The problem with most NB built-in sound cards is that they normally do not have stereo line in normally required. So if you can find one that has stereo line in, then it should work even if not perfect.
Many built in soundcards have some kind of latency, so the impulse location might not be at zero, this was my experience up to V14.
Many built in soundcards have some kind of latency, so the impulse location might not be at zero, this was my experience up to V14.
Very few laptops have an internal soundcard suitable for measurements with any software. Most measurement programs require a full duplex soundcard which can record on both channels while playing a signal. Most people use an external soundcard with a laptop. Firewire seems to have th least amount of issues with measurement software compared to USB.
The real problems with Soundeasy and soundcards has been the XO emulator. Not all of the soundcards drivers function the same way with the WDM drivers and that has caused some issues with some cards, especially as you try to emulate XOs with more speakers for example, a pair of three ways. I use a desktop PC for my measurements and had zero problems with measurements with soundcards ranging from a cheap soundblaster card to the M-Audio card I have now. After Chrtistmas I will be getting a netbook and external soundcard for some measurements, tough I anticipate my desktop will still be used most.
Regards,
Dennis
Thank you for your answer.Both notebooks seem to have a small 3/16 line in that I assumed was stereo. I will double check.
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Also verify that the input is not the mic input. Most measurment software uses the right and left line in, not the mic input.
Also the soundcard has to be capable of full duplex.
Regards,
Dennis
Thank you for your answer. I know little of notebooks. I suspect an external soundcard is the way I will be going, at least for testing purposes. Is there some attachment you can use to put a PCI soundcard into and connect to a notebook, or do you know of a good external soundcard which can connect to a notebook?
Is firewire a necessity or just desirable? Both notebooks seem to have USB ports, and I suspect firewire compatible notebook will raise the price, so please let me know if firewire is mandatory as opposed to desirable.
Ouch! That single mic input is exactly the case with at least one of the inexpensive notebooks I had in mind. I don't know about the other. It even is the case with the inexpensive Sound Blaster USB input "improvement" sound card I saw at Best Buy. I thought that single mic input issue might cause trouble, and now it is clear it will.
I asked the guy at Best Buy about full duplex sound cards, and he gave me a blank stare.
Just for the heck of it, which notebook are you looking at?
I don;t know of any notebook that has stereo recording inputs. But I have used a USB sound card often with my laptop.
No problem, never heard a dead horse complain. 
Yes, the Audigy II USB works fine for measurement. I run in the 24 bit, 96K mode most of the time. This is not a great box, but good enough for speaker building. If I were starting from scratch, I probablly would make another choice.
I use an M-Audio Buddy for my mic preamp. I really wish to combine the preamp and A2D into one box to reduce the noise and cables. I use the mic preamps 1/4 mic inputs for my probes as well so I have gain adjustment outside SE and I eliminate one possible tiny miss-match as the mic and reference probe are using the same preamp. If you are wondering why 96K, it is because I am investigating tweeters, DAC's and amps. Just for characterizing a woofer, 24K is fine. Unless you are doing tweeter comparisons, 24 bit or 96K are overkill for speaker design work. 16/48 is fine. WT-2 is a great product too. Really easy. Very accurate. But it really only does T/S parameter measurements. I have spreadsheets for my box modeling. Unibox is very good too, and of course WinISD.
The limitations I have found in my setup are that the Audio Buddy is very sensitive to overload and I should have bought a calibrated mic to start with. I had to make some very short shielded cables to connect things. Noise everywhere. I just finished putting all my wall-warts into a steel rack box and running a single power cord with shielded AC and DC supply cords to the various boxes on my bench. All the computer stuff is fine, but plain old lab practices matter too.
I use ZALESCOPE for an o-scope, several generators, and am just playing with HOLMImp.
Like I said, it works, but when I have the funds, I plan on a higher end A2D. I would like to have VU meters, but even the Firewire 610 does not. I may just build my own the way I want. Note SE can function like a digital crossover if you have enough OUTPUTS. I believe it can do 6. Handy as final voicing should always be done in stereo in a listening room. It can control a Bheringer DCX as well. I have one but have not had time to play with it as a D2A.
