in the orginal cabinets, which are really large with a huge port. The cabinets are approximately 4 square feet and the port is about 10 inches wide, 4 inches tall and 4 inches deep. Makes me wonder if they might not be a pretty good candidate for OB given their small magnet, relatively stiff paper surround and the box size. Maybe you guys with more experience could weigh in.
Maybe the rough texture is what makes them interesting.
I am curious how the JBLs sound, especially in the midrange.
The metal dome seems to be glued to the voice coil directly.
Could be a very interesting driver, has anyone specs for it or
can you measure the TSP ?
Found some specs:
http://www.jblpro.com/pub/obsolete/le8t.pdf
The drivers would be very interesting in an open baffle or
transmissionline Design.
Bass Reflex seems not that interesting because of the high
Qts.
Congratulations, they seem to be real high performance
drivers.
I personally would not use the passive radiators. Just sell
them, maybe you earn the price for the wood and/or some
saw blades for your project ... you lucky one.
Oliver
Your JBL system may have been a Lancer L44 -
JBL Lit
They also made a very shallow (under 5") & wide cabinet using the same drivers for inwall & inceiling mounting. I wonder if your was a factory cabinet?
Before you put new surrounds on them, make a stop to the uber-JBL forum Audio Heritage and ask about that. Yours are in such pristine condition that you want to be sure you are not destroying collector value if there is another alternative. The surrounds can be softened if they are stiff with brake fluid and I believe that cracks can be glued up & sealed. The "Lansalloy" surrounds are unique to JBL.
The Pioneer coax is spectacular and you got a pair? Just when I think all the good stuff is gone your post puts the wind back in my sails. Great scores & fortunately found by an enthusiast who knew what to do with them!
JBL Lit
They also made a very shallow (under 5") & wide cabinet using the same drivers for inwall & inceiling mounting. I wonder if your was a factory cabinet?
Before you put new surrounds on them, make a stop to the uber-JBL forum Audio Heritage and ask about that. Yours are in such pristine condition that you want to be sure you are not destroying collector value if there is another alternative. The surrounds can be softened if they are stiff with brake fluid and I believe that cracks can be glued up & sealed. The "Lansalloy" surrounds are unique to JBL.
The Pioneer coax is spectacular and you got a pair? Just when I think all the good stuff is gone your post puts the wind back in my sails. Great scores & fortunately found by an enthusiast who knew what to do with them!
Hi Guys, I just thought I would report back. I was a little resistant I suppose to try the JBL's as I was expecting to just plug them in and make sure they were working and sell them for something a little more complimentary to my amplifier, which is an EL84 based reworked Hamond done by a man named Jim Nicholls.
*Disclamer - I have no measuring equipment, so please take what I say with a grain of salt, however I would say I have a pretty keen ear having played various instruments for the last 20 years.*
So, I started off by putting a few hours on the Pioneer's, and while they look quite good, in their original enclosures I'm just not that happy with them. They seem to have a hump around 80 hertz where they really resonate, I don't know if this is caused by their resonant frequency or not. The BR enclosure seems to do little to increase their bass extension. Highs, despite having a tweeter are not that great and they aren't that smooth sounding. Actually, and not to sound like one of those high end audio writers as I feel a little goofy saying this, but the low mid range and high bass seem to sound turbulent, sort of conflicting and choppy. They were fun to play with and I'm sure somebody will be able to build them into something after they can do some measurements to find out what they are good at. Also, despite being rated at 8 watts, I've put all 17 or so of my tube watts into them and they just soak it up, don't seem to hear an increase in sound respective to the increase in power, I'm guessing they're just not that efficient and somebody with more headroom in their system might be able to get more out of them.
Back to the JBL's. Wow! They are rated at 89db SPL, I don't see how this is correct compared to other 89 or 90 db speakers I've heard, they will get really loud with 17 watts. I've got them mounted in H-Frame OB's made of edge glued pine. The baffle is 24x36 inches and the drivers are 16 inches off the floor. The openness and smoothness is really incredible.