Note that the accuracy for T/S parameters is not as tight as WT-2, but it is more than tight enough for speaker building.It is within the thermal changes of the drivers. Another issue is there seems to be no standard on how to measure Le. Everyone is different and none match the OEM. Only important for modeling if you intend to use the drivers inductance as part of the network in simplifying the system. Even then, the model is just a starting point. You will still need to spend several sessions the old way, measure the results and voice by ear. The model just saves several prototypes.
I support SE, I use it. But it took several weeks of playing with it. Many give up. My reason for getting it was for tweeter and midrange CSD plots and the crossover modeling. Importing impedance or response plots can be done, but I wind up having to manipulate the data in excel, export to text and then edit the header info to make it match the formats it does like. Pain, but I have gotten RTA and WT2 plots into it. Better do it their way and just accept the SE measurements. The SE documentation, though copious, is not that helpful. The WEB forum is. Again, it takes some commitment to learn SE, but in the end, it is a very powerful tool.
Yes, the Audigy II USB works fine for measurement. I run in the 24 bit, 96K mode most of the time. This is not a great box, but good enough for speaker building. If I were starting from scratch, I probablly would make another choice.
I use an M-Audio Buddy for my mic preamp. I really wish to combine the preamp and A2D into one box to reduce the noise and cables. I use the mic preamps 1/4 mic inputs for my probes as well so I have gain adjustment outside SE and I eliminate one possible tiny miss-match as the mic and reference probe are using the same preamp. If you are wondering why 96K, it is because I am investigating tweeters, DAC's and amps. Just for characterizing a woofer, 24K is fine. Unless you are doing tweeter comparisons, 24 bit or 96K are overkill for speaker design work. 16/48 is fine. WT-2 is a great product too. Really easy. Very accurate. But it really only does T/S parameter measurements. I have spreadsheets for my box modeling. Unibox is very good too, and of course WinISD.
The limitations I have found in my setup are that the Audio Buddy is very sensitive to overload and I should have bought a calibrated mic to start with. I had to make some very short shielded cables to connect things. Noise everywhere. I just finished putting all my wall-warts into a steel rack box and running a single power cord with shielded AC and DC supply cords to the various boxes on my bench. All the computer stuff is fine, but plain old lab practices matter too.
I use ZALESCOPE for an o-scope, several generators, and am just playing with HOLMImp.
Like I said, it works, but when I have the funds, I plan on a higher end A2D. I would like to have VU meters, but even the Firewire 610 does not. I may just build my own the way I want. Note SE can function like a digital crossover if you have enough OUTPUTS. I believe it can do 6. Handy as final voicing should always be done in stereo in a listening room. It can control a Bheringer DCX as well. I have one but have not had time to play with it as a D2A.
Note that the accuracy for T/S parameters is not as tight as WT-2, but it is more than tight enough for speaker building.It is within the thermal changes of the drivers. Another issue is there seems to be no standard on how to measure Le. Everyone is different and none match the OEM. Only important for modeling if you intend to use the drivers inductance as part of the network in simplifying the system. Even then, the model is just a starting point. You will still need to spend several sessions the old way, measure the results and voice by ear. The model just saves several prototypes.
I support SE, I use it. But it took several weeks of playing with it. Many give up. My reason for getting it was for tweeter and midrange CSD plots and the crossover modeling. Importing impedance or response plots can be done, but I wind up having to manipulate the data in excel, export to text and then edit the header info to make it match the formats it does like. Pain, but I have gotten RTA and WT2 plots into it. Better do it their way and just accept the SE measurements. The SE documentation, though copious, is not that helpful. The WEB forum is. Again, it takes some commitment to learn SE, but in the end, it is a very powerful tool.
Wow! A lot of information that helps to clear things up. I think I have a handle on what I have to get now. Thank you all for your time.
One more question. I gather that firewire is better than USB because it does not have a delay that USB does, is that correct? If I go a little higher in price for the notebook and get one with a PCMIA slot, and a duplex sound card for that PCMIA slot, will that eliminate the delay the USB has and make the setup able to make improved high frequency measurements?
One more question. I gather that firewire is better than USB because it does not have a delay that USB does, is that correct? If I go a little higher in price for the notebook and get one with a PCMIA slot, and a duplex sound card for that PCMIA slot, will that eliminate the delay the USB has and make the setup able to make improved high frequency measurements?
You could try ETF 5 (ETF Acoustic Measurement Software). It's more intended for room measurement, but I have used it occasionally to measure speaker responses (either using a close mic and a time gate, or out in the garden )
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