I honestly wasn't that impressed with the specs of the speaker when compared to most of the modern full rangers and sort of wrote them off as another vintage collectible, but when listening those preconceptions seem to go away. The high end seems to all be there despite the specs showing there's little extension above 16khz. I usually have to EQ highs as I feel I don't hear highs that well on most speakers, but these seem to be pretty good. Also, I was quite surprised at the amount of bass these produce in OB, I was expecting to hear nothing, but they seem to roll off quite gently, I feel a little more naturally than other speakers I've heard and these are easily on par with my vintage Maggies (though those aren't really known for the bass reproduction either). I think now I'm starting to understand why these sell for so much on fleebay. They seem to be a really good all-around speaker. I don't think they particularly excel at one type of music, but they can go from Tomasz Stanko to AC/DC fairly well.
I'm still not sure if I'll keep these, but I'm very, very impressed with them. So if anybody else out there finds some in their ceiling, give them a try before selling them.
*Disclamer - I have no measuring equipment, so please take what I say with a grain of salt, however I would say I have a pretty keen ear having played various instruments for the last 20 years.*
So, I started off by putting a few hours on the Pioneer's, and while they look quite good, in their original enclosures I'm just not that happy with them. They seem to have a hump around 80 hertz where they really resonate, I don't know if this is caused by their resonant frequency or not. The BR enclosure seems to do little to increase their bass extension. Highs, despite having a tweeter are not that great and they aren't that smooth sounding. Actually, and not to sound like one of those high end audio writers as I feel a little goofy saying this, but the low mid range and high bass seem to sound turbulent, sort of conflicting and choppy. They were fun to play with and I'm sure somebody will be able to build them into something after they can do some measurements to find out what they are good at. Also, despite being rated at 8 watts, I've put all 17 or so of my tube watts into them and they just soak it up, don't seem to hear an increase in sound respective to the increase in power, I'm guessing they're just not that efficient and somebody with more headroom in their system might be able to get more out of them.
Back to the JBL's. Wow! They are rated at 89db SPL, I don't see how this is correct compared to other 89 or 90 db speakers I've heard, they will get really loud with 17 watts. I've got them mounted in H-Frame OB's made of edge glued pine. The baffle is 24x36 inches and the drivers are 16 inches off the floor. The openness and smoothness is really incredible.
I honestly wasn't that impressed with the specs of the speaker when compared to most of the modern full rangers and sort of wrote them off as another vintage collectible, but when listening those preconceptions seem to go away. The high end seems to all be there despite the specs showing there's little extension above 16khz. I usually have to EQ highs as I feel I don't hear highs that well on most speakers, but these seem to be pretty good. Also, I was quite surprised at the amount of bass these produce in OB, I was expecting to hear nothing, but they seem to roll off quite gently, I feel a little more naturally than other speakers I've heard and these are easily on par with my vintage Maggies (though those aren't really known for the bass reproduction either). I think now I'm starting to understand why these sell for so much on fleebay. They seem to be a really good all-around speaker. I don't think they particularly excel at one type of music, but they can go from Tomasz Stanko to AC/DC fairly well.
I'm still not sure if I'll keep these, but I'm very, very impressed with them. So if anybody else out there finds some in their ceiling, give them a try before selling them.
Ah yes the LE8T's. I too had the fortune of stumbling across a pair of the Lancers in a dark and mysterious alleyway one night about 20 years ago. They are indeed a wonderful driver. After fooling around with them for a few years, the surrounds packed it in. Somewhere between thinking it and doing it, one of the cones was destroyed so I decided to inquire about recones. That's when I got the shock of my life. Each driver was quoted as $300 USD per. Well after changing my underwear, I realized no way in hell was I going to do that so they ended being donated to a fellow who turned and ran as soon as I said "free to a good cause" I hope they found a good home but I guess I'll never know as this individual seems to have vanished from the face of the earth. Steve Jove if you happen to run into him.
Cheers on the good score!
Cheers on the good score!
I thought I might post one more time after a few days of listening with the Pioneers.
I wasn't quite ready to give up on them and have been playing with the cabinets a little trying dampening them which helped quite a lot, but the biggest and best improvement came when I moved them in the room. I previously had them placed toward the middle of the room with the listening position against a wall. This was a huge mistake and mislead my judging them. My room is also quite hard even though it's got acoustic treatment on the walls and ceiling mainly due to a tile floor. I drug a large rug in and it made a large difference also. I'm not sure what I was hearing in the other position, but the actually do extend very low and they've smoothed out since repositioning them and adding the dampening material. Even though I felt the JBL's would out do them in the bass department at first, I think now the Pioneers are easily as good and the problem with the lower midrange has been extinguished, and I'd even be so bold as to say they are smoother than the JBL's in this area, which is pretty remarkable. I've also just figured out that the tweeters cause the high end of things to be very directional, so much so that just a couple of inches off-axis can cause a total loss of the very highest end of the reproduction, way more so than the JBL's. Getting the Pioneers to ear level made a HUGE difference. I'll likely build a cabinet in the future with the same volume and port size (of course filled to the brim with dampening material) but much taller as the original cabinets are quite low and squat at around 30 inches high by 20 inches wide and 13 or 14 inches deep.
Overall, I felt like it was my duty to report these are actually quite good speakers if not a little picky as to their placement and my first report may have been a little premature. So, if somebody finds some beat up old cabinets with a gigantic port behind the grill and gold coaxial tweeters showing, it might be worth a purchase at a garage sale.
I wasn't quite ready to give up on them and have been playing with the cabinets a little trying dampening them which helped quite a lot, but the biggest and best improvement came when I moved them in the room. I previously had them placed toward the middle of the room with the listening position against a wall. This was a huge mistake and mislead my judging them. My room is also quite hard even though it's got acoustic treatment on the walls and ceiling mainly due to a tile floor. I drug a large rug in and it made a large difference also. I'm not sure what I was hearing in the other position, but the actually do extend very low and they've smoothed out since repositioning them and adding the dampening material. Even though I felt the JBL's would out do them in the bass department at first, I think now the Pioneers are easily as good and the problem with the lower midrange has been extinguished, and I'd even be so bold as to say they are smoother than the JBL's in this area, which is pretty remarkable. I've also just figured out that the tweeters cause the high end of things to be very directional, so much so that just a couple of inches off-axis can cause a total loss of the very highest end of the reproduction, way more so than the JBL's. Getting the Pioneers to ear level made a HUGE difference. I'll likely build a cabinet in the future with the same volume and port size (of course filled to the brim with dampening material) but much taller as the original cabinets are quite low and squat at around 30 inches high by 20 inches wide and 13 or 14 inches deep.
Overall, I felt like it was my duty to report these are actually quite good speakers if not a little picky as to their placement and my first report may have been a little premature. So, if somebody finds some beat up old cabinets with a gigantic port behind the grill and gold coaxial tweeters showing, it might be worth a purchase at a garage sale.
Darn you and your expectations Cal!
You wanted me to actually READ what you said before judging your actions?!
Cal, what sort of alignments did you try with these? I just got an LE8T pair in very nice shape. They're playing in old Lancer 33 cabs (where they were when I got them) and the midrange is.... WOW.
I don't know what more to say. The instrument separation is superb, the tonality is spot-on, the highs are much better than I expected (but could still use a supertweeter, AND a sub) but that is one amazing speaker.
Wish I hadn't had to pay for them, but at least I didn't overpay. 120 the pair refoamed in 04.
You wanted me to actually READ what you said before judging your actions?!
Cal, what sort of alignments did you try with these? I just got an LE8T pair in very nice shape. They're playing in old Lancer 33 cabs (where they were when I got them) and the midrange is.... WOW.
I don't know what more to say. The instrument separation is superb, the tonality is spot-on, the highs are much better than I expected (but could still use a supertweeter, AND a sub) but that is one amazing speaker.
Wish I hadn't had to pay for them, but at least I didn't overpay. 120 the pair refoamed in 04.
